Making Our Voices Heard with Fusion Voting (Hour 1)

On Location, it's the Todd Alba Show.

And now, pursuing truth wherever it may lead, here's your host, Todd Alba.

Across Wisconsin on the Civic Media radio network and streaming worldwide on the Civic Media app.

Good afternoon, everybody.

We are on location here.

Todd Albaugh with you from Black River Beach Neighborhood Community Center in La Crosse, Wisconsin, on the banks of the Black River, one of the backwaters to the Mississippi River, along with Mr. Aaron Zommers, our producer and engineer at the Old World Headquarters of Civic Media, back in Madison on State Street.

Welcome in, everybody.

It is Wednesday, the 6th of August, 2025.

It is a great day to be a Wisconsinite, and it

is... Pump

Day!

Look at that the camel has made it all the way here lacrosse on the banks of the Black River Zabers the wind was very calm as we set up and about 10 minutes before we came on the air It's picked up a little bit.

How are our conditions down in in Madison?

Not too bad He's still hazy as or smoky rather as expected, but hopefully that clears out in the coming days

Well, hope yeah meteorologist pretty low is saying that hopefully these winds start to clear out some of this smoke for the wild

fire is out west and conditions will continue to improve.

But weather is is absolutely fantastic.

In fact, one of our guests, Dale Schultz, commented its beach weather, but not many people go to the beach anymore.

He is a former lifeguard, little hitherto unknown fact on the beaches of Madison.

We'll ask our ongoing friend and contributor here, also the host of Mornings of Pat Cridelow every morning from six until nine.

Patrick, I know you're a captain of a pontoon boat, a link with soda.

Were you ever

safeguard.

No, no, no, both my daughters were they

at

the YMCA pool here in Chippewa Falls.

I'm very proud of that.

But no, I've got them to rely on in case anything goes awry with the pontoon.

And by the way, nothing ever goes awry.

on the pontoon.

No, I

know.

What do they say?

The best, the two best days of a boat owner are when you buy it, when you sell it.

Yeah, yes.

But you know what?

The ones in between ain't so bad either.

Right, right.

I've seen it.

It's a beautiful set up, Pat Scott.

Busy Shelf.

Glad everybody is here today at hour number two.

Brian Van Hooker of cracked.com.

I'm going to bring us some of the lighter side to side.

The old series, the animated series, King of the Hill.

Going to be going back and doing a little reminiscing on that.

Also a goofy what's first for you in our two some state news as well, but want to begin today the reason that we're here and by the way our friend Trig V. Olson senior advisor to the Lincoln Project.

I talked to him this morning.

He's at a beach in Lithuania, so supposedly he's joining us.

He may pop in at the bottom of the hour as well, but want to get to why we are here today.

Really, really important seminar just wrapping up here on the inside of this beautiful community center in La Crosse having to do with fusion vote.

It was sponsored by Leader Ethics, and here joining me at the table on the banks of the Black River in La Crosse is from the Leader Ethics, Mr. Lee Rosh, who is the former president of Western Technical College, and former Senate Majority Leader Dale Shultz, who is the co-chair of United Wisconsin.

Lee, Dale, how the heck are you?

But great.

Thank you.

It's great having you both here.

Of course, Dale's put on the show several times.

Lee, you were on the program last summer when we were down in Varroqua at Wonder State Coffee.

So great to have you back on.

Thanks for joining us

today.

I'm delighted to have this chance.

It's our pleasure.

Lee, let's start with you.

Tell folks a little bit about Leader Ethics, what it is and what your mission is.

Leader Ethics is a nonpartisan, non-profit organization that is committed to promoting ethical leadership among elected officials.

And the four cornerstones that we promote actively are we expect ethical leaders to be truthful, to be transparent with public information, to be a unifier rather than a divider, and to work to the best of their ability to represent their entire constituency.

And you know, those are things in business, education, health care.

Those are almost normal expectations.

And our question is why not among political leaders as well?

Yeah, really appreciate that.

Dale, again, you've been on the show several times.

Of course, your co-chair at United Wisconsin is former Democratic Sheriff for Dayton County, Dave Mahoney.

He had to get on the road, another engagement, as they say.

But tell folks briefly the mission of United Wisconsin, Dale.

Well, United Wisconsin is a group of people.

who believe that we ought to be able to as citizens freely associate with whoever we want during elections and that we believe that the major political parties have failed in their mission to provide a mechanism so that people can have a voice through them about the issues that are important to them and that we need to have

real solutions advance on behalf of all of us so as a result of our feelings we have decided that fusion voting which allows well first of all I should mention that fusion was a part of this country for decades and it led to the birth of the republican party in fact many many years ago in rippon wisconsin but it's a way of giving people who are

Left out of the political process agency within that process To be heard to influence what goes on and the way we do that is by saying that when you vote You are basically have the right to vote for a candidate You don't have to be constrained by a political party and what fusion allows is for the same person to be a candidate for multiple political parties and when the election is over

Those votes are tallied jointly to determine the winner.

Now why this works is because in Wisconsin, for example, we have elections decided by, you know, just a couple of points, election after election.

If a group of passionate people were to form a party,

and want to have influence, all they have to do is turn out five, six percent, and they might be in a position to determine who the winner is going to be.

And that candidate would be a fool not to listen to them after an election unless, of course, they only wanted to be there one term.

And the more people that do this, the more likely the candidates, the political parties, would have reason to

Be dependent on extreme voices in their ranks both political parties So those people who are worried about not voting because it doesn't make a difference throwing away their vote on the third party that they know will never have a chance or Voting for the lesser of two evils suddenly now have a person they can believe in who can be an agent to help change The other partnership that that they have

to work on issues they care about.

One of the things I like about this is that, you know, a minor party

at least finds a way to get a toehold in here.

So at first, maybe the Alba Party, which I'm a proud member, would simply endorse a major party candidate.

But as more people see, the Alba Party is more in keeping with their line of things.

Maybe someday when there's a candidate from that party conveniently named Todd Alba, they might be inclined to now support that minor party.

Though my question to the guests, I just simply want to repeat what has been noted in the associates.

press in the wisconsin public radio article where a republican party of wisconsin spokesperson said fusion voting could result in voters being quote manipulated into voting for a major party candidate masquerading as an independent and i want to give your guests a chance to respond to that

well any system committee could they can work to the parties probably will work to try to distort its impact but

The thing that we have to look at, though, is that we're talking about appealing to voters, and the voters are the power behind it.

Now, this wasn't involving fusion voting, but it's a good example of how powerful third parties can be.

If you remember in the 1990s, at the time, George H. Bush was running against President Clinton, that essentially, the third party candidate at Ross Perot was the individual who was pounding away on the message of removing the deficit

reducing the debt.

And he showed graphs on the screen, and he really, really found it with that.

But the thing is, it got 20% of the voters in the presidential election to listen to it.

And both of the presidential candidates from the two parties were forced to recognize that it was a legitimate issue that people were concerned about.

Well, guess what?

Those are four years that we had our federal budget was balanced.

Now, in the recent budget dialogue and activities going on in Congress,

That was not on the radar at all.

There's no one pushing for anything other than what the two parties are bringing forward.

And that's why I think fusion voting does give that voice.

that's not being heard today, a chance to be heard.

We're talking with Lee Roche, a former president of Western Technical College and now with Leader Ethics here in Wisconsin.

Leaderethics.us.

You can find the seminar today at their website.

It was streamed, but you can have that there.

We'll put the link in our website as well.

And also a former Senate Majority Leader of Wisconsin, Republican Dale Schultz, also the co-chair of United Wisconsin with former Democratic Dane County Sheriff Dave Mahoney.

Dale, what to Pat's question there, the current iteration of the mongering.

Republican Party, which you were not a part of that.

But of your party now, you're saying that basically trying to poo-poo fusion voting, what's your thoughts?

Well, I think that when I was involved in trying to change the whole notion of gerrymandering and bring some sense to that process that occurs every 10 years, the political parties had both participated.

They liked having that power.

They didn't mind playing the lottery until they lost.

We know that engaging people is the best way to move forward.

Think about this, and it's a point that occurs to me because we started this program talking about this beautiful setting that we're in and it being a beach day.

On the banks of the Black River here.

In the last election, who was the spokesperson for the environment?

There wasn't one.

Not strongly.

You make the argument that former Vice President Kamala Harris really talked more about it than Donald Trump, but in the state of Wisconsin, I'm not sure

who.

I don't know that I have

the same feeling you have that Kamala Harris was the best spokesperson or inadequate spokesperson.

But imagine the people who care about the environment and they're everywhere.

If they had a chance to be engaged in an effort to have a environmentally based party, they could make the difference in the election by having their votes

fused with another party or multiple parties, and they would have agency at the table to drive change.

And that's what this is all about.

As a former Democratic state senator, what Dale's saying there, I mean, you've been in the building more recently.

Well, as recently as Dale and I, do you think that's possible?

What Dale just said to the current political environment?

in the current political environment, it's a heavy lift.

But again, when you see so much dissatisfaction, part of the reason people voted for Trump, not that they loved anything about Trump, but they just said, we're so desperate to fix this system.

I hate to put something in place out of desperation, but if it fixes an unworkable system, which other people have broken, well, then I think we might be more inclined to get to that point, maybe not this year, but soon.

We're coming up about a minute here at Dale.

I want to get your thoughts quickly on this.

Lee, when we come back from you, what's happening, right?

You brought up redistricting.

You were very involved with this for former Senate Majority Leader Tim Cullen and Bob Jowk on the Democratic side.

Bob Jowk was on this program a couple of days ago, and he said regrettably that he would say

that Democrats have to fight fire with fire and the places like California and Illinois should look at at least consider partisan gerrymandering to counter what may happen in Texas.

Your thoughts in one minute or less.

I think the fact that we're having this discussion is very disheartening because I think there are a lot of us who believe there is a better way.

On the other hand, it's pretty hard to argue with people who point out that if you don't fight fire with fire, you look like a chomp.

You alienate your voters and we go backwards.

I hope

that this discussion about what is a political nuking of the process drives people back to their senses.

That's what I can hope for, and that's how I feel about it.

Back from Black River Beach Park here in the Blue Cross, Wisconsin, we are on location of the Town Hall Ball Show.

Lee Rosch, Dale Schultz packed quite low, and will Trigby Olsen beam in from afar.

Don't miss it.

Come on back after this.

It says you've got to stand for something, or you'll fall for anything.

You've got to be your own man, not a puppet on a string.

And never compromise what's right, and uphold your family name.

Oh, you've got to stand for something, or you'll fall for anything.

Welcome back to the Towel Ball Show.

We are live on location just outside of downtown La Crosse, Wisconsin.

quite on the banks of the old Mississippi River on the back waters, which is the Black River.

Equally as beautiful here.

We are at the Black River Beach Neighborhood Center.

You can see the beautiful location here if you're watching us on YouTube, Facebook or Twitter.

And of course we welcome all of our listeners across the Civic Media Radio Network across the state of Wisconsin.

Joining me this hour, packed quite a little host of Up North News radio every morning from six until nine across the network.

And joining us from

We'll say a secure undisclosed location.

Trig V. Olson, senior advisor of the Lincoln Project, has beamed in.

Trig V. will get to you in just a bit here, but you look very comfy today.

I'm very comfy.

Good.

There's a lag apparently across the ocean there.

Well, it's a long ways across the Atlantic.

Yes, it is More importantly our guests here at the table at the Black River Beach Neighborhood Center talking about fusion voting Here we have Lee Ross who is the former president of Western Technical College in these days with leader ethics a great group here Which was the main sponsor of today's fusion voting conference or seminar just got over you could watch the seminar seminar if you missed it at leaderethics.us leaderethics.us and a big

Big shout out to Penny, who is a viewer, a listener of our show.

She heard us plug this a couple days ago and she said that's how she found out about it.

So that was very nice.

And we also have former Republican State Senate Majority Leader Dale Schultz, a Richland Center who is the co-chair of United Wisconsin, who is the co-sponsor of today's events.

And he is the co-chair with former Democratic Sheriff of Dane County, Dave Mahoney.

Lee, I want to go back to you here at the top of this segment.

I pose the question to you or to Dale.

Want you had to have a kick at it as well.

I know you're someone who also believes in you know, maybe bullies in fair maps and in Wisconsin, but what do you make of what's happening in Texas?

Donald Trump calling on Governor Abbott to do intentionally gerrymandering the maps to a five-seat pickup for Republicans now Gavin Newsom saying that he may do the same thing in California for the Democrats now former moderate Republican Arnold Schwarzenegger who

Set the example when Dale was still in the state Senate in Wisconsin for having a nonpartisan Commission in California said I'll be back.

He's coming back to fight what Newsom is doing.

What are your thoughts on all this?

It's sad Nick I gotta be honest because really what's happening is this is a significant step further in the wrong direction and it makes it harder to try to turn things around down the road.

So there's no getting around.

I think we need to talk about it as a concern.

We need to take action to raise those questions among Democrats and Republicans.

But you know, you can't be surprised if they do this, but I gotta tell you, it's not a good sign and we can't be silent as citizens.

We've gotta speak out against it.

We just have

to.

Yeah.

Pat Crightlow.

Just one more question on the news coverage of this.

Lee, it notes that your group United Wisconsin is suing the Wisconsin Elections Commission to reinstate

the practice.

I was not aware that it once was the in practice here in Wisconsin.

Can you share a little bit about the history of fusion voting here?

Well I can.

Dale mentioned earlier fusion voting started with our foundation of our nation and it was used all through the years up to the turn of the 20th century.

It was the process that was used

in Ripon, Wisconsin to form the Republican Party.

It brought together the Whigs, the Free Soilers, anti-slavery individuals, and they all came together, and that was the foundation of the Republican Party.

But it worked on the other side of the aisle as well, because following the Civil War in North Carolina, an African-American slave ran for Congress in 1865, and he won.

And he won because he had

not only former slaves and other African Americans and Republicans who were supporting that, but also poor white farmers who felt neglected by the whole process.

And so, in both cases, there was really good success using fusion voting.

However, both parties, both parties were concerned about the threat that it brought to their party strength.

And state by state, they eliminated it with the exception of New York and Connecticut.

Dale, just a couple of minutes left.

Joe, let's pick up what we just said.

I mean, it worked for you.

I know that you've said several times your former Senate district in Southwest Wisconsin was a purple swing district.

And you often said if I was to be strictly partisan, I couldn't keep getting reelected.

Let's pick up what we just said.

We've seen this in Wisconsin individually, but fusion voting kind of puts it out there and available for everyone.

Well, it does.

And you know, it's about again, giving people hope.

by giving them agency and how I conducted myself I believe gave people hope they knew that if they came and they talked to me I would in fact listen and they saw examples of where in fact at times I would admit I was wrong and changed my mind or I was influenced by some priority they had or something they had to say

I think that's what we expect from the political process and what Fusion Voting will do is enhance that by giving people an agency that they haven't had since Fusion Voting disappeared.

Trivia also now is involved in the United Wisconsin as well.

We could pick up after the bottom of the hour with him.

But to Pat's point, there is a lawsuit going on right now on this, correct?

Yes, there is.

Do we know the status of it?

Is it before appeals court or Supreme Court?

Where are we at?

Well, I'm not an attorney so I'm not going to opine.

I'm smart enough to know that.

But, you know, it has been filed and we'll wait for the courts to tell us.

All right.

Very quickly.

Tommy Thompson, the state fair on TMJ this week was asked as he's running for governor.

He said he hasn't decided yet.

One of our viewers yesterday said they thought Dale Schultz and make a great governor.

Dale Walter Schultz.

Are you running for Wisconsin governor in 2026?

Let

me just

let

me just let me just say I hardly agree with with your listener.

But I am not a candidate and don't plan to be a candidate.

I think

it's time to be as different than enough.

Well, you know, you got me there, Todd.

I just have to be candid and upfront about it,

but

time for a new generation.

All right.

Pat Kratlow.

Mornings of Pat Kratlow.

Every morning from six until nine.

Lee Rush from, uh, from Leader Ethics and Dale Schultz from United Wisconsin.

Thank you, gentlemen.

We appreciate it.

Come on back from La Crosse live with Trigby after this on the Pacific Media Radio Network.

Welcome

back to the Towel Ball Show live on location from La Crosse, Wisconsin on the western shores of the state of Wisconsin.

We are on the Black River at Black River Beach.

Neighborhood Center, a great community center here in La Crosse.

Behind me, you can see the Black River flowing into.

It's got the backwaters of the of the Mississippi River here at La Crosse.

Great to have you along with us.

We are here covering fusion, voting.

Many thanks to Lee Roche from Leader Ethics who is one of the co-sponsors.

of today's forum here at the Community Center on Fusion Voting, and also to Dale Schultz, Co-Chair of United Wisconsin, to Pat Crite-Loe, host of Mornings at Pat Crite-Loe every morning from six until nine, and now joining us from across the ocean in a secure undisclosed location.

Trig V Olsen senior advisor to the Lincoln Project our ongoing contributor and friend and also is part of the United, Wisconsin So we want to continue our discussion of fusion voting here.

I thought that was great Trig V and to hear two people two leaders particularly from Western, Wisconsin like Lee Rosh and and Dale Schultz just

talk so knowledge will be about that.

When you hear it from those two, you think, well, yeah, it has to make sense.

But unfortunately, modern day politics gets in the way.

Well, I agree that modern day politics can get in the way.

I think United Wisconsin has hit on, which is why I'm glad that I've been able to play a small role in helping those guys.

They're talking about core issues beyond just fusion voting, which is quite frankly part of the solution.

They're talking about issues that people care about.

They're talking about public education that are the cornerstone of our community.

They're talking about the Wisconsin idea.

They're talking about conservation.

They're talking about the things that have always made Wisconsin great.

that have somehow become political footballs and that quite frankly I would argue if you know you've got all these people thinking about running for governor you want a blueprint for a winning gubernatorial campaign it's right there in what was united wisconsin pushing and backing

I want to go back to the web.

By the way, it's a great website.

If you really want to do a deep dive, folks, on Fusion Voting, go to United Wisconsin.

It's all spelled out, not WI, but the full word Wisconsin.

So, unitedwisconsin.org and Zomers, if you'd be so kind, we'll put that link in our show notes as well.

But unitedwisconsin.org.

I want to read you just a couple of sentences here and then trigger me.

Let's get into this a little bit more.

It says Fusion Voting was once

everywhere in American elections, including Wisconsin.

The historic electoral concept is just as relevant in today's political landscape and could be implemented at both the federal and state levels of government.

Here's how it works.

Fusion voting permits more than one party to nominate the same candidate, with votes for that candidate first being tallied separately by the party before being

fused, quote unquote, together to a final total.

A candidate who appears on the ballot as the nominee for one major political party could also be listed as the candidate of a second potentially more centrist political party if that second party also nominates them and the candidate accepts their support.

The fusion voting allows people to vote for the candidate they favor and do so on the party line that best represents their values.

And instead of being spoilers, small parties can play a more constructive role in our politics giving voters more choices while not asking them to quote unquote waste their vote on a candidate that can't win.

So let's put that down there where the chickens could get at it a little bit.

And Pat did a good job in the first half of this hour, but I just wanted to reset it up and get your thoughts on this, uh, trick me as someone who has run statewide and, uh, national, uh, helped run national elections for president.

So if I'm getting this correct as a party united Wisconsin, so let's say let's just use my forward boss for a second Let's say that the dale shows who shows would?

Hypothetically run for for governor, and he said you know what I'm not gonna I've always been a Republican so I'm gonna run as a Republican But I know I never get the Republican nomination so he could run as Republican but a Centrist party Let's just say United, Wisconsin could say well we want Dale Schultz to be our nominee as well and they

could also nominate Dale, he could accept that nomination.

So on election day, people that wanted to vote for Dale under the Republican ticket as they have many years ago could do that.

But people that say, I want nothing to do with modern day Republican MAGA politics, but I will vote for Dale based on his record as a United Wisconsin candidate.

and all of the votes for Dale Schultz on both Republican and the United Wisconsin ballot would count for him.

Not double votes, but whoever voted under one party and the other.

All those votes would count for Dale.

Do I have that right, Trigvie?

You have that 100%

right.

That is exactly how it will work.

As Lee was pointing out, the Republican Party is the reason that the Republican Party was launched in Wisconsin was fusion voting.

And quite frankly, the irony is the Republican Party and the Democrat Party, after the Republican Party came about, sought to get rid of fusion voting because they understood that it becomes something that allows smaller parties to grow and become a threat.

The two-party system in the US has been a duopoly for the last 150 years.

and it really hasn't been challenged and there are so many obstacles to trying to do that.

I think it's a great point because as you know this as you've traveled around the state what we hear so often from people in Wisconsin is we're just sick of both parties you know we're tired of the fighting and I think fusion voting is a great way and I'll use the cliche

you know to address a problem without throwing the baby out with the bathwater in other words you can you can still have both major parties and people can still run under those under those tickets but there's also this more centrist hypothetically united wisconsin party that that could help bring people together answer me this trig v as someone who's won elections more than i have so so let's do a person that is nominated by

a fusion party or a centrist party under fusion voting.

Does that person automatically get to advance to the general or do they still have to stand in a primary election?

No, well, I mean, the way a fusion voting works is right.

It doesn't really impact primaries.

So let's say United Wisconsin, you know, nominates Dale and ultimately the Republican Party doesn't in the primary.

He would still be a candidate of United Wisconsin.

But where it really comes into play, United Wisconsin could say, we're going to be a good housekeeping seal of approval on the candidates that are going to stand for the Wisconsin idea, that are going to stand up for public education that's the cornerstone of our small towns.

It's going to stand up for conservation and things like the Mississippi River Partnership.

And say, you know what?

It's a Republican here.

It's a Democrat there.

And nominate those.

And those candidates could accept that nomination.

So we had one of our listeners Troy in Mount Hora, listening on WMDX of Madison says, Trig V, why is fusion voting better than ranked choice voting?

Well, I would say this, having worked in a lot of places, both around the world and across the United States, and this is just me personally, I think ranked choice voting becomes very, it becomes kind of confusing for voters, quite frankly.

And I first encountered ranked choice voting working overseas.

And I know they have it in Alaska and some other places.

But the reality is fusion voting is pretty straightforward.

And it has a tendency, I believe, to empower the center of the electorate far more than ranked choice or open primaries, jungle primaries.

at some of the other sort of things.

And you're kind of seeing that play out across the country, right?

In Alaska, where you upper Frank Choice in California, where you have jungle primaries, you're really not getting more gravitational pull towards the center.

What fusion voting allows is for a party.

And I think that's what Dale and Lee and Dave Maloney and the others who are driving fusion voting are talking about is really those things that unite people in the center.

And the reality is, if 6% of Wisconsinites said, you know what, we're going to go with fusion parties, and fusion became the law, United Wisconsin becomes that good housekeeping seal of approval.

And in places where you have the Republican and Democrat parties nominating extremist candidates, there's nothing to stop fusion from nominating somebody who's going to stand for the center.

And you know, theoretically, do you think this could be passed or not passed by, I guess, approved via the court system and ready to go for the 2026 election?

Because the scenario that you just laid out there, you know better than anybody else.

Boy, I mean, even three or 4% of these points, let alone five or six, that's the governor's race right there.

Yeah, 100%.

And I think it would cause, it would force the parties to pause.

and think a little bit before they nominate people where both sides are saying, you know, neither choice is great for me.

But it would also give the potential, where I really think that it has the potential to be powerful, is down ballot and state legislative races.

I want to go back to what you just said about giving parties pause before they nominate.

Our mutual friend Bill McCoschian, Republican strategist, former Thomson administration official, Tommy Thomson administration official was on this show.

I lost track of time a week or two ago.

Whatever evers dropped out.

And McCoschian said, for our side, quote unquote, meaning the Republican side, that the Trump endorsement in the Wisconsin gubernatorial race is everything.

that that basically that whoever Trump nominates, that's going to be a Republican nominee, which to me is completely undifficult because really they're all whether it's Tom Tiffany is probably going to get in and got Josh Showman from Washington County executive.

You got Barry and the so-called business guy and who else knows who's going to get in.

But these folks that they really care about Wisconsin voters, all they really care about is Donald Trump.

Yeah, I mean, 100 percent news is saying, I mean,

I've said this before, Todd, and I am of the understanding you alluded to this when you were talking to Bill.

There's three people that I've said so far, maybe there'll be some more, that I would walk back to Wisconsin to help them if they ran for governor to knock on doors, Bill McCauchon being one of them.

Kelderoy's, those who are listening, she's another one.

They couldn't be further apart on a lot of political things, but I'll tell you what, both of them, along with Ben, who's the third one,

Wichler, they stand for things like exactly what United Wisconsin is talking about.

They're going to stand up for the University of Wisconsin system because they understand that job creators like Epic are a result of the computer science school at the UW.

They understand that the University of Wisconsin Eau Claire is the driver of the essential driver of the economy and is producing

future doctors through their partnership with Mayo Clinic I mean Mayo Mayo Clinic that we learned about when we when we talked to Jim Jim Schmidt, right?

Like they get that they get that the public schools are the cornerstones of our small communities they get that conservation is critical whether you somebody who cares about the environment or you're somebody who cares about the environment because you want good places to fish and hunt Like yeah Go ahead

No, I mean that's the key

We're gonna we're gonna pick that up for with Trigby Olsen senior advisors Lincoln Project also of United, Wisconsin after this Come on back we're live in the banks the Black River in La Crosse, Wisconsin across Wisconsin on the civic media radio network

Music.

Blasting out of Trigby Olson's cassette deck in his 1978 Buick as he went through the streets of downtown La Crosse during Oktoberfest.

That's the music from the tape deck back in the day.

Did you ever drive down from well Clare to La Crosse to party Trigby Olson as he joins us from across the pond as they say in Europe?

Yeah, I was at Oktoberfest once.

Do you remember it?

No.

I

knew the answer to that.

I

remember going.

I don't

remember much after I got there.

We are live on location.

I remember there

were a lot of nursing students from what's the name of that school?

Viterbo.

Viterbo.

Yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

That's not the

last thing I remember.

What?

That's it?

Yeah.

Black River Beach Neighborhood Center is where we are at on the banks of the Black River.

That is the backwaters of the Mississippi River here in beautiful across Wisconsin.

We're here covering the Fusion Voting Seminar sponsored by United Wisconsin, of which Trig V. Olsen is a part and also Leader Ethics.

You can find today's forum if you missed it at LeaderEthics.us.

was a really great one-hour seminar.

It's a quick watch.

You learn a lot.

Lerash was there.

Dale Schultz was there.

Other people as well.

And would encourage you to do that.

Trigby, you're being joined by your assistant now in Overseas, the lovely and talented Oula.

She called me and I thought she was an AI because her UK accent was so good.

She's like, this is Mr. Olson's assistant.

Thank you

You can say Tigers were live on the air Have a great day.

All right very good Thank you very much appreciate that I want to give you a thoughts on this here before we let you go Because you right before the end there you were really doing in my opinion a great job of saying what

candidate anybody wants to win wisconsin next year for governor or any other race in wisconsin the core issues that people believe in uh... our colleague our friend jane matt nair on matt nair on air this morning along with greg bach under their show had jose pecky democratic strategist of course he ran for the chairmanship of the democratic party wisconsin lost in a close race to devon a remaker but zepecky said this but he brought this up on jane show this morning and zepecky said look

Donald Trump ran on lowering prices and bettering the economy.

Neither one of those things are true six months in plus two to his presidency and Democrats would be wise to keep focused on those two things and reminding voters in the state that what Donald Trump ran on was a lie and it's not coming true and not getting distracted by what's that woman's name, the gene woman.

Zoe Zoe is singular.

I well, what is it somers?

Do you remember what it is?

It's the it's the hot thing right now

But I know I don't follow this.

She's a

hot thing, but I don't

The topic is a hot thing, but yeah, I guess if you bet if you bat for that team That's also a thing is this young model who's who says she's a conservative and got into an American genes That's right there Sidney Sweeney got into this jeans ad and now and now the left is the far left is all up and arms over this Oh my gosh She's wearing jeans and she has an ad campaign and and social influencers on the left

I this is real I showed the Zomers this I think yesterday that there's one influencer on the left who is who is guilt going after this campaign

simply because it's blue jeans.

And how blue jeans were repressive to blacks in this country.

And yes, if you go way back to the Indigo and the cotton trade, you could find some interesting and unfortunate history, but to somehow connect that with American Eagle and this campaign, I think that's bonkers.

And it's exactly why it's so easy for MAGA and Donald Trump to look at the other side and say, see how crazy these people are?

I think the peck is right.

Trick me.

100% he's right.

I mean, the bottom line is, listen, the governor's race, the center of the electorate is sitting there thinking inflation hasn't gotten better.

Are there cars going by or what is?

Yeah, sorry, I'll trouble my motorcycles, those crash rocket things, it's gonna be

crazy.

The bottom line is the economy is not getting better.

The engine that drives the economy in a place like Wisconsin is things like our public education system, the University of Wisconsin system, conservation in the environment, and Main Street business.

That's what drives the economy is the workforce is driven by that sense of community and the education.

The bottom line is,

The center of the electric cares about that.

They don't really care about the blue jeans stuff.

And falling into that trap is just a waste of time.

Yeah, I couldn't agree more.

I really was appreciating what Zipecki was saying on Matt Nair on air this morning.

We encourage everybody to go back and listen to that podcast.

Listen to Jane Gregg's entire interview with Joseph Pecki, because I think he's absolutely

right.

By the

way, Todd.

Yeah.

Did you see that Derek Van Odd one and Jim Jordan are having some kind of rally in Wisconsin Rapids?

Oh, for goodness sake.

Are you serious?

Yeah, sir.

By the way, for people who haven't seen it, there's a, I don't know if it's the Netflix or HBO or one of those streaming things.

If you have kids like who was age, you have a gajillion of them.

Anyway, there's a really amazing movie about what went on at Ohio State when Jim Jordan was there.

Amazing.

It was an unfortunate way

to watch that and not yet in a really bad way.

But.

Like, I don't know how you can watch that without being incredibly sympathetic and come away thinking that Jim Jordan is even a remotely good human being.

No, he's a terrible individual.

And the fact that Derek Van Orden wants to associate him with him is ridiculous.

And on the way up here, and I was driving by Bangor, and there's a digital billboard with Van Orden's picture that says Van Orden, release all the Epstein files.

So there's that.

Well, they should.

Right?

Exactly.

100%.

All right.

Be well over there.

Give the family my best.

Wait a minute.

Are

we playing this or that?

Well, come on back.

We'll give you a quick answer to that.

What versus next in hour two we're live on the Cross on the Civic Media Ready Network.

On location, it's the Todd Alba Show.

And now, pursuing truth wherever it may lead, here's your host, Todd Alba.

On Cross

with Scumson on the Civic Media Radio Network.

and streaming worldwide on the Civic Media app.

Good afternoon, everybody.

Todd Albaugh along with Mr. Aaron Zommers on the board back at the World Headquarters in downtown Madison, Wisconsin.

We are live on location at the Black River Beach Neighborhood Center right on the shores of the Black River.

which are the backwaters to the Mississippi here in La Crosse, Wisconsin.

Welcome everyone to hour number two of the program.

It is Wednesday, the 6th of August, 2025.

It's a great day to be a Wisconsinite and it is pump day.

There you go.

The camel made it in the back of the truck all the way here to a beautiful La Crosse, Wisconsin, right on the western side of the state.

It's a beautiful day here.

Perhaps you can hear in the background, the cicadas, they're horny.

Is

that what it

means, Amrits?

When they're singing so loudly, they're in heat, or they're breathing, they're mating?

Yes, that is my understanding.

And actually, if you want to attract them, all you gotta do is make some clicking noises.

Like, if you start snapping, they'll just fly and start landing on you.

Yeah.

Really?

I wish it were that easy.

That's all you gotta do is click.

All right, well we'll see we'll see we can keep the the horny cicadas at bay here in our number two joining us all the way from The the European continent will say and across the pond in a secure undisclosed location He is the senior advisor of the Lincoln project a river falls boy just up the road here in Western, Wisconsin And we love to have a long long Wednesday's mr. Trigby Olson trig

did you have a lot of, do you remember, like I'm growing up, I don't remember a lot of cicadas in Richland Center.

Did you guys have a lot of cicadas in

River Falls?

Never until I got to DC.

There was a good jillion of them.

Yeah,

I didn't really have many, many to walk in there.

They make a racket.

Yeah, they're they're they're probably hearing over the white gear a little bit, but they're loud We will we'll push on here glad to be here We are here covering the leader ethics event on fusion voting if you missed the seminar proper you go to leader ethics US leader ethics US

We thank Lee Roche of Leader Ethics.

He's also the former president of the Great Western Technical College here in the western part of the state, lacrosse being the center of it.

And also thanks to my former boss, former state senate Majority Leader Dale Schultz, the co-chair of United Wisconsin, which is also a co-sponsor of today's forum, and also former Democratic

Dane County Sheriff Dave Mahoney, who is also part of the Co-Chair of United Wisconsin as well.

And a special shout out to the wonderful and talented Christine Dininger Andrews.

Nobody more talent to the Chris Andrews getting it done helping coordinate all this.

She is the executive director of United Wisconsin and Trigby Olson is also a part of United Wisconsin and as well coming up at the bottom of this hour will be joined by Brian van Hooker of cracked.com with a retrospective piece on King of the Hill, an animated series from what the late 90s or I guess maybe 2000s.

Did you watch that Trigby King of the Hill ever?

Yeah, I've saw a couple

three

episodes.

Domers, were you a fan of King of the Hill?

Yeah, it's very good in my opinion.

And it's just about- It's not still

on

though, right?

That's the thing.

It wasn't.

It ended in, I'm 2010-ish, maybe a little later than that, but now they are making new episodes, which I imagine is why we're talking about it more now.

All

right.

Very good with the seat.

That's that's why we got the young people exorberance around.

That's fantastic.

All right.

So a fan hooker is coming up at the bottom of the hour.

We're going to get to what's worse in a minute.

But Trigvie, I know how much you enjoy your adoring public.

And so listening in the first hour here was Steve in Milwaukee, listening on WAUK.

Steve says, hey, Trigvie, you need to get more progressive.

Neo liberalism is killing the middle class.

No,

I'm just All right,

Steve can Steve can have that one.

All right, very good before we do what's worth the trick me I did want to get to work

waiting for Scott and Wauwatosa to write me, but he never does

Did you did you I was disappointed that you didn't pick up on my tweet from over the weekend on that subject.

Did you see that?

No, I didn't

go on Twitter anymore.

I know

Is it because of Elon or you just don't like it or what?

Yeah, I do.

I'd post my substack stuff on Blue Sky,

which is

equally challenging.

I don't know.

I

just, yeah, I still have my, yeah, I just haven't.

He's got other things he's got other things going on.

He's got other fires in the kitchen to put out I want to ask you about a couple of things on the serious side or semi-series speaking of your old of your old friend the former governor, so a former governor Scott Walker He's still trying to be relevant out there and after what's happened down in Texas with Governor Abbott Republican Genuflecting politically to Donald Trump Trump asked him basic not base He did say I need five more Republican House seats house

president of seats out of Texas.

So Abbott is trying to bring the legislature back into the special session in Texas and redraw the lines.

This is outside of the normal 10 year redraw based on censuses and wants wants to help Trump out.

So Scott Walker.

And of course, the Democrats, many of them, the legislature in Texas, have fled to Illinois, much like some of the, or all of the Senate Democrats did in the Wisconsin State Senate during Act 10 to temporarily block Scott Walker's atrocious Act 10 bill, in my opinion, which decimated public unions, in particular, public education.

So Walker tweets out over the weekend when, I guess, actually a couple of days ago, he says, when 14 Senate Democrats fled Wisconsin,

in an attempt to block our positive reforms, we held on one and stayed strong.

After our victory, Sean Duffy and his wife gave me an amazing bumper sticker that's a good reminder to hang in there.

And he posts the bumper sticker and it says, one walker defeats 14 runners.

Haha.

So I tweeted back at the governor, I said, and yet governor Scott Scott Walker, when you walked into the closed Senate Republican caucus and unveiled your secret plan, I was in the room.

Many GOP senators were not only shocked, but repulsed only my former boss at Dale Schultz 17 had the balls to stand up to you.

And in word and vote, correctly predicting quote, what we are about to do here is create two school systems, one for the haves and one for the have nots unquote.

More importantly, Dale spoke for the overwhelming majority of his district after holding countless public meetings, listening to thousands of his constituents in southwest Wisconsin.

He also maintained a lot of communication with Senate Dems, trying for a bipartisan compromise.

Finally, you governor and Mike Hipsh tricked Dale into coming into your office so

Fitts, i.e.

Scott Fitzgerald, could call for the vote to split the bill and pass it.

The Democrats ultimately bought time to expose your scheme, which brought 100,000 people to the Capitol in protest and eventually led to ACT Governor Evers defeating you.

Why?

Because as our mutual friend, Attrigvielson, is fond of saying, quote,

Scott never learned the lesson that ACT Governor Tommy Thompson taught me.

There's two kinds of politicians, those that want to do things and those that want to be.

And Scott just wants to be.

Nothing's really changed since we went to Badger Boy State together when he was running for president back then, unquote.

Ultimately, Scott, you didn't defeat anyone or anything except for your dreams and opportunities of our public schools and your own personal ambitions to actually be someone.

Oh, that's good.

I like that.

You like

that?

Yeah.

Yeah,

really good.

I

would

call

it.

I didn't

misrepresent you.

I didn't I didn't misrepresent you there.

No, you didn't misrepresent me.

I mean,

honestly, I. Whatever, Scott, you

know, I know, I know.

I did I just it's we have an ongoing kind of funny thing with Scott Walker, but the more important part is this redistricting Trig V what are your thoughts on this and JP Pritzker the Hot the hot the commodity in the dem side right now Everybody loves JP Pritzker the Democratic governor at Illinois He was on Stephen Colbert last night on the late show and Colbert had a map of Illinois congressional maps and he held it up and I believe I could dial it up, but I think Illinois has two of the top

five most gerrymandered districts in the country on the democratics are all in total but they happen to be on the democratic side and instead of Pritzker owning that

and being like, hey, look, we have work to do in our state as well.

And I'm pledging to do that in Illinois to make fairer maps and then go on to attack Abbott and Republicans in Texas.

He tried to make some joke about it, saying, yeah, you know, in Illinois, we just give our maps to kindergartners and they draw it.

But what's happening in Texas is so much worse.

I think Prisker is a terrible representative for this issue, Trig V. I think by not acknowledging that Democrats have done partisan gerrymandering as well, makes him unqualified.

to be the spokesperson on this.

I would agree with that.

I mean, I didn't see him when he said it.

At the end of the day, this is just a sad moment for the United States, right?

I mean, it's just, guys storm beaches at Normandy for us to have a normal process.

And then we're a generation that's decided to act like we're

some third world banana republic and that's you know what donald trump is doing the bottom line is donald trump is at thirty nine percent approval just go out and beat him i mean yeah they're gonna try and rig the maps the bottom line is donald trump's gonna try and do everything he can to not hand over power to a democrat congress the easiest way to beat him is to go out person by person and and and

you know, talk about things like the economy.

What is inflation better now?

You've got the hardcore Magus who will tell you everything's perfect since Donald Trump came into office and inflation is gone.

But most people are feeling the bite of it.

Go out and and and and just swamp them.

There you go.

Trivia Olson, senior advisor in Lincoln Project.

All right.

It is 15 minutes past the hour of three o'clock.

Time once again for what's worse.

Let's

go.

time once

again for what's worse no prize money give away no lovely prizes involved simply your chance to have your voice heard across all 10 news talk sports stations the civic media that work across the state of Wisconsin we are here in the cross at the Black River Beach neighborhood center

I'm feeling hungry to drink V before after the show here I never eat a big one so I eat after the show and So today's today's category timely timely indeed as Mike Lucas has fond of saying all right here we go today's category What's worse?

Restaurants that don't have waffle fries are restaurants that only have waffle fries

eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five two eight five five rather seven five two four eight four two try one more time eight five five seven five two

4842.

You could also text us on the Civic Media app.

If you don't have it, go to your Apple or Android device and put in Civic CIVIC Media.

It'll pop up.

It takes less than a minute to download.

It is free.

It's what Gail King at CBS calls a deal.

The Civic Media app.

All right, Trig V, restaurants that don't have waffle fries or restaurants that only have waffle fries.

What's worse?

Only have waffle fries.

They're the kind of places that have hamburgers with fried eggs on them.

You don't enjoy a hamburger with a fried egg?

I don't eat eggs.

Oh my gosh, that's right.

I forgot.

And waffle fries?

Yeah, that's what waffle fries say to me.

Kind of place that would put a egg on your hamburger.

I'm a

simple

man,

Todd.

I want my

French fries to look like French fries.

But you're

not a freedom fry kind of guy.

No, I'm

fine calling them French

fries.

Good.

Good.

What's worse, restaurants that don't have waffle fries or restaurants that only have waffle fries, 855-752-4842 or text us on the Civic Media app.

We'll come back, answer those important questions and more.

We are live on location in La Crosse at Black River Beach Neighborhood Center on the Civic Media Ready Network.

We're ever it may lead and having fun doing it.

Welcome back to the title ball show on the civic media ready to work real live on location in La Crosse, Wisconsin on the banks of the Black River at Black River Beach Neighborhood Center right in the midst of cicada mating season.

You can hear.

Is it coming through the mics, Zomers?

Most

definitely.

It was definitely easy.

I'm sorry.

I apologize.

You know, of all the, you think when you go on the road, you think, well, you got to have, you got to have electricity and we travel with the battery pack as well as we have electricity here at this neighborhood center.

And then you got to have open sky for the satellite.

And we got that in mind things to check off.

Now I'm going to have to add, is it cicada mating season where we're going?

I mean, there's not much you can do about that.

And it's not.

Yeah.

Just

you know, we're we're we're surrounded by horny cicadas.

What can we say?

All right, what's worse?

Restaurants that don't have waffle fries or restaurants that only have waffle fries 8 5 5 7 5 2 4 8 4 2 8 5 5 7 5 2 4 8 4 2 and you can text us on the civic media app Robert in McFarlane

listening on WMDX says, I can't remember the last time I was offered waffle fries.

I was fairly recently, somewhere I met with Jane and Greg and I were we're doing a road trip.

One of the restaurants had that as an option as an option.

What else do we have here?

Linda listening in Middleton on WMDX says only having waffle fries is worse.

I prefer chips.

No fries.

Now, Zomers, if you had that when you go in and I'm not talking like, you know, free to lay or whatever, I'm talking when you go in and the place makes their own.

Yeah, when they

have like their

own kettle chips, those are very good.

Oh, yeah, those are fantastic.

Agreed.

Megan in some prairie listening to the MDX says good fries are not defined by their cut.

But a sad fry is usually an indicator of a bad restaurant.

Okay, very good Matt listening in Richland Center over a great great UPS drivers there says that only waffle fries is worse any fries are overrated and only ordered by people who still eat ketchup Grown up and order the cheese curds grow up.

I was at that cheese curds now look now Matt, you know how much I appreciate your listenership I I respectfully disagree some of the best fries that I've ever had and continue to have

If you're in Madison, Matt, go to go to a Dottie's dumpling dowry on campus on you've been there for summers or not.

Oh, geez, we got to go there for lunch.

Dottie's dumpling dowry on on Francis Street on campus.

Order yourself a burger and the fries.

They're they're a hand cut fries made from fresh taters, spuds right there.

It's they're they're fantastic.

And also look, I

not going to get any argument for me.

I love a good cheese curd, but I don't think that every fries terrible.

Yeah, they're different things.

And I love potatoes and fries are potatoes, believe it or not.

So I love them as well.

And I think you don't necessarily need ketchup for fries to be good.

You can either do different sauces or depending on how they're seasoned, you might not need any.

But also, and look, I'm just going to say it, I'm a brand kind of guy that comes to ketchup.

I want the Heinz.

I want the Heinz ketchup.

I don't want a sure fine or anything like that because there's a difference.

There's a difference.

What's worse, restaurants that don't have awful fries and restaurants that only

have Waffle Fries, 855-752-4842.

855-752-4842.

Robert in McFarland listening on MDX as the Parthenon on State Street has the best fries of all time.

I haven't had those in years, but I remember them being.

They're the

like beer battered fries.

I don't know if they're

beer

battered, but where they're extra crispy, they're very good.

Yeah, I agree with that.

Kurt Beckham Madison on MDX says, good fries should have malt vinegar, not ketchup.

Look, I love a good malt vinegar as well.

I'm just, I'm, I'm an open, I'm an equal opportunity fry kind of guy.

What's worse, Zommern's restaurants that don't have fries are waffle fries are ones that only have waffle fries.

You know, I think with what you said about being an equal opportunity fry kind of guy.

think I I'll say this with the caveat that I love waffle fries and I think that the texture of them and the way they can break open and have more like the

potato is more

apparent and I'm here for potatoes I love that but if they only have waffle fries I mean what about sweet potato fries those are amazing

well that you all good sweet potato fries okay as well I I'm gonna go because I do like variety

You know, Tom Raisbeck, one of our old workers in the Schultz office.

Raisbeck used to say, Todd, life is all about options.

Options.

So I'm going to say restaurants that only have waffle fries is worse.

It looks like we have Ted and Appleton on the line.

Oh, Ted and Appleton.

Ted, thanks for calling in.

Quickly, restaurants that don't have waffle fries or restaurants that only have waffle fries, what's worse?

As it has to be restaurant, but it be

no

certain red and white Convenience store that used to have waffle fries and they don't make a fries anymore

Really they don't I didn't know that they discontinued.

You know, yeah

Why is that?

Did you

I?

Nobody can give me an answer for sure

And

I don't

know Don.

And I don't know Don that low personally.

So I can't.

Well, we're in lacrosse where a hop is getting a jump from the headquarters, right?

We should go over.

And here's the thing.

Follow your target to him.

Tell him to bring back the

waffle fries.

The jalapeno poppers and the waffle fries a quick trip.

All right, we can ask.

Yeah, here's the thing My advice ten next time you go to a quick trip and you fill up I love a good quick trip when you go in and they say see you next time look at them and say not until you get the waffle fries

back

Alright, thanks, Ted.

I appreciate your listenership.

Keep her between the lines there.

Have a great afternoon.

Thank you very much.

Alright, very good.

Great edition of What's Worst.

We'll be back with another one tomorrow at the old headquarters in Madison.

Stay tuned.

Coming up next, Brian Van Hooker with a look at the reboot and the past from King of the Hill.

Come on back as the all-ball show on location in the cross on the Civic Media.

Ready Network.

Welcome back to the Taddleball Show live on location here in beautiful lacrosse, Wisconsin in the banks of the Black River.

the backwaters to the Mississippi River.

We are the Black River Beach Neighborhood Center.

We were here the first hour covering

The Fusion Voting Seminar, many thanks to the hosts who put this on today.

Leader Ethics here in Wisconsin led by Lee Rash and also the United Wisconsin folks, co-chairs Dale Schultz and Dave Mahoney, many thanks to them as well.

And to Trig V. Olsen, time to lighten things up just a little bit here and many apologies that it's only gotten worse summers as the show has gone on.

in the background, I'm not sure if they enjoy some afternoon delight, if that's the height of the mating period for cicadas, but it's gotten louder as the show is going on.

Have you been able to hear that?

Yeah, when we first connected, I wasn't hearing it, and then just slowly, every segment, it's getting louder.

I'm fearful that at any moment I'm gonna turn around there's gonna be a cicada right behind me looking to well anyway moving on time once again to bring back one of our favorite people from the great folks at Cracked.com join us via stream yard on one of the great reporters writers there Brian Van Hooker Mr. Van Hooker how the heck are you?

It's so hard to hear you talk over the cicadas

It's nice to talk to

you too.

I assume that's what you're asking.

Yes, yes, yes.

I said you could plan for a lot of things, electricity, satellite coverage, Wi-Fi, you know, cover, you know, so you don't get rained on or whatever.

But I never considered, wow, I should check to see what the cicada made him.

Hard to

cover for biblical plagues.

That's

really

the...

Those are harder.

But these are the times we live in.

Uh, remind folks about a while since you've been on the show.

Glad to have you back.

Remind folks, uh, uh, where you're at and how you got into writing for, uh, for cracked.com.

It'd be so kind.

Yeah.

Uh, I have, uh, I'm the senior features writer at crack.com.

I've been there for a few years now, two or three, three, maybe I used to write for a place called male magazine.

And when they shut down, uh, I had done a piece about the, uh, the onion there, nine, 11 issue.

And I knew some people who.

connected me over at Cracked and it kind of just worked out and I've been there ever since and I do lots of like pop culture reporting lots of um some listy stuff things like that but also like lots of interviews things like that like we had a big thing for king of the hill uh like you know right now we as the return of the show so I talked to like the showrunner and a few of the stars and the writer so like it was really um those the kinds of things I do there so

It's a great segue here into A King of the Hill.

This is an animated series.

Was it on Fox, right?

It was on Fox back in the day.

Now it's

on

Hulu.

Oh, now it's on Hulu.

So I mean, you know, full disclosure.

I saw maybe, I don't know, a dozen-ish full episodes, another dozen-ish partial episodes.

It's not familiar, but for people that might not remember the show, fill people in the premise of King of the Hill when it ran originally and what's bringing it back.

Well, I mean, the premise is kind of like, there's not a huge premise to this show.

It's about this guy, Hank Hill, who lives in Texas, a fictional town in Texas called Arlen.

And it's just about him and his friends and his family.

this very kind of low concept show that basically could have been live action had they wanted to but it just it ended up being an animated show and it's from Mike Judge who did Beavis and Butthead and Office Space and Yeah, it was just a great show that lasted 14 seasons it went away in say 2013-ish maybe give or take and had been gone since and

After years and years of talking about a reboot maybe I think like eight years when we first heard about a potential reboot It came back and it was great.

I'm somebody who's kind of not always for these Reboots and re sequels and everything just because I feel like I don't need and listen on to the same thing, but I Tell you that if for fans of the original I'd be very surprised they weren't Happy with the new one because it's great.

It's really strong

So, and keep me honest here, because I don't want to bring politics too much into this, but the title character here, the main character of the patriarch of King of the Hill, he seems like he could have been kind of a borderline MAGA guy, kind of an outdoors macho dude, but also slightly self-aware enough to doubt himself as well.

Is that an overreach?

I mean, I would say they specifically don't get directly into his politics.

in the show um it's clear at least especially in the old version that he is definitely a republican um but if you know if i were to have to categorize him anywhere where he is now it's much more common sense much more maybe like a never trump her kind of thing it's hard to say exactly they specifically kind of avoid that but not in a way that feels forced but um yeah i mean he's definitely a kind of maybe more right than left but also or at least

what that used to be, not so much what it is

now.

Also, very much like common sense, do the right thing, don't be mean to people.

So in a way that was like very common sense back then feels a little bit more partisan now, which seems

strange.

I mean it is strange.

We're talking Brian van Hooker senior features writer at cracked comm about his articles here.

All right, Bob van Hooker Let's get into first one here Hank Hill's best grilling related burns on King of the Hill

Well, I mean Hank Hill is a character who is like his job is at least back in the original take he's retired in the new version He was a seller of propane and propane accessories He was very

fervently in favor of propane and no other source of heat for grilling.

So this one article I did was just a collection of him throwing shade at other sources of cooking.

I mean, a big one is charcoal.

There's an episode of the show where his family members secretly get hooked on charcoal and start like eating char grilled meats behind his back and he's very upset about it, feels betrayed.

All right, here we go.

You brought charcoal into our house.

I didn't know what it was.

Luann asked me to hold it for her.

I thought it was drugs.

They're soot under my boy's nails.

You don't get that from a clean burning fuel.

You don't get the rich smoky flavor either.

Shut your mouth.

Now, we're gonna sit here and pray.

and kill from a king of the hill here on charcoal.

Now this is funny to me in particular because last night I had to go down to beautiful Monroe, Wisconsin and friends and I went together and we bought a quarter steer and a quarter hog and we had to go to Hoasley Meats and pick up the meat and then we took it to Curt and forced his big freezer and Curt says let's grill a fresh burger and he has a gas grill but he's back into charcoal.

And he has a tank of propane and like a flamethrower.

I guess he uses it on weeds and he fired that son of a gun up and the thing was on fire and ready to go in like three minutes.

It was crazy.

And I hadn't had a charcoal burger in years.

And to the point of the character there, it does taste better.

I gotta say, I really like I'm fine with both.

But I mean, I do really love a good charcoal burger.

Like something that's just a little bit burnt.

I really love that.

That flavor is great.

Yeah.

All right, next item here.

I was

going

to

skip ahead.

There was a great episode of the show that also featured George Foreman, the late George Foreman, where he had a guest appearance in the show where Hank kind of.

Was polite but also made clear that he didn't take George Foreman's grills all that seriously So that was another one where he kind of pokes fun at George Foreman's grill anyway I'll let you guys play the

foot.

All right.

Here's a king of the hill on the George Foreman grill How'd you feel about carrying my grill in your shop?

Oh?

Sorry, we have a strict policy about that

No novelty grills.

Novelty grill?

Yeah, you know, no offense, but your grill is kind of like an iron.

You call it my grill, an iron?

I've been hit below the bell before, but nothing like this.

I think it's a great product for dieters or little girls who want to play barbecue, but you can't compare it to a propane-powered grill.

Fights on!

What?

No.

I said, fights on.

What's the matter?

Smelling all that propane causes your brain damage?

That's what it does, you know.

No, that is not accurate.

Those studies were all done on sick monkeys.

And at least my grill hadn't sold in housewares.

Thank you.

And was that actually the late great George Foreman doing his own thing?

That was him.

He got to give

him some love for like being so willing to poke fun of himself because that

was

definitely him.

Well, and that was the thing about George Foreman is, I mean, he used to go on Letterman all the time and he was a salesman.

It didn't matter whether it was self deprecating.

Hey, if it was selling more of his product, he'd do it, right?

Oh, yeah.

He was, he was a character for sure.

He was, he was very good spirit in that one for sure.

There are also an episode where he pokes fun at Mesquite with his neighbor.

I'll just leave that one to Hank, but that wasn't

very fun too.

All right.

Very good.

Here's Hank Hill on Mesquite grilling.

Howdy, Khan.

Howdy, howdy, howdy.

Here you go.

I thought you might enjoy 7.5 gallons of pure premium propane.

Are you kidding?

No, I cook with mesquite.

Give meat a nice taste of wood.

And I cook with propane.

Gives meat a nice taste of meat.

Thank you.

Very impenetrated on his grilling there.

Yeah,

and then there's another example of this.

This is the thing I sincerely agree with and whether or not it's okay to have a burger well done or a steak well done for that matter.

So this was Hank's take on that, which of course, obviously it's not okay.

Like that's your ruining it.

So here we go.

Hank Hill on burgers.

Here we are.

Firm but with a little give.

Yep.

These are medium rare.

What if somebody wants theirs well done?

We ask them politely yet firmly to leave.

That's really funny.

See, I'm somebody who does not like my meat well done, nor my burgers.

But anyway, I like

a medium

rare.

So that's a good way to because then you can taste the flavor of the meat.

Otherwise, I mean, you

rare everything pretty much.

I'm totally well chicken, no.

You want to make sure you don't want pink in the middle of your chicken.

My bacon

I can throw welds on as well.

Right, exactly.

What else do we have anymore on this particular story, Brian Van Hooker?

No, no, no.

If you want to know more about Hank, I mean, that's sort of him in a nutshell is his love

for

propane is his like, it's a running joke throughout the series, but it's very sincere with the character, his love for propane.

And it is much cleaner and easier to do.

You just fire up the old propane grill and you're set to go.

Brian VanHooker of Crack.com, a senior feature writer there at Cracked.

I'm going to come back here in a minute and talk about the other article, Brian.

Four times King of the Hills Dale Gribble was mostly right about a conspiracy theory.

Now is this from the old, the original show or is this something new with the new show?

The original show, yeah.