Whatever Trump Says, We Are Not Being “Invaded” (Hour 1)

From the Civic Media World Headquarters in Madison, Wisconsin, it's the Todd Alba show.

And now, pursuing truth wherever it may lead, here's your host, Todd Alba.

Across Wisconsin on the Civic Media Great Network.

and streaming worldwide on the Civic Media app.

Good afternoon, everybody.

I'm Tom Allbaugh, along with Mr. Aaron Zommers, our producer and engineer.

It is six minutes past the hour of two o'clock on this Tuesday, June 10th, 2025.

It is a great day to be Wisconsinite.

Outside here, downtown Madison and State Street for the world headquarters of Civic Media.

Overcast skies.

Those Canadians keep on smoking.

No, no, it's the wildfires the Canadian wildfires Still burning and that is affecting Wisconsin weather air quality advisories out for some places if you're susceptible to Asthma emphysema that sort of thing might want to consider staying inside or wearing a mask gonna continue for a few days I have it's gonna was it last year's armors of the year before it was just that I think it was last year constant smoke

So anyway got pretty bad.

They got pretty bad not quite as bad as them Hopefully it doesn't but otherwise looks like a pretty nice day throughout Wisconsin so enjoy it gonna be a little what whether I think coming in and then Not really summer summer temperatures till next year next year till next week I think in the 80s, but all at all not too bad at all big show coming up today in hour number two at 330 just thereafter Brian van Hooker

of Cracked.com that a while since he's been on the program, gonna be great to have him here on the show.

Always makes us laugh and feel better.

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I've seen some, yeah.

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his best take my wife jokes according to his wife, Joan.

It's a lot of great, of course, Rodney Dangerfield filmed the great movie back to school right here in Madison on the UW Madison campus.

I did not know that.

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also haven't seen it.

If you, check it out.

It's a, have you ever gone to what the, I think it's the graduate hotel on campus just off of Langdon.

There's the bar there is called the Triple Indy.

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So Brian Van Hooker gonna be here lighting things up in the last half hour of the show at 3.35.

Also in hour number two, what's worse today is category pizza.

Chicago style or Detroit style?

We'll talk about this later, but until 30 minutes ago, I was not aware there was a Detroit style pizza.

I was, but I didn't know what it meant.

We'll get more into that in our number two.

Coming up here in just a few minutes, going to be joined by our friend ongoing contributor, two-time chair of the Democratic Party of Wisconsin and attorney, a Navy vet and author, Matt Flynn, will be here directly.

And it's always great because Matt helps us figure out the the wackiness that is America American politics and specifically as an attorney all these things going on out in Los Angeles right now Lots of questions of whether President Trump has the legal authority to do some of this stuff calling up the military now full-time active military Marines Which by the way, nobody appreciates the Marines more than me

Nobody respects having had the honor and pleasure of working with active duty and veterans during my time working for a congressman great great folks But is what the commander in chief the current commander in chief doing sending them to Los Angeles is that in fact counterintuitive to the mission of the active duty military Gonna be talking about that.

I actually had the opportunity last night and this morning

to talk to some close friends who live in Los Angeles area, got some reporting directly from them, gonna be talking about and discussing that as well.

And also with Matt Flynn, while our attention is focused now on the West Coast, what's happening on the East Coast, specifically DC, and I'm not talking about the parade on Saturday, what else is happening that we're not talking about?

Not focused on.

Very likely could have a more dramatic effect on us here in Wisconsin than what's going on out in Los Angeles specifically Trump still saying he has to pass the Budget bill That is not a sure thing yet.

What are some of those implications us senator Elizabeth Warren?

Doling out some information yesterday what's in there that is kind of being hid which is spooky

All that more that Flynn coming up right now.

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So I want to set this up for you now.

And then Matt Flynn is going to join us after the commercial break yesterday.

As we were kind of wrapping up the show just in the last half an hour or so, we told you the breaking news at the time that President Donald Trump, along with Pete Higgs at the Secretary of Defense, they had apparently came out over the weekend.

They put between five and 700 U.S.

Marines stationed in California on alert that they could be shipped out.

And yesterday, the order was given that they were going to ship them in

to Los Angeles, California.

Now, I reached out to some friends last night who live in Los Angeles, heard it's another one this morning.

Much as L.A.

Tom, one of our frequent listeners and callers described yesterday, the reaction by the federal government is at the least overkill.

And pretty much for show.

Because if you talk to people who live in the Los Angeles area right now,

This is a relatively small portion of Los Angeles, which of course is the second largest today in America in the Paramount area as they say And a predominantly Latino neighborhood and according to people I've spoken with in Los Angeles as we said yesterday a lot of this angst in Los Angeles was Prompted and set off by the fact that the Trump administration namely Stephen Miller

was ticked because Elon Musk stole his wife, which that's not that pretty true, actually.

But by pretty true, it's heavily rumored it hasn't been confirmed by Miller himself.

But he's already, he's got cranky and he said, you got to deport more people.

I mean, we were at the RNC in Milwaukee last summer when they literally had placards that said mass deportations now.

So they're ticked off that not enough people have been shipped out So they've sent in ice the feds have the Trump administration and they're now going to places like Home Depot Where you have very nice tranquil hard-working mostly guys Latinos that want 40 bucks to go help you build a retainer wall and they're they're Snapping these people up as well as moms picking their kids up from Los Angeles

As you might imagine, that didn't sit well.

And then Trump threw gas on it by throwing military into it.

We'll discuss it all, Matt Flynn and the other sides at the All Ball Show for a Tuesday on The Cinec Media Radio.

On the side of the law.

On that side of the law.

Who is right?

Who is wrong?

Who is foreign?

Who's against the law?

Welcome

back to the Top of All Show of the Civic Media, where you're working as 22 past the hour of two o'clock on this Tuesday, June 10th.

Usually when you hear Johnny Cash, particularly that song in this program, you know that our friend and ongoing contributor, Matt Flynn, is not far behind, and such is the case today.

He is a two-time past chair of the Wisconsin Democratic Party, an attorney, a Navy veteran, and author.

He joins us via stream yard from his home in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.

Matt Flynn, how are you?

I'm doing great, Ted, and it's great to be back on the title boat.

It's

always been... I like

to talk about...

Right, it's been a quiet week, Matt.

It's

been a

pretty... It never is,

Ted.

I mean, it seems like whenever we talk to each other off the air, we end up just laughing a lot because some of this stuff is just so unbelievable.

And I guess let's start out because you're...

You're a guy that appreciates history.

Give us a little historical context on what's been happening here these last few days.

It started on Thursday, Friday over the weekend and on the situation in Los Angeles.

And I'm not sure if you heard, but before you came on at the end of the last segment, I've talked to friends who live in the Los Angeles area and they kind of verified.

What I had talked about yesterday, which was this was precipitated by Steven Miller and Trump getting ticked off because they haven't deported enough Latino folks in particular so they went in they started snatching up day laborers at the Home Depot and arresting moms waiting for grade school kids at their at their schools and there are reports that some of these folks have already

been shipped out of the country.

Well, that didn't sit well in a predominantly Latino neighborhood in Los Angeles.

And now Trump has sent in the National Guard against Governor Newsom's wishes.

And yesterday, it was reported and now confirmed there are between five and 700 full-time active duty U.S.

Marines.

Matt Flynn, give us some context.

Yeah, here's the context and let me tell you something doesn't sit well me either or with Americans in general not just in a Latino neighborhood Here's what's going on.

It does require historical context There is a thing called the insurrection act that Trump is afraid to invoke because no judge would back him up He is simply using executive order to override the Constitution and override the insurrection act and the context is this

Trump is a frightened animal.

He's frightened that Vladimir Putin will disclose the steel video.

So this is nothing but a tactic.

He's betrayed Ukraine.

He's betrayed NATO, betrayed Canada.

But now what he's doing is trying to use our military to drive a wedge in our population.

Stalin had a saying that's very important.

He said, it doesn't matter who people vote for, it matters who counts the votes.

And what's going to happen is Trump is test driving this so that when it comes time to the midterms, he'll send troops into black and Latino neighborhoods, alleging that there's fraud.

He'll rough people up, they'll fight back, and he'll shut it down.

You do remember that there were calls from Russia in the last election

to Latino, Native American, and Black districts around the country saying there are bomb threats.

And no Democratic commentator has picked up on that, and they should.

Trump has three values.

It's treason, sadism, and fraud.

Those are his values.

And he's poisoned the Republican Party with them.

And this is just a continuation to test drive violence so that it can be more extreme during the midterm elections.

Don't disagree with you on on anything you said Matt.

Do you think there's also something to this notion that the bill the reconciliation bill in DC is not going particularly well for Trump right now in the in the US Senate you had his former Platonic boyfriend his political boyfriend Elon Musk break up with him last week And now apparently trying to get back together with him, but that you know Elon Musk

not just accused flat-out said that Trump was in the Jeffrey Epstein files of sexual misconduct with minors with girls on this plane on this island.

Do you think that part of this, Matt, is to diffuse again to distract people literally on the opposite coast while he has all these problems in DC?

I think that's absolutely true, but it's only part of it.

It's only part of it, Todd, and here's the thing.

He was alleged to have been on the Epstein plane seven times.

Now, he has his own plane.

Well, he's on the Epstein plane because they get a better view of the Caribbean.

You know, that's just not plausible.

Why was Prince Andrew on it?

You know, the point of the matter is Trump is a very, very bad guy and he's frightened.

He's a frightened guy, frightened of Putin, frightened of everything.

So yes, this is a distraction, but this is very fundamentally something that he's wanted for a long time.

He wants to be an oligarch.

He wants to be, in effect, he's imposing coming government on us.

You know, forget grifting, forget...

fascism.

You might as well talk about Jacob being France.

This is common government.

This is Putin government.

And Putin has him by the short hairs and he's frightened of Putin.

And so this is a way to test drive violence.

Remember, he's the one who called for the Second Amendment people to take care of Hillary Clinton.

This goes into his entire ethos is re-injecting violence.

And everybody in this country has got to stand up against this guy, even if you're a Republican.

And

we

have about 90 seconds.

We'll come back with more with Matt Flynn here.

But

Again, Matt, he had people around him in the first term of Trump, when he wanted the George Floyd incidents around the country, the protests, when he wanted, he said to the military, I mean, it's been documented, can't we just shoot him in the legs or something?

And he had people around them that said, no, actually, sir, we can't.

Well, I think what worries a lot of people, including myself, Matt, is that does he have anybody around him to tell him no anymore?

No, he doesn't.

Everybody thought that Marco Rubio would.

In other words, he got unanimous approval in the Senate.

And he's turned out to be a big disappointment.

He's caved.

His cabinet right now is a danger to America.

Trump is a danger to America.

It's not just that we have differences of opinion.

They are injecting violence that hasn't been seen since the Civil War.

in our politics when a congressman beat a senator with a cane and that kind of thing.

Trump is a clear and present danger to the United States, and he does not have the kind of cabinet he had before.

We'll come back, talk more at Matt Flynn.

As Matt likes to say, we see you on the lines.

Do not hang up.

We'll take phone calls after this.

855-752-4842.

855-752-4842.

Welcome to your calls.

More with Matt Flynn.

Stay tuned.

Pam Yankee and the Midwest Farm Report is next.

update whether as well we're back with Madda for this y'all ball show across Wisconsin on the Civic Media

Radio Network.

Welcome back to the Tullible show at the East Indie media ready to work and it's 35 minutes now past the hour of two o'clock on a Tuesday, June.

10th little Johnny Cash for you.

Thank you, Mr. Summers.

And that means our friend Matt Flynn, two-time chair of the Wisconsin Democratic Party, an attorney, a Navy vet, and an author joining us here live from Milwaukee via StreamYard.

Matt, I'm going to have you back on the show.

I heard you have a new book in the works.

And when that's ready, we'll have you back talking about that.

But today, Matt is here to give us a little perspective, a little context.

particularly from an attorney standpoint also I think a Navy veteran standpoint of what's going on right now at Los Angeles with these protests there has been some violence and I said this Matt on yesterday's show I said what we'll get into the Democrats and what they're doing and not doing here in a little while hopefully but if if I would have

Ben and Democrats, I would have had two or three people that served in the military yesterday, stand up or on Sunday, whatever, and say, look, just like on January 6th, anybody that attacks unprovoked a member of law enforcement in Los Angeles should be arrested, get proper due process if found guilty, have the book thrown at them.

I don't have time for that.

But also, we saw a couple of Yahoo's in law enforcement.

on camera, who are shooting rubber bullets into the crowd, unprovoked, a couple at journalism people.

Matt, to me, we need cooler heads here to prevail.

Don't do anything to intentionally provoke a response.

I agree.

It's got to be nonviolent.

And here's the history and the law in it real quick.

Yeah.

A president has the right to send in National Guard or to federalize them.

with the consent of the governor.

Now, has there ever been an instance where he didn't have the consent?

Yeah, Dwight Eisenhower used to send in the National Guard and John Kennedy, and they did it because segregationist governors in the South wouldn't let kids enroll in school, black kids.

And so both Eisenhower and Kennedy would nationalize the federal guard to protect civil rights.

That was what was done.

What Trump is doing is trying to use that

that particular historical example to do the exact opposite.

In other words, not only did Newsom not ask for it, but they're threatening to arrest him and they're sending it in to grab women and small kids out of daycares and try to deport them.

Now, the fundamental legal principle here is at what point can the president declare martial law

and invoke the Insurrection Act.

He can do it by statute.

It's not in the Constitution.

None of this isn't the Constitution.

But there were times during the Civil War and elsewhere where it was important to restore order.

What Trump is doing is a fake.

He's trying to say there's disorder of the magnitude of an insurrection and by executive order send in the Marines and neither Kennedy nor Dwight Eisenhower sent in military.

I'm a former naval officer, I serve.

And it means a great deal to me.

And I can tell you that when I was in the Navy and we worked a lot with the Marines, there was not a single soldier or sailor who ever envisioned a president turning them against the civilian population of the United States.

We were turned against enemies of the United States.

The fact is, Trump is an enemy of the United States.

The Russians are enemies of the United States.

And they have taken over our government

and are pitting our military against civilians.

If you want to call in, ask Matt a question or comment, 855-752-4842.

855-752-4842.

You can also text us, and speaking of the text line, we're smack dab in the middle of our summer.

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Gonna go to the phone lines, Matt.

But again, quickly, I wanna get your...

A legal take on this, correct me if I'm wrong, part of the reason that Trump and Stephen Miller and others keep using the word invasion is that that is a key word, the vernacular, to institute the Insurrection Act.

It was meant to quell invasion, but that was from people from outside the country.

We're not in the middle of an invasion.

Do I have that right?

Yeah, you do but the fact is the insurrection act was also triggered for instance during the Civil War where there are Confederate riots and all that so What Trump is doing is lying about what's occurred, but using nomenclature from the past right to try to make given an historical basis And

also very quickly in 92 during the Rodney King riots when I actually flew out there in 92 I remember very very well the difference was California Governor Jerry Brown at the time asked then President

George H.W.

Bush to, to for help with the National Guard.

That was a request from the governor.

That's very different than what's happening now.

Very appropriate.

What he, this guy is doing is address rehearsal for shutting down the midterm elections in black, Latino and Native American precinct.

And one more quick thing legally, again, correct me if I'm wrong, from military standpoint.

Once troops are federalized, and because Trump was the one that called up the National Guard, they are now quote-unquote federalized, meaning they're answering to him and not to the governor.

And when you have federalized troops, both the National Guard and certainly all active duty military, they are not allowed to do law enforcement, correct?

Well, yes, that's partially correct in this respect.

If he federalizes the National Guard, they can go into suppressor riot, for instance, and that's going to require some policing.

There is no justification in American history for sending in troops, Marines, sailors, or army that's totally different from the National Guard.

And if the governor didn't request it, even the National Guard should not have been sent in by

Trump

eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five five seven five two four eight four two.

Let's go quickly to Karina in Milwaukee listening to the UK.

Karina, thanks for holding.

What's

a. Hi, gentlemen.

Hi, Matt.

Miss.

Miss.

Miss your voice.

Go ahead.

That's Karina.

Sound.

Sound real good.

Okay.

So I want to play.

a devil advocate over here for a second because I can you know I listen both sides all the time and the CNN and ABC says this well you know it's a it's a it's a peaceful demonstration and there's a bunch of people just standing there and watching car burn for fun well this doesn't sound right well Fox NBC doesn't sound right either

I have my examples in my mind.

Here you go.

Ukrainian president.

Whatever he does, he doesn't want this.

18 months ago, he was in the White House saying, oh, poor me, poor me, poor Ukrainian people.

Yet he was planning the operation while he was doing the peace talk, knowing perfectly well that the Putin is going to come back and just destroy everything what he's going to use.

Okay,

hold on just a second.

Hold on, Justice.

No, you hold on.

I think we have two

different issues here.

Go ahead, Matt.

Yeah, not only do we have two different issues, we have a strong disagreement, Trina.

We stand with Ukraine.

They are our allies.

Trump has betrayed them because he's afraid of Putin.

Zelensky did not start this war.

This was Putin that started this war trying to reengage into the entire Soviet Empire.

That's exactly what's happened.

There are very good people in Russia, no question.

I was in Russia in 1997 at the invitation of our State Department, and I gave lectures on American law.

That was during Glossnost, where we were friendly with the Russians.

Putin is a murderer.

He's a genocidal murderer.

He's like Stalin.

He's evil.

We stand with Zelensky.

We stand with Ukraine.

Period.

Thank you very much.

8-5-5-7-5-2-4-8-4-2.

Let's go to Cindy listening on Appleton.

Cindy, thanks for calling.

What's the...

Hey man, hey Todd.

Well, Matt stole a little bit of my thunder.

I have a couple of points I want to make.

And I know the Democrats are getting really excited about the 2026 elections.

But like Matt said, this is happening because he's going to start shutting down toll booths or polling booths.

so that, you know, people can vote.

That's what's coming out of this.

And of all people who want to pull the insurrection act thing after he let how many hundreds of insurrectionists out of prison, are you flipping kidding

me?

Thanks, Andy.

You

know, Cindy, yeah, you always have an absolutely great insight, and I will say this.

He egged on the insurrectionists on January 6th.

He deliberately didn't call them off.

Then he pardoned them all, including ones that badly beat police officers.

There was a police officer who died.

140 of them were injured.

He likes insurrection, but when it's on his terms, the truth of the matter is here, there was not an insurrection in this one.

And what happened was he sends people in and anytime there's a jostling, give you an example.

If a police officer punches you,

and you punch him back, you've committed the felony, even if he wasn't justified in punching you.

There can't be violence.

My message to the Democratic Party and the immigration protesters, no violence.

Trump is sending people in to create violence.

He has never said a truthful word in his life, and he stands for treason, he stands for sadism, and he stands for

fraud.

situation currently I'll simply say Karina I'm not there I've talked with people last night and this morning who are and they tell me that by and large these protests are are peaceful in fact yes there have been some cars that were set on fire but they were they were you know there's always going to be a couple of bad apples in every every situation and we don't know whether these were people sent in say proud boys or other people to basically

instigate and make it look bad.

So yes, as Matt said, I agree.

Anybody who commits violence, that's no good.

And those people have to be held accountable.

But by and large, people I know on the ground, this has been a peaceful thing by people locally, at least so far.

855-752-4842.

Let's go quickly to Gene in Eau Claire on WCFW, the tap.

Gene, thanks for calling.

We'll see you.

Well, thank you for having Matt on.

Great to hear your voice, Matt.

I wish

we'd

hear it more

often.

Thanks, Gene.

And I'll say you something.

You know, they don't need to attack us.

Putin don't need to attack the United States.

He's already got his weapon of mass destruction in our presidency, totally going after every single thing that makes America great.

Another thing, too, is I watched helicopter coverage live, you know, as they were assembling and they were going to start walking down the road and it was covering the bridges and everything like that.

People were spacing apart and they were walking the way they are taught when you're going to, you know, protest peacefully.

So, yeah.

And then Trump started this little thing going on.

So anyway, I'm so glad to hear you mad.

And if you got any suggestions or anything we should think about before you're off the air, please tell us.

Thank you.

Bye.

Thank you, Gene.

It's always great to hear from Gene O'Clair.

Gene digs into these issues better than anybody.

And I want to agree with something strongly what she just said.

Donald Trump is essentially run by Moscow.

I mean, let me be very, very blunt.

Not just this thing in LA, but the tariffs.

everything, cutting out USA, destroying our soft power, destroying our reputation around the world, destroying our allies, attacking our allies, betraying Ukraine.

He is desperately afraid of Putin.

He's afraid that Putin will reveal the steel video.

And so what's happened?

Because of all that, he switches sides in the middle of the war.

He betrays Canada.

He betrays NATO, betrays Ukraine.

He's got to get out of office.

The problem is he'll have three and a half more years.

And during that time, we have got to stand up against them.

I'm very proud of all the demonstrations around the country.

When we come back, Matt, I want to talk and, you know, you're not giving anybody legal advice, but just based on your experience as a lawyer and as a party activist for years, what people, what can, can we be doing?

What should we be doing with their legal context?

And also the Democrats and their response.

All that more.

Matt Flynn after this is the all ball show on the civic media.

You already know.

I keep the

ends out for the tide it finds.

Because you're mine.

I walk the line.

Direct on the Matt Flynn playlist on his Spotify, or vinyl, or eight track tape.

It's a little Bob Dylan there.

How do you listen to your music, Matt Flynn?

Well, I listen to radio, but I also have a ton of CDs, old fashioned CDs, and I just put them in.

And a lot of rock and roll, 50s and 60s, and frankly, a lot of opera.

Really,

you're a big opera guy.

Matt Flynn, two-time chair of the Democratic Party of Wisconsin, attorney, Navy vet and author joins us here.

For the remainder of the half hour for a few minutes, Matt, lots to get to.

Let's go quickly to one more caller here, Mark and the sack.

Mark, we're really up against the clock.

If you can get it in like 30 seconds, please, go ahead.

To paraphrase Beast briefly, he has erected amongst us a multitude of new offices and sent them hither to eat out of our substance.

He has kept among us in times of peace, standing armies with all the consent of our legislature.

A man whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a tyrant is unfit to be the leader of a free people.

Thanks.

Thank you.

Thank you

go historical document.

That was terrific mark.

Thank you very much Yeah,

very very good mark a quick question map over well first of all rosemary I believe it was said thank you great to hear your voice again Great to have you on rosemary in it's a alvina.

I think in your Eau Claire area says so glad you're on And you're incredibly incredibly knowledgeable about current events also sue listening in Franklin WAUK Says what's the steel video Matt?

I really

I don't want to go into the details of it, but suffice it to say it's a legend video that shows Trump in a sexually compromised position with young girls and doing other things that we were not going to talk about in the air.

But it's more than there's been a lot of reporting on this, and that might be part of it.

But since you alluded to it, I wanted to kind of clarify that since we got a question on it.

Matt, I want to go to the Democratic

response.

because we're to play a little bit, a little bit of this, just to snip it.

This is from an article in Politico from yesterday, the day before, that the new chair of the DNC, Ken, as I like to call him, my least favorite Martin, who is now the DNC chair out in DC, had his private meeting with David Hogg and others.

Somehow this tape got leaked out.

I'm not sure if it's some Hogg or somebody else, but this is what they were talking about in a ballroom in suburban DC.

G&C chair basically sniveling that they've made an impotent politically.

And I'll say, look, it has plenty of warts, and we're all trying to change those for sure.

But the longer we continue this fight, the harder it is for us to actually do what we all want to do, which is make a difference in this country again.

I deeply respect you, David.

I too was looking forward to working with you, but this has created a situation and I'll be very honest with you for the first time in my hundred days on this job and Jessica knows this.

The other night I said to myself for the first time, I don't know if I want to do this anymore.

And partly not because of the stress and all the naysayers, right?

I'm used to that.

I've spent 14 years as a chair.

I'm used to getting beat up on.

But this is really everything from this election, this credentials report, and how Malcolm's been treated in this, to the fact the election itself, how Shasti and Gina were treated in this.

I'm just quite frustrated to be in this position because what you've done, whether you like it or not, or know it or not, David, is I'm trying to, no one knows who the hell I am, right?

I'm trying to get my sea legs underneath of me and actually develop any amount of credibility so I can go out there and raise the money and do the job I need to to put ourselves in a position to win.

And again, I don't think you intended this, but you essentially destroyed any chance I have to show the leadership that I need to.

That is the chair of the Democratic National Committee, Matt Flynn.

Yeah, I'm very, very concerned about him.

And I just want to say this, just on a state level, the state chairs of the Wisconsin Democratic Party were Pat Lucy, Herb Cole and me and others.

Nobody in that group.

would have said something like that, even at the state level.

Ben Wickler should be the state chair.

This

guy beat him because I beg your pardon, national chair of the DNC.

But this guy put together a coalition of people of progressives like Ilhan Omar.

The fact is that Ben Wickler is more progressive than he is.

Worked for George Soros and similar groups.

So, Ben, if you're listening.

Let it be known that you be willing to be our national chair.

You are the best.

Not just fundraising, but you're tough as nails in a very good way.

Tough as nails in a velvet glove.

This guy, to say he's frustrated, he's thinking not doing it.

Hey, come on.

You know, you go into combat and the general goes, I'm afraid.

He reminds me of the coach of the Jets back in the 90s.

The other team would come out of the field and say, boy, they look big.

No, I swear to God.

The Jets lost 12 games.

I mean, you can't have this kind of stuff.

Get this guy out of here.

Put him back in Ben Wickler.

That's exactly what I was looking for.

A little vintage Matt Flynn.

No, but I mean, to your point, who wants to follow somebody like that?

And we are in a critical time in this nation's history and we need strong leadership.

I couldn't agree with you more.

I hope that Ben Wickler still has a chance to be the national committee person because we'd be a lot better off.

We shall see a minute left, Matt Flynn.

Any dog in the fight in the state party chair race up north in Green Bay or wherever it's at this weekend?

No, I think it's over in the Dells and I don't.

I know all three of them.

You're not gonna go, okay.

I know all three of them, fine people.

I don't know who's gonna win.

I think that Ben Wickler has endorsed one candidate that obviously gives him a leg up.

I think we've all got to get behind whoever the new chair is.

But Ben Wickler, if you're listening to me, and I supported you for national chair, even though I didn't have a vote at the time because I'm no longer a state chair.

Ben, get back in the hunt.

Get back in the race and get rid of Martin.

Get him out of there.

There you go Matt Flynn.

Thank you very much my friend.

I appreciate you have a great day Milwaukee We'll come back with our two a little what's worse for you and our friend Brian van Hooker from crack.com is the all balls show for a Tuesday on the civic media

From the Civic Media World Headquarters in Madison, Wisconsin, it's the Todd Alba Show.

And now, pursuing truth wherever it may lead, here's your host, Todd

Alba.

and streaming worldwide in the Civic Media app.

Good afternoon, everybody.

I'm Todd Alba, all of our fantastic producer engineer, Mr. Aaron Zommers on the board.

It is six minutes past the hour of three o'clock.

Welcome into hour number two with the big program here on this Tuesday, June 10th, 2025.

It is a great day to be with Scott tonight from the old World Headquarters of downtown Madison.

Some overcast skies, sun peeking through here and there.

Still that

Canadian wildfire smoke in the air breathing breath What do they call it?

Health advisories

air quality advisory.

That's it

Air quality advisory in effect for much of Wisconsin for today and like next it's gonna hang around for a while so if you say well the weather people said it was Gonna be mostly clear, but it looks hazy.

It's not it's not the weather per se.

It's the effects of

human global warming and the like up in Canada.

So be aware of that coming up this hour at the bottom of the hour.

This could be fun.

Brian Van Hooker of cracked.com has not been on the show for a while.

He is back and going to be talking Muppets, the Muppets show.

And yes, it was aimed in the start of Sesame Street.

Much of that.

Of course, it was aimed at kids, but the Muppet show.

And this was the genius of the Muppets, in my opinion, the Muppet show, while certainly aimed at kids, they worked in some very, as the kids say today, low key adult references.

They snuck them in and the Muppets sometimes would hit on on the live.

the live people guest stars.

And pretty aggressively, it turns

out.

And pretty aggressively.

And Jim Henson and his crew, they had a little bit of adult humor in them, but they were very careful of how they presented it.

So Brian Van Hooker will talk about that.

And also, the late great comedian actor Rodney Dangerfield will be on the show.

No, not really.

Yes, we're bringing in a, we're gonna have a seance at the bottom of the show.

No, Brian Van Hooker, the best, please take my wife jokes by Rodney Dangerfield as told.

by Rod Rodney Dangerfield's wife, Joan.

So that'll be, that'll be a heck of a lot of fun.

So looking forward to all of that, we'll try to work it a little bit of a newsy headlines along the way as well.

But right now at eight minutes past the hour of three o'clock time for what's worse, let's go.

for what's worse, nothing to give away, no prize money involved, but it is your chance to have your voice heard across all 11 news, whether it's sports stations or the Civic Media Ready Network, no better place to have your business, your services advertised than right here on the Civic Media Ready Network.

Contact us at civicmedia.us.

to find out how you can be one of our fine sponsors, partners.

We would love to work with you, civicmedia.us.

All right, here we go now.

And as I told Zomers before the show, I didn't even realize this was a thing.

And maybe after this segment, maybe Jane McNair and Greg Bach on their show, McNair and Aaron 9-11, maybe they'll pick this up and use it and say this shouldn't, this should not be a thing.

Maybe, I don't know.

I'm not sure either.

So the category today, let's get to it pizza category what's worse Chicago style pizza, which I'm very familiar with or Detroit style pizza What's worse Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza?

Zomers as I was talking to Matt Flynn by the way many thanks to Matt Flynn for being on the show today our number one is I was having a great discussion conversation with a friend Matt Flynn you were busy dialing dialing up some information Chicago versus Detroit style pizza, please share

yes for those of you who are not aware formerly myself Chicago style pizza, which like Todd I'm familiar with is more of a pie a very high crust

that forms, I guess, you could say, if you take a wheel of cheese and hollow it out, kind of like that, you know, a cylinder with the inside hollow, put some cheese in there, a whole lot of sauce and your toppings, but usually cheese on the bottom.

So, deep dish pizza with a lot of sauce is Chicago style pizza.

Now, Detroit style pizza, also deep dish, very tall, but the bread is thicker and airier.

And it also tends to use at least original Detroit style pizza.

uses rather than mozzarella Wisconsin brick cheese And the the sauce instead of being a soup or a pie filling almost it is applied in what are called racing stripes

They just look

like strips of sauce in there So it's a lot more bread and cheese heavy and Chicago is a lot sauce a lot more sauce heavier

sauce here The Chicago pizza is is saucier

All right, then I thank you.

Thank you for that work Zombers.

I did not know this as Johnny Carson would said I I did not know that Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza.

What's worse eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five seven five two four eight four two Or you can text us on the civic media app or you can talk to us on YouTube or Facebook or wherever a Tony watching on

YouTube says thin crust is worse.

Not even close.

Well, Tony, that's not doing

it.

Chicago style because it has thinner crust.

I'm going to take that as Chicago style.

And

I

hear otherwise.

So so the early voting Tony saying Chicago style pizza is worse.

Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five five seven five two four eight four two or Text us on the civic media app again as numbers has told us the Chicago style pizza is more saucier With the red sauce and whatnot and you get more bread and cheese with a Detroit style pizza Brian up in Green Bay listening on our great station WBGW we're gonna do this show live

from the Green Bay station on Friday.

Join us for that.

Brian says Chicago style pizza is worse.

All right.

Robert in McFarland listening on WMDX, baby, why make me choose?

I just love pizza.

But Detroit pizza or Detroit is pizza.

Chicago is mostly full of Italian meal.

I'm going with Detroit.

So I think Robert means Chicago style is

worse.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Yeah, so yeah, exactly.

Thank you.

Wow, that's, he's very, very, I didn't know people really were this passionate about it.

What else do you have?

Mary Ann, listening, oops, sorry.

I'm gonna go back to Mary Ann and McFarland.

Chicago style is worse.

And I'm a Chicagoan, all right.

Conrad, up in Green Bay, perhaps our great producer up there.

Gonna be talking to him maybe on Friday, gonna be helping us out.

Of course, Conrad, the producer of the great show.

Pete Schwabba's nightlight every evening from six until eight.

It's Conrad's birthday today.

That's right.

Happy birthday to Conrad.

Conrad says, Detroit is worse because, whoops, because pizza, where are you going?

Go back up.

There's a lot

of

text.

I know.

Detroit is worse because pizza always comes down to how good the sauce is.

Chicago always has that good sauce.

Conrad, I think I'm with you.

Again, happy birthday, Conrad.

Celebrating his 19th birthday today.

I don't think that's accurate.

But he's just a young, cool dude.

All right.

AJ in Madison on WMDX says they both suck.

Just make a normal pizza.

Well, AJ, what's a normal pizza to you?

Mary Anna McFarlane says I grew up on the south side of Chicago and we loved thin crust.

All right, there you go.

Brian and Green Bay on WGBW, when you come up to Green Bay, try Jet's Pizza.

It's Detroit style.

Oh, great.

Well, maybe that's what I'll do.

Maybe, well, but Conrad's today likes Chicago better.

I was going to say I could order a Detroit style pizza at Jet's for Schwabba and Conrad.

Save me a slice.

We'll see if it keeps over the weekend.

Matt Richland's tenor, one of our great UPS drivers listening to WRCE, Detroit style is worse, but New York style.

Uh craps craps on both of them if you can't hold and fold It's not real pizza.

There's a there's a New York guy right there.

Uh, what else we have?

Greg and Genesis Depot Chicago pizza is worse score the phone lines eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five five seven five two four eight four two Jim in beautiful Brookfield Jim I just threw Brookfield go to the Brewers game on on Sunday Jim.

What's worse?

Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza?

They're both very good.

Chicago is like a pie, truly like a pie.

And I agree with Conrad that sauce is delicious.

However, if I had a pick, I'd say Chicago's worth.

I like Detroit because their crust is more airy and flaky.

It's not that thick and doughy.

And it's known to have that airy crust, but also for baking, you know, making it crispy, the topping, the cheese and the toppings up around, especially around the edges.

I like a crispy topping with an airy crust, even though Chicago, like I say, it's a big slice of pie and a really good sauce, but I'd have to take the crispiness anytime.

I appreciate the gym.

You're this fantastic.

I appreciate the education and and shout out to the the graphics folks here at the show because the graphic that they have on this on the screen nailed what Jim just said.

The toppings are more crispy and crunchy.

The crust is more crispy and crunchy than a Chicago style pizza.

So thanks for the education, Jim.

855-752-4842, 855-752-4842, Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza.

What's worse?

Hey on Zomers, our very own Jane McNair guy, lover, host of the Jane McNair show every morning from nine until 11.

It's listening in.

She has texted me on the bat line.

All the hosts have a bat line where we can just call each other.

She says, this shouldn't be a question.

All pizza is good pizza, except for anchovies.

I'm with you on that chain.

Middle free pizza for me.

Yes, yes, Jane.

That's how they make it.

They just go to the local bait shop and get some minnows and put on the pizza.

Jane and I are getting ready to go back on the road with Greg if travel is approved.

You got to get different kinds of pizza.

And maybe we'll eat our way through Wisconsin.

Maybe that'll be part of the little tour we're planning.

Maybe we'll stop at different pizza shops.

What do you think, Jane?

We'll just see who has the best pizza in Wisconsin.

What do you have, Summers?

Yes, I forgot one note.

about the differences between the two pizzas that some people might find important and others won't care at all.

Chicago style pizza tends to be circular.

Detroit style pizza tends to be rectangular.

Oh, that's another.

That's another important point.

Chris listening in beautiful Janesville, Wisconsin, the WMDX says Giordano's are geodarno's darno's in Chicago is the best.

All right.

I love these recommendations.

Anybody else against Steven Lodai?

Detroit style is worse.

I guess that means Chicago is worse.

All right.

Very good.

Um, there's

a battle.

There's a battle

between AJ and Ryan, by the way, on the text line on, on pizzas here.

I think the big takeaway for me in the segment is that I have been educated because I did not know until right now this segment of the true differences between Chicago and Detroit style.

And neither did I. I don't know if I've ever really had a true Detroit style pizza before.

I don't think I have either, but it sounds really good, especially the way Jim and Brookfield described it with, you know, the airy doughy or not doughy, the airy flakier crust, but with the crispiness that I that I crave.

Well, I know I'm going.

I know I'm going on Friday in Green Bay when I'm up at GBW, a little Jets pizza and try Chicago style.

But I'm going to have to buy Conrad a Chicago.

a Chicago style pizza for his birthday, I'll take the Detroit style at Jets.

Maybe Jets will do both.

Maybe.

Maybe they'll do half and half.

Look, I don't think you can do half and half.

I don't think that's

possible.

But oh, here's a Sue and Franklin says wild tomato pizza in Door County is really good.

All right, very good.

Love all the suggestions.

That's our, Zomers, I guess, when we come back, we'll wrap it up, give our takes of what's worse, and a couple of news headlines, and then we're talking Muppets who hit on humans at the bottom of the hour.

Don't go anywhere.

If they choose the addition of the title of Bull Shell across Wisconsin on the civic media.

Rating network.

Welcome back to the title of all show in the Pacific media radio work 22 minutes now past the hour of three o'clock on Tuesday June 10th Wrapping up today's edition of what's worse Chicago style pizza or Detroit style pizza caller texting in says both are delicious two different beasts Chicago crust is made with cornmeal and Laminated with butter Detroit style crust is more traditional

but pushes those cubes of brick cheese and mozzarella to make those little black, crispy bits.

Wow.

Goes on to say, make them both and love them equally.

Now, there is a connoisseur of pizza.

That's fantastic.

Zama's Chicago or Detroit style pizza was worse.

See, I am going to have to go with Chicago style being worse, not because it's bad by any stretch of the imagination.

I agree.

most, if not all pizza, is good pizza.

And I think when done well, both of these styles are amazing.

But I think that when done poorly, Chicago style becomes soup.

And when done poorly, Detroit style is just kind of mediocre.

So I'm going to say that Chicago style is worse because it has the potential to be far worse.

I like the fact that you had really good rationale for that.

It wasn't just a cheap shot.

That was, that was actually very, very good.

I was going to agree with my friend, our friend, Gene McNair.

That the question should be a thing because all pizza is good, but the way you the way that you put that That's pretty that's a hard argument for me to go again So I'll agree with you if I had to choose one today based on what summer said a poorly prepared Chicago pizza may in fact be worse, but really in in effect all pizza is great radio host destroyed with facts

and

logic

I we're gonna have a brian van hooker here on after the after the break talking some some goofy nonsense about muppets and roddy danger field But I want to get to get it back to a couple of things here in the few minutes we have left in this half hour Elizabeth Warren us there Elizabeth Warren had a couple of love more than a couple had four really great points about Being distracted not the things in LA aren't important right now Los Angeles But then we can't lose sight of what's important in DC

and she lists for what she calls dangerous provisions in Trump's reconciliation bill right now, such as defunding Planned Parenthood, which I talked about with Jane and Greg on Matt Nairnair this morning, also slashing taxes and restriction on purchasing gun silencers, making it easier for criminals to gain access to them and ensuring our society is less safe.

Number three, barring states from regulating artificial intelligence.

Number four, stopping courts from holding Trump officials in contempt for ignoring court orders, gutting their ability to ensure Trump follows the law.

I think those are, you know, important things.

We're going to talk more about those as the week progresses, but I think it's important not to lose sight of what's happening on the east coast of this country as well.

I want to play this, came across this cut, because again, I think that too often we, you know,

It's on television, whatever.

It becomes a game almost.

And this is a really good reminder that there are real people's lives being affected in Los Angeles.

Here is the superintendent of the Los Angeles Public School District holding a press conference yesterday on what this situation in Los Angeles means to him.

I want to confess to you, for those of you who may not know, I would be a hypocrite if I did not fight for those today.

are facing conditions that over 40 years I faced as an undocumented migrant to this country.

I want to repeat that.

I would be the biggest hypocrite in the world regardless of my position today if today I did not fight for those who find themselves in the same predicament I faced over 40 years ago when I arrived in this country at the age of 17.

as an undocumented immigrant.

Education made me and saved me.

I became a teacher, a principal, a superintendent leading the nation's largest districts, four times selected as national superintendent of the year.

Do not underestimate the power of the immigrant child who may very well become an adult who does well and good by America.

If I come across with a certain degree of contempt and anger, I am.

I am because Monday, Monday, actions were taken in this community that have no place in our city, in our state or across America.

I'm still mystified as to how a first, second, third, fourth or sixth grader would pose any type of risk to the national security of our nation that would require.

Homeland security to deploy its agents to two elementary schools

Los Angeles Unified School District Superintendent Alberto M Calvaro Which I thought was the most poignant thing I've heard about this entire situation so far Saying look I'm I was one of those undocumented kids and Because I was given a chance in this country and because I received a public education

I'm now leading the education in Los Angeles as a citizen.

And why in God's name is the federal government of this country targeting grade school kids?

Trump promised to go after, in his words, the murderers and rapists, unquote.

There's no justification for going after kids.

It's cruel and unusual punishment.

And these kids in LA are the pawns for Trump's political relevance.

And God bless Alberto Calvero for calling that out in a calm way, respectful way, but poignant way.

We need more leaders like that in this country.

So spare me the indignation and name calling

by people in this country, in this state, that just want to classify everybody of a certain skin color or origin as, well, they're the bad people.

Alberto Calvero is proof that when given a chance, regardless of where you are born, you can make something and contribute.

Back after this is the All Balls Show in Civic Media.

tonight's

guest star Mr. Joel Gray!

Welcome back to the Telomal Show on the Civic Media Running Network.

35 minutes now past the hour of three o'clock.

That is the iconic open of the long-running Muppet Show.

Correct me if I'm right.

I believe it was on ABC, if I remember right, although I could be wrong.

But for those of us of a certain age who grew up on the Muppets, first on Sesame Street, and then on the Muppet Show, and then in the subsequent Muppet movies,

nothing better than the Muppets.

And they were created in large part by Jim Henson, of course, the late great Jim Henson, who was taken all too soon by cancer.

But the iconic, the legacy of the Muppets lives on.

And so Brian Van Hooker, the talented person that he is, has written a couple of articles in cracked.com, entitled,

10 times the Muppet show hosts were relentlessly hit on by the puppets.

And this, as we said earlier in the show, this is one of those things where.

It was predominantly for kids, of course, lots of great lessons learned for kids on Sesame Street.

But once they transferred over to prime time, it was still a lot of it aimed at kids.

But.

They were so, the writers were so great and Jim Henson and Frank Oz and the other puppeteers were so talented at ad-libbing that they would kind of throw in little lines, now and again, that would go over the kid's head, but the adults got.

And it was really, really funny.

And part of the funniness of it was that they never said,

the really overt, dirty joke, it was just the insinuation that only an adult would get, and it was so well done that it made it really, really super funny.

Zomers, you're too young to remember, you said, but you've seen the bump, it's obviously, but you were born after the show aired.

Yeah, I've still gone back and watched some, but I should watch more, because what I have seen is really good.

Yeah, it's it's really fantastic.

We're expecting Brian van Hooker from crack.com to make an appearance.

He could be tied up.

He could be tied up.

So we'll we'll think up for a little while.

Literally.

Wouldn't that be something?

Would that be something?

I would be a story if he was literally tied up somewhere inside the literally media headquarters.

But no, from from my money.

Lots of times, Miss Piggy, who was actually portrayed, I guess, or the puppeteer was Frank Oz, the same puppeteer that did Yoda.

An absolute legend.

He's still going.

I don't think so.

Hold on.

Frank Oz?

I thought he was still alive.

I'm pretty sure he's dead.

Let me look.

No.

All right.

Here's a live edition of Dead or Alive.

No, he's alive.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I don't know why I thought he was dead.

No, because, I mean, well, it's been a while since the last Star Wars movie came out, but he was still doing Yoda in the last Star Wars movie, that sort of thing.

So he has to be like maybe in his 80s, you think?

80-ish?

Yeah, he is 81.

There you go.

Pretty close.

Frank Oz, the great puppeteer, and I would call him an actor, quite frankly, with everything that he does.

So Miss Piggy, she was pretty salty, sultry, in some of her things, a fuzzy bear.

Also, I think done by Frank Oz would also get a couple of zingers in there.

And occasionally, even though Kermit was kind of the clean cut Muppet, occasionally he would get one in there as well.

And then, of course, you got the band, who, you know, the bands are always a little raunchy.

And the Muppet, the band would always get a doctor electric, I think was the- I think that sounds right.

Was the band leader there?

And of course, animal.

Animal he gets a little crazy as well.

So the Muppets oftentimes do get a little a little sultry there Well, we're why don't we just jump into this and we'll see if we'll see if mr. Van Hooker there could have been a terrible terrible mix up

I don't think there was, but we hope everything is okay.

Let's jump into this at number 10, according to Cracked Magazine, cracked.com.

Number 10, where a best episode or segment where a muppet hit on a human, because that was the bit.

If you don't remember the show, the muppets were puppets, but they called muppets, and then they would have a live person, a real person, be the guest host of the show.

And so the live person would interact with the Muppets.

So number 10, Raquel Welch.

Kermit introduces Welch as, quote, one of the sexiest ladies live.

You want to hear it?

Can we hear it?

All right, here we go.

Here's Kermit introducing Raquel Welch.

Ladies and particularly gentlemen, here she is, the curvaceous, the tantalizing, the desirable.

Hold it, chief.

What now?

She's changing her image.

Changing her image?

Yeah, she was just rehearsing Shakespeare.

Well,

ladies and gentlemen, one of cinema's leading dramatic actresses, the very erudite, Miss Rock Hill

Welch.

Changes it a little bit.

As the thing went on and said, Welch, however, seems much more interested in Fawzi, Fawzi the bear, who she rubs up and down and singing confide in me.

She also called Fawzi sexy and sexational before asking him to come up to her dressing room.

And those things, I mean, there was kind of said quickly and as an aside.

And so it went over the kid's head.

But the adults, the moms and dads who were in the room watching, that's why I think adults love the show.

Or even if it didn't go over the kid's head,

it

was, I guess.

I feel like it's not that bad.

You know,

they're not

describing anything specific.

It's just like, oh, you hot little bear probably.

Right, right, right.

No, it's all done and it's all done in fun and just.

All right.

So number nine, according to Crack.com, best additions where a Muppet hit on a human was, remember this?

They used to have a spin-off of Star Trek.

We're not a spin-off, but a take on Star Trek.

And the entire

crew of this ship were pigs.

It was called pigs in space.

And Miss Piggy was part of this, of course.

The swine trek captain was named Link Hogthrob.

Do we have audio for this one?

All right, here we go.

Here's an additional pigs in space with a swine trek camp captain, Link Hogthrob.

Aren't you Link Hogthrob?

I mean the stars of the show here, perhaps you've admired me from afar?

Well, um, I'd really rather admire you from here.

What?

Maybe while we dance?

Oh, well, uh...

Actually, I'm not much of a dancer, and tonight's my night to

go bowling.

Is it the last dance?

Yes.

Last dance.

That was Leslie Ann Warren.

Well, I had heard from a lot.

She might have passed, I don't know.

But that was a great bit was the pigs in space.

That was a lot of fun.

Going through the top 10 episodes of The Muppet Show,

where Muppets hit on a human guest host, according to Cracked.com.

Number eight, the leader of the pack, Kermit, and the great Linda Rodstead, with Linda Rodstead hosted and Kermit Bizer flowers.

Here we go.

This does not have the part where I call their flowers, but later on.

All right, very good.

All right, yeah, we'll talk about that later, Miss

Piggy.

Oh, Kermit.

Thanks for singing this song for me, even though I know your heart still belongs to Piggy.

Well, you may know that, and Piggy may know that, but the vote's not in yet from the frog.

The vote's not in yet from the frog, and later on calls her a foxy lady, quote, unquote.

Again, this was the 80s, right, where, you know, calling somebody a foxy lady, that was pretty provocative, especially for a muppet.