Selective Outrage (Hour 3)

Live, across Wisconsin on Civic Media, you're listening to Mornings with Pat Craiglo powered by Up North News.

Now, for my Lake Mesota studio, here is the founding editor of Up North News, Pat Craiglo.

Well, hey there, Wisconsin.

Good morning.

It is a Tuesday morning, October 28, 2025.

And it's another beautiful morning to have you here up north live from Lake Wissota.

From wherever you're listening across the Civic Media radio network, catching us on YouTube, Facebook, podcast, website, the tin can with a string.

I've always wondered why that was hanging here.

Anyway, we're glad that you got your day started right here.

And I hope your day is starting out well.

I clearly I concern some people because the show starts on the radio at 606.

We start the live stream social media, Facebook, YouTube at six o'clock, but sometimes I'm a little late getting it started.

And Tony right away gets up there on YouTube from up in national and says, where's Pat?

Then Alicia jumps in the comments sections and like, wait, Pat's missing.

Tony responds.

He wasn't here at exactly six o'clock saying, I need my pre show preview precisely at six a.m.

Tony, I'm sorry.

I have an excuse.

I got a question for you.

You ever start your day with something that could just send your day into a tailspin?

And then you have to catch yourself and go, nope, nope, that's not what's going to happen here.

Well, that happened twice already this morning.

So let me bring in my favorite non-coffee drinker, Parker Olson, who's producing this Shindig down in Madison Studio A2.

Parker, you have your water?

I

have my water.

I've had my fruit snacks and Pat I had two pieces of white bread and water today because I needed something to my tummy before I took the equal

Yes.

Parker's a little under the weather here.

He's plain wounded and we appreciate that.

He's got his white water hoodie on because that's how he does it.

He remembers, in white water, they teach you never give up.

You get on that field no matter what and he is on the field of battle today and we appreciate it.

As far as in Alicia says, Tony gave me a heart attack and Tony's like, well, I have three kids.

So I never start my day without spiraling into something.

Anyway, here's the thing that spiraled.

Oh, boy.

Get up, you know, alarm goes off.

You know, I there's a four on the alarm clock, like for something.

Okay.

Stumble out to the kitchen.

I want to pour myself a cup of ambition, but I can't because as I go to pull the coffee pot out of the dishwasher, it

I mean, I've pulled it out of that dishwasher 1000 times.

I think literally, yes, more than 1000 times when I think of how long we've had that dishwasher and believe it.

And the one time it hits as I lift it up, it hits the bottom of the counter.

Of course, we've got these like granite countertops or whatever.

So you hear that sickening, it doesn't shatter, but you know, it cracked, you just know, you know that sound.

And you pull it out.

Yep.

And it's got a big old chip in it, a little chip that's missing and you're not going to get coffee.

But then I remembered, I have a dual coffee maker.

It's got the pot on the one side and it's got the single serving on the other where you can put in the little pods.

Oh, sure.

And also, because I mean, I am, you know, I might be Earth's best friend, as an environmentalist, I don't use the pods, I have a little cup and you, you put a scoop of coffee in there, and you put it with water and all that.

But here's the thing, it's a very touchy basket.

You can put in, you know, if you put in half a scoop, you'll be okay if you put a little more than half a scoop of coffee and you're okay.

Somehow that coffee machine knows the number of granules of coffee that you put in.

Yeah, because you think you've got it.

But if it's one granule too much as I'm getting the rest of breakfast ready, you suddenly hear the water, you know, couldn't get through the coffee and it is spilling out the other side and onto the floor.

So I'm a two time coffee loser today already.

But that's a tough morning.

It was but but again,

You now catch yourself and you go, wait, wait, wait, wait.

I can't go back to bed.

Parker wants to go back to bed.

He's not feeling well.

He can't go back to bed.

I can't go back to bed.

Otherwise, what would happen?

Yeah, we have worked.

Well, clearly what would happen is Tony and Alicia would burn the ground.

I know you've got the.

the comment sections filling up already without how their morning routine unfolds.

So I'm glad we could be here for it.

We just wanted to pull the curtain back a little bit and let you know that, you know, even when we're not at our best, and here's the thing, we're not at our very, very best, even though we did not stay up to watch an 18 inning baseball game.

My God.

Yeah.

I'm

I'm I

cannot tell you how happy I am the burgers are not playing in that game because I would have stayed up

Oh, how can you know that the temptation would be so great?

Yeah, you know you watch games last night.

Oh, I I I only I saw maybe an inning or two and oh, oh, yeah Shohei Otani hit a home run

Okay, yeah, he's he's still doing things and It is just I guess it was Wow, I didn't catch exactly what time I'm guessing from the play-by-play guy on the replay said just before midnight Which would have been just before 2 a.m.

Here.

Yeah,

when game ended.

Yeah, I was seeing that on Twitter Earlier this morning.

I was reading those like this post is from two hours ago.

Why did the what happened?

Oh, man, this is 609 pitches were thrown over six hours

and

39 minutes.

44 players in the game, including 19 pitchers.

All of that for Freddie Freeman to hit a home run in the bottom of the 18th, a walk off home run in game two of the double header is essentially what it was.

And the Dodgers take a two games to one lead.

And

The Shohei Otani Homer twice he doubled twice and by the way He's gonna be the starting pitcher in like 12 hours or

something like I read a quote from him after the game that was What what do you think?

Basically was a question and he said I think I'm going to bed as soon as I can

They have to because they kind of be back up to do this all over again Now now you had Max Scherzer

who was pitching for Toronto, he's going to be retiring.

He's been around forever.

He is an

instant Hall

of Famer.

Yes.

Well, I don't know if it was formal for it.

It's like everything but formal, you know, that that he's going to be done.

No, it's Clayton Kershaw, who has said he's retiring.

Yeah.

And I guess he made an appearance in the game.

So he had these two, you know, Hall of Famers who are in the game as well.

But I'm sure glad I didn't stay up for it.

That's all I get to say about that.

I clearly had it, although if I had, I'd have more of an excuse for, you know, breaking the coffee pod and trying to break the coffee maker, but I don't.

So we can't, we carry on.

Yeah.

It's done a sleep deprivation.

That was no, that was, that was just, again, I've pulled that coffee pod out a million times.

Don't you hate it?

Don't you hate it when?

When you, when you, when you mess something up that you've done.

precisely

like

thousands of

times.

How do you screw it up?

Look in your cupboard.

I mean, certainly for us, because I mean, we've been together for 40 years here.

And there's so many things that are no longer a set.

There's like, Oh, there's two glasses left from that set.

Sure.

One glass left from that set, one, you know, one or two bowls left from that set.

And so I mean, it happens over time, it's not an everyday occurrence, but we all break things.

But every time it happens at that moment, you think it's the dumbest thing you've ever done, you know,

Yeah.

And then you realize, no, no, I'm actually, I'm actually capable of much dumber.

Uh, just didn't happen this time around.

So anyway, uh, I did eventually get the coffee maker figured out on the single side.

So I do, I am, I am partially, but belatedly caffeinated.

So, uh, this is another, this is a different cup.

Parker's looking at the monitor.

I have a couple of different cups with photos of the grandkids.

No offense to your grandkids at a distance with how you were holding it.

It looked like a pig in a blanket.

And you don't want me to be offended by that.

This is true.

You are sick.

I'm going to turn your camera off over here.

You go back over there.

I'm going to tell people.

Yeah,

probably deserve

coming up today.

First, an invitation to contact us 85575 civic 8557524842.

The calls are rare in the early morning because Tony puts up on YouTube.

That's the day Parker was replaced.

No, no, no, no, no.

And Alicia putting every single bowl in my house is chipped in one way or another.

By the way, these folks and you all welcome to call 85575 civic 8557524842.

People go, Pat, you don't have you don't have a lot of college on here.

What's the deal?

Do you know what happens?

And I don't know if a lot of other hosts talk about this or not.

But it seems like I'll prattle on for a while and then somebody will go, Okay, I got to talk to him about that.

And invariably when they call, there's like...

eight seconds left before the commercial break or, you know, less than two minutes.

And I, there are other hosts who are really good about putting a call up and going, you know, caller, you got, you got 60 seconds go.

And it's always that awkward thing when it runs right into a commercial and you got to cut them off.

So I'm going to try to do a better job of saying at the start of certain segments, if we don't have a guest or other things is to say, Hey, the phones are open.

It's the start of the segment, call on in because we would love to hear from you.

We would also love to get your text messages and your voice notes.

using the Civic Media app.

Again, just download the app wherever you are and call or text or voice note from there.

Alicia says, it's loud where I'm at.

And that's why we have the comment sections.

And we love those.

We love it all.

We just want to make sure you know the phones are available to reach us as well as things on the app coming up today.

We're gonna be talking in just a little over five minutes here about the government shutdown and its impact on food assistance and And and that's the question why we've we've never had this issue before with government shutdowns But apparently it it has to be that way so we'll we'll get into that and then in our seven o'clock hour We're gonna be talking about the shutdown as it relates to the

National Park System, and that would include the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore.

And we have that here up north, and we have a guest from Friends of the Apostle Islands, Geoff Renneke, who's going to talk about the impact of the government shutdown that way.

In our eight o'clock hour, more about the shutdown as we talk to Courier Newsroom.

correspondent, Cam Stevenson, live from Capitol Hill to learn the latest on what is or is not going to be happening there.

And then we're going to be talking to Ruth Conniff from the Wisconsin Examiner.

And Ruth has a great column that's in the examiner and look forward at WisconsinExaminer.com about the controversy at the Department of Public Instruction, about how allegations of teacher misconduct are handled.

And those are very real concerns.

But Ruth Conniff also does a good job of putting things into perspective that in outlining what exactly is the process right now and how it may not be as monstrous as certain politicians are making it out to be because they're the same politicians who have declared war on the Department of Public Instruction.

By starving it of the funds it would need for staffing to look into things like this and oh by the way a couple of those Republicans Happen to be the ones protecting a president who wants to keep the Epstein files sealed up.

So maybe there's a little political drama Maybe there's a little hypocrisy that's going on and Ruth Conniff will put that all in balance for us We will hear from our friend James Kelly

He's at the Civic Media Newsroom here in the Chippewa Valley to talk about some of the stories that folks all over the state might want to know he's following in western and northern Wisconsin.

Dan Hagen will join us from NewsWatch 12, WJFW to tell us what he's covering up in the Northwoods as well.

Temperatures across the state range from the cold spot is up there in Ashland where Tony is at 27 degrees.

The warm spot is down in Racine where it is 50 degrees.

It is 39 degrees here in the Chippewa Valley.

Again, we'll talk about the government shutdown as it relates to

the shortages of food that are about to take place, including in food banks, because it turns out that for months, the Trump administration has canceled deliveries of food to food banks, so they're not equipped to help out in the coming crisis.

From the heart of America's up north, live from Lake Wissota, thanks for making this place to spend part of your mornings.

I'm Pat Kraitlo, this is the Civic Media Radio Network.

Tomorrow morning on the program, we will be joined by Ellie Bordeaux of Up North News.

She puts together our daily newsletter.

You can sign up for it over at upnorthnewswi.com and click subscribe up in the banner at the top of the homepage to get what she is putting together and out early every morning and Ellie will join us tomorrow, just after the news at seven.

to talk a bit about things that she has put in the newsletter and things that will not be in future newsletters as well.

We'd love to have you along as a subscriber.

Same goes for our weekend newsletter, Sunday mornings with Pat Critewell, and on there we took a look at the week in politics and include a question of the week.

And as I am continuing to discover, people are very divided.

on the topic of a nuclear power plant, whether there should be a new one built in Wisconsin.

There are plenty of people very passionate that we should not.

There are plenty of people who understand that there are risks, but with safeguards, we would have nuclear power that is not fossil fuel based and would not damage the climate.

So where do you come down on that?

You can send us a note through all the normal ways here, through the comment sections, through the Civic Media app.

But if you want to be able to answer first to get signed up for that newsletter, head to UpNorthNewsWI.com, click Subscribe up in the banner on top of the homepage.

All right, well, with the government shutdown, there's something happening that has not really happened before in a government shutdown that looks to be happening here shortly.

And that is snap running out of money, nutritional benefits for lower income families.

In past government shutdowns, there was agreement that look, we're debating other things about funding the government, but hungry families shouldn't go hungry, kids shouldn't go hungry.

Those benefits continue.

The only time it was ever in jeopardy was during the shutdown that happened during the first Trump term.

But again at the last moment it was it was saved this time around the Trump administration is hell bent on making sure that you know kids in lower-income families don't get enough food to eat and Refusing to budge even though there is additional money available.

There are supplemental funds The USDA could be using to apply towards snap benefits, but they choose not to Because the cruelty is the point of this the same goes for the

but the spike that's coming in health insurance premiums as a result of the government shutdown.

The government shutdown is happening because premium tax credits for the Affordable Care Act, the things that make health insurance more affordable,

in the Affordable Care Act marketplace are expiring.

This is extra help that was put in during the pandemic and it made a real difference to families.

It continues to make a real difference.

It's the kind of thing that frankly should have happened a lot earlier pre-pandemic to make health care more attainable, more affordable for families.

But

politics being what it is, you get the best deal that you can get.

And four years ago, there was this agreement in Congress, all right, we're going to have these enhanced premium tax credits, things that make these policies more affordable.

And we'll do it for four years.

That seems to be the best that we can do to get past Joe Manchin and Kirsten Sinema and, you know, anybody else.

So there they are.

And they're getting set to expire.

And now you've got people, Derrick Van Orden most recently saying, it was the Democrats that set it up to expire.

This is all they're doing.

Technically true.

But again, rewind the clock.

Let's go back.

2017, the first Trump administration and the massive corporate tax breaks, the massive tax breaks geared toward the very wealthy that were set to expire back in 2017.

They set it for eight years.

They're going to expire at the end of this year.

What did the Trump administration want?

They wanted those tax cuts to continue.

Some of them to be made permanent.

And that's what they got.

So it's not like they have to go away because you reach the end of a particular cycle.

If it's something that's worth fighting for, Republicans clearly thought it was worth fighting for the very rich.

And that's what they got done.

And now it's Democrats who are fighting for what they believe in, which is affordable health care.

Whose side would you rather be on in that debate, by the way?

The billionaires getting the extra tax cuts along with the corporations or the families who, like you, could be one job loss away or one cancer diagnosis or one car crash away from medical bankruptcy.

That's what Democrats are fighting for, and Republicans are so hell-bent on protecting

the health insurance companies and the corporate profits that come from it, that they would rather keep the government shut down than negotiate with Democrats and somehow keep trying to find ways to blame them.

So the premium credits are going away.

And the open enrollment period begins on November 1st.

That's this Saturday.

And some of the prices are already being released as far as

how much more it's going to cost Wisconsin families.

And the Office of Commissioner of Insurance put out some examples.

So here are some examples for you quick before we take a break here.

Family of four, income $130,000 a year.

And you're looking for a silver plan on the marketplace.

And you live in Eau Claire County.

And right now, thanks to those enhanced tax credits, that family of four pays $704 a month for health insurance, $700 a month for health insurance.

When those tax credits go away, come Saturday, if they want to renew, it's going to cost $2,700, not $700, $700.

That's $24,000 a year in higher health insurance costs.

In Racine County, it goes from $1,000 for that family of four to $2,400 a month for a total of $16,600 a year more that Republicans want you to pay.

If you're 60 years old and it's just a couple living together $85,000 a year income and you're say in You know Brown County currently cost you 600 bucks starting Saturday 2,700 bucks an extra $25,000 a year For a couple that's still five years away from qualifying for Medicare and Social Security And there's more I'll give you more throughout the coming days here examples of this is what Republicans actually want

They'd rather protect the health insurance company profits than to take your taxes and make health insurance more affordable for everybody.

Instead, they want to give it away to billionaires.

That's your money they're doing it with.

Today's history lesson is next.

I'm Pat Crightlow.

You're up north.

Today's history lesson begins with a little journey.

That of course is Steve Perry who made his debut with Journey this day in 1977 Playing with them for the first time in San Francisco with a song I believe dedicated to the city by the Bay there on this day in 1492 Christopher Columbus lands in Cuba on his journey to the new world and Figured he was in Japan

He was not in Japan, but it just goes to show you GPS has always been in necessity We're very lucky to have it when we do on this day in 1636 the Massachusetts Bay Colony voted to establish a theological college The college started this day in 1636 would later become known as Harvard University The number one song this day in 1978 was by Nick

Gilder

On this day in 1886, the Statue of Liberty was dedicated by President Grover Cleveland.

On this day in 1962, the Cuban Missile Crisis came to an end as Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev ordered the removal of Soviet missiles from Cuba.

That was 1962.

On this day in 1963, the Beach Boys released this little bit of school spirit.

So be true to your

school releases day 1963 includes part of the Hawthorne High School fight song where the Wilson brothers went to school.

On this day in 1919, the Volstead Act is passed by Congress.

You know it better as Prohibition.

The Volstead Act established a nationwide prohibition on alcohol.

Congress passed it overriding a veto by President Woodrow Wilson.

Happy birthday to country singer Brad Paisley who turns 53 today.

All

right,

let's look at some of the other birthdays here.

Parker, I don't know if you watch a lot of, what was it, Young Sheldon, where Annie Potts plays Mima.

Yeah,

sure.

And so there's a generation that only knows Annie Potts as, you know, kind of this older actress playing these grandmotherly roles.

And then some of us, you know, remember way back when she was on Designing Women and she's been acting for a very long time.

She is 73 years old today.

The late Charlie Daniels was born this day in 1936, passed away in 2020.

Microsoft founder Bill Gates is 70 years old today.

Actress Julia Roberts is 58 and actor Joaquin Phoenix is 51 years old today.

So going back to Brad Paisley's birthday, he's 53.

He was born this day in 1972.

On that day when he was born, Stevie Wonder released his 15th studio album called Talking Book with this track.

Superstition was one of the big singles off talking book and as was you are the sunshine of my life again, released 53 years ago today.

On this day in 1948, Chuck Berry got married.

He married Thometta Toddy Suggs and you know, a lot of rock and roll marriages, they don't last.

There's did.

Chuck Berry remained married until he died at the age of 90 in 2017.

That's a marriage that lasted 68 years.

On this day in 1985, the number one song was by Whitney

Houston.

1985 that it was the number one hit and go up just a couple of years to 1989 and at the top of the album charts you would find Jen Jackson with Rhythm Nation 1814.

I mean

Rhythm Nation was a blockbuster.

It had love will never do without you.

Of course, the Rhythm Nation title track escapade and much more again this day in 1989.

So that's about that's it kind of a slower day on the day for music and history.

You know, there's some days where it's like we don't need we need more than 15 minutes to cover all of this.

And some days we can just move right on to the national day calendar.

And so it's let's head back over to sick pay.

and see what Parker has to say about what we're able to find.

I'm fine.

I'm fine.

OK.

He's now seeing things.

What was on the National Day Calendar today?

National Day Calendar.

It is National Chocolate Day, Pat.

Are you a big chocolate guy?

Of course I am.

But here's where I take, again, we have a little fun with this calendar, but we don't have the staffing time to possibly look into this.

To collect everything that's on the national day calendar and how many different days are dedicated to chocolate?

There's always something chocolate it feels like every so often, or dogs.

How many different dog days?

There's a lot of dogs.

There's a lot of dog days on the calendar.

So

So apparently this is the overarching one.

It's just national chocolate day, not chocolate ice cream.

No, not chocolate pie, not anything like that.

Not not.

There's dark chocolate day, probably, you know, Belgian chocolate day, chocolate chip day.

It's just about the chocolate.

Just it as far as I know.

OK, that's what they tell.

Hey, that's fine.

I mean, for breakfast, like, you know, again, the whole secret to making chip of waffles here in Chippewa Falls.

is the little mini chocolate chips.

Oh, do you know what I saw in my kitchen this morning?

Apparently the, well, besides the chipped coffee pot.

Yeah, exactly.

Anyway, no, the grocery store apparently ran out of semi-sweet chocolate chips.

And so somebody brought home dark chocolate chocolate chips.

Are you thinking about

this?

I'm not a dark chocolate chip guy.

Oh my gosh.

It's fine.

It's fine.

It's fine.

Pat, Pat, Pat.

I am okay with dark chocolate.

I just prefer milk chocolate.

Milk chocolate over dark chocolate?

Yes.

Okay.

I'm starting to see what it is that has weakened your immune system to this point.

It's a need for dark chocolate and coffee.

Well, you

know the secret as Todd Alba discovered.

on air once.

The secret to enjoying the Lord is having dark chocolate after.

Oh gosh, that that time he tried Malort.

I don't even know exactly what Malort is.

No one does.

It's a torture device from what I understand.

But watching them try it is just oh my gosh, it was hilarious.

So you need to have that's the deal is you need dark chocolate after drinking some of that as well.

That's what I'm told.

That's what I hear.

I'm not going to try it.

Okay.

No, no, I'm not either.

I saw that.

I heard it.

It was it was disgusting.

There's so many other pairings where chocolate goes great.

Like when you discover the combination of chocolate and raspberries, for example, or chocolate and strawberries.

But I mean, a family tradition here at Casa de Craitlo is a chocolate cake with raspberry filling as as kind of the frosting in the middle.

I mean, that's just that's amazing.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Luke is asking on the text line.

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth, eat the chocolate and enjoy.

He says I would reference the Billy Madison scene with shampoo and conditioner bottles saying dark chocolate is better than milk chocolate but I don't know if Parker would get the reference.

Honestly, I don't either.

So I thought Parker might which is why I bring it up.

Swing and a mess for that.

All right.

Right

over there.

Tony, right on YouTube.

Oh, Lord is the spawn of Satan.

Yep.

That could very well be.

All right.

We've had enough fun with national chocolate day.

Is there anything more worthy of, of its own day?

We definitely have things more

worthy of their own day.

It is a national first responders day.

And

it is also national

immigrants

day.

Oh, very nice.

Good touch there.

Yeah.

I mean, especially the first responders, you cannot possibly say enough about.

A, how grateful we all are, and B, how there is probably, I'm guessing, a perpetual need for the next generation of first responders.

If you are interested in any way, shape, or form, it is something that you should consider pursuing, or at least learning more and seeing if it is the right field for you.

All right, so that's what's on the calendar for today.

Let's see what we can find in some entertainment news.

We don't make Parker Watch TMZ.

So he just finds this free form over the internet.

What should we talk about this morning?

It does largely come from TMZ, I will admit.

Oh, good.

Okay.

Yeah.

We have a viewer.

That's good.

Go ahead.

We have Kim Kardashian.

She suffered aneurysm, which was on the season premiere of season seven of the Kardashians.

Of

course it was.

Of course it was.

And she learned that this can be caused by stress.

She claims it comes from Kanye West.

What comes from Kanye West?

The

stress that caused her aneurysm.

Oh, oh, yeah.

Well, yes, if you were, if Kanye West were the father of your children and all that, yes, of course, you'd have perpetual stress.

I mean, at least she's got some reason to be stressful.

What else could it be that she's a celebrity, you know, that her daughter is a billionaire?

If there's anybody who should not have stress in their life.

It is Kim Kardashian.

But can Kanye West cause an aneurysm?

Yes.

Yes, I believe that he can.

I bet he's caused more than one.

Yeah.

There's a note here about Wicked.

Did you see the first movie?

I did not see it.

No.

I should have.

I meant to.

I like musical.

You should.

I believe if I saw the commercial right, Peacock is going to have it for folks that want to watch it before seeing the second one, which will wrap up the whole show.

It was already a long enough play on Broadway.

It was like three plus hours.

And they've now turned it into like five, six hours of movie time.

And so if you want to see the rest of it, you got to head to the theaters here soon.

So what's the entertainment note about Wicked today?

Ariana Grande, I believe she played Galinda in Wicked.

Her music career was basically stalled.

She did not really want to do music anymore, or at least didn't want to create any more albums, but Wicked let her find her creativity again.

So she's back.

She's made an album, and she's got a tour as well, all thanks to being in Wicked.

All right.

Well, hey, you never know what's going to spark something.

We talked about it with the, you know, Billy Joel documentary for a time he thought he was done.

And then, you know, something sparked a little bit of creativity here.

All right.

And lastly, in Parker's top three entertainment stories of the day,

Pat, I want you to guess who Katy Perry's new boyfriend is.

I know, I know, I know.

Oh, you know, because I watched GMZ.

Of course.

Again, for folks that are making a face at their radio.

I spend all day surrounded by the news and by politics and and Sherry spends the day surrounded by all kinds of medical crises.

And so we just want at the end of the day, we want to find the dumbest thing imaginable and turn our brains off.

And it TMZ is what did it for.

So that's how I know that Katy Perry's boyfriend is former Canadian premier Justin Trudeau.

And they're an adorable couple.

They are.

Are they?

I haven't seen.

I think it's great.

I hear that they were on a whale watching together.

Yes, they were.

They were.

And I'm happy for them.

They're happy.

Unlike Kim and Kanye, where Tony writes on YouTube, I bet Kanye tells Kim her kids look like pigs in a blanket.

I can't imagine the level of stress.

Kids?

What?

Tony?

Pigs in a blanket?

They're cute.

Tony off the top rope Oh coming down on Parker.

Oh, it's just a shame all the humanity much more coming up after the 7 o'clock news I'm Pat Cricklow.

This is the Civic Media radio network

Good morning, guys.

It's Cindy.

Aw, thank you.

That was Cindy.

One of Tony's little pigs in a blanket.

Joining us on the voice.

Pigs in a blanket are cute, okay?

Sure.

Yeah, you go with that.

On the text line from Laurie-Ann Hayward.

She writes, good morning, Patton Parker.

How coincidental that the Statue of Liberty was recognized on this day so many years ago, and today we celebrate National Immigration Day.

Wouldn't it be nice if ICE would take the day off and celebrate National Immigration Day?

Well, yes, and now I don't think it's a coincidence.

I think National Immigration Day was picked for just that reason, the Statue of Liberty's dedication.

But yeah, wouldn't it be interesting if it was just a national holiday that day to note the people.

for whom, you know, 99% of us are, you know, immigrants in some way, shape or form.

And that maybe we once again learn the value of immigrants to this country.

What we're seeing instead are a political class of people willing to want to make migrants the scapegoat for everything that falls them.

And they're celebrating.

that all this food assistance is being cut.

They are celebrating that health insurance costs are about to skyrocket because somehow it's all going to quote unquote, illegals and just other migrants.

When, I mean, I know it sounds harsh, but if only they're away, if we could just deport racists and bring in people who actually want to work hard and make a life for themselves in this country.

without having to basically take a dump on everybody else, worry about yourself, work hard, and maybe channel that anger toward the people who are really preventing you from flourishing.

And it's usually not immigrants.

It's usually somebody who wants to make sure that

their pain a tax rate as low or lower than yours that they can deny health insurance to you and your family and on and on it goes.

But if they can just get you thinking it's the immigrants instead that are the problem, well then they're the ones who are going to flourish that way.

And kind of a sign of the times here.

I've always enjoyed going to a parade of homes, seeing what's out there in any given community.

You know, the Chippewa Valley has a parade of homes and let's see in the Milwaukee area they do.

And I will, I do like seeing the homes and I do like seeing the homes that are maybe a little out of our price range, but they're nice to see anyway.

So I get that that's a feature of it.

But just something struck me kind of funny about this story in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel from Francesca Pica.

that says Menominee Falls mansion featured on Parade of Homes sells for $4.5 million.

The 9000 square foot home spent just weeks on the market before selling for four and a half million on October 14th.

And don't get me wrong, I'm happy for them.

I'm happy for the buyer.

I'm happy for the seller.

This is not about you know, nobody should be wealthy.

It's about the system itself that

has allowed us to get to a point where on the parade of homes, we now celebrate that there's this four and a half million dollar mansion that we can go see.

Meanwhile, we have an issue with affordable housing, the lack of it, the lack of space where starting families can live instead of paying rent.

This is where we've come at this point to have four and a half million dollar homes on the parade of homes.

Congratulations to all of them.

But boy, I would love to see the parade of affordable homes that a nice young professional family could afford to move into.

I'd love to see more of that.

Some sad news out of the Milwaukee area as well.

Long time news anchor for WISN channel 12, Jerry Taff has passed away at the age of 85.

Jerry Taff was known for his signature sign off good night and better tomorrows.

He died in his home state of Texas.

He was such a part of the TV dial and the radio dial frankly in Milwaukee for a long time.

He delivered the news for WISN.

From 1979 to 2005 He he and Kathy Michael being a host of other co-anchors, you know propelled Channel 12 to first place at 10 p.m.

You know knocking off per pitch perpetual juggernaut TMJ He was

He described Milwaukee as, you know, the place that he loves to be, even though he said, no places is especially totally feels like home.

He said in a 2005 interview, but Milwaukee feels more like home than any place else.

Jerry Taff was extremely polarizing for, you know, how they have those polls for favorite anchor and least favorite anchor in a given market.

He was second in the running for favorite anchor.

and first in the polling for least favorite anchor.

And even I will admit, from the four years we lived in Milwaukee, while Sherry was going to med school, he was kind of in acquired taste and that you weren't really sure if you liked this guy or not.

Then you realized, hey, he's just, he's doing his job.

He's got his own unique style.

And sometimes he's gonna say things in a way that maybe don't sit well with you.

We're still talking about Jerry Teff, right?

I'm not talking into a mirror here.

Anyway, you just learned that people have their quirks, and if you have quirks enough that some people gravitate towards you, you're going to do well in a given job, in a given market.

And that's exactly what Jerry Teff did, and again, passed away at the age of 85, but is going to be very well remembered by a Milwaukee TV audience for all that he did.

All right, let's look ahead to the rest of the morning here on mornings with Pat Crite low powered by up with news on the civic media radio network Now we will be talking to Dan Hagan from News Watch 12 WJF WTV in Rhinelander Who's not nearly as polarizing as other TV anchors that could name nobody doesn't like Dan Hagan and we'll be talking to him coming up in a bit We will also be talking to James Kelly who does the news for civic media out of our newsroom here in the Chippewa Valley And we'll be joined by Jeff Renneke from Friends of the Apostle Islands

The Apostle Islands is not a national park.

It's a national lakeshore.

But that still has some functions that can be impacted by the government shutdown.

And we will be asking Jeff more about that.

Then of course, in our eight o'clock hour, as usual, Courier Newsroom's Cam Stevenson will join us from Capitol Hill to let us know if there's any progress on resolving the government shutdown.

And then finally, we'll visit with Ruth Conniff from the Wisconsin Examiner.

All that more ahead, two more hours to go.

on these mornings powered by up North news on the civic media radio network.

I'm back right.

Cross Wisconsin on Civic Media.

You're listening to Mornings with Pat Craiglow powered by Up North News.

Now, for my Lake Mesota studio, here is the founding editor of Up North News, Pat Craiglow.

Hey, good morning.

Welcome back.

It's nice to have you here up north on a Tuesday morning, October 28th, 7.06 the time right now.

I'm here in Chippewa Falls.

Parker Olson is down in Madison Studio A2.

Little under the weather, but fighting through it, man.

And he's doing it without being powered by coffee.

I'm happy to report the single serving coffee maker did its trick.

I did not flood the kitchen.

I have an actual second cup of coffee.

Had a

boy.

Yeah.

See little victories for folks who missed an hour ago.

I broke the coffee pot early this morning.

It happens.

It happens.

Yep.

So lucky to have the little the dual thing.

I don't have any of the coffee pods.

but was able to measure it just right with the regular ground coffee and got it.

Thank you, Tony.

Yes, success.

I will absolutely claim that.

From Robin Tigerton, good morning.

It's clear 33 degrees in Tigerton, a beautiful day yesterday.

Spent some time doing yard work and said,

He watched the 18 inning World Series game that lasted six hours and 39 minutes and lasted until after 1 a.m.

And he's still up with us on the radio this morning.

Thank you, Rob.

Wow.

That was a I obviously I didn't watch it.

I woke up to news that the game went until almost midnight out on the West Coast when Freddy Freeman hit a walk-off home run in the bottom of the 18th inning.

I mean, so that was like two games and one.

Does that mean the Dodgers are up three games to one now?

Can you count that as two wins?

They

wish.

Yeah.

I mean, don't get me wrong.

I would love to be sitting here telling you, Oh, the Brewers won an epic game 18 Indians and they're they're up three nothing on the verge of a sweep.

But that's a fantasy land that, you know, that bubble burst for us a long time ago.

So instead, we have to take what we've got here and what we've got here is

I mean, an instant classic in terms of World Series games.

I'm just glad I didn't have to sit up for that.

That is that is impressive.

And I would love to know because I would love to have seen how many people hung around.

It's a World Series game.

Now, it's not a deciding game.

I get that.

But still, it's a World Series game.

And so how many people

We're just like, No, no, it's the 14th inning.

I got to go or it's the 15th inning or the people who are like in the seventh or eighth inning.

Well, this is fun.

But you know, LA traffic, I got to beat it.

I got to go home.

I don't know.

I bet there were a lot of people from the clip I heard it sounded

like

a lot of people.

Yeah.

Yep.

Uh, so yeah, there, there's your, there's your sports there.

I wish it was, I wish it was happier news, uh, from a brewery standpoint, but from a sports standpoint, that is a mighty impressive stuff.

There, there's still plenty of sports to talk about the, uh, Milwaukee bucks will be hosting the New York Knicks tonight.

Uh, then there's the Packers.

They will be hosting the Carolina Panthers next Sunday.

And again, don't be alarmed, but the, the Packer game is Sunday at noon.

You know when football used to be played regularly no

prime

time game no Thursday game nothing like that That's just straight up Packers and Panthers coverage begins Sunday at 10 a.m.

On civic media stations in Richland Center Park Falls Racine and Wathoma

There is also a college men's basketball from the Badgers.

The Badgers have a preseason game against UW-Platteville tomorrow at the Cole Center.

Coverage begins at 630 on stations in Richland Center, Amory and Wisconsin Rapids.

And if you're familiar with Badger men's hockey

On the radio, you know that it is over at WFHR in Hayward that they carry the Badger men's hockey team and they will be playing against the Minnesota Gophers on Thursday.

Coverage will begin at 730 on Thursday at WFHR in Wisconsin Rapids.

Go to WFHR.com for more sports programs because they don't just have some Badger sports.

They have lots of Badger talk shows.

There's like the Greg Guard show and other shows that they have as well.

So head over to WFHR.

that and then of course there's the second round of the high school football playoffs and so they those games will be on select civic media stations as well I'm sure so turn to your local civic media station to learn more did I mention the the Badger football team I didn't how utterly unforgettable I

do think they're off this week though to be fair

uh let me you know what I think you're you're right I think

mercifully they're not

playing

That's you know what and that's why there wasn't a time because you're right It's actually not this weekend.

It's the following weekend November 8th at Camp Randall when they are playing the University of Washington So that's so nice.

That's so nice

that they built in a nice little URD in the

Dumpster fire.

Let's not burn you anymore.

Let's let you cool off a little first.

Maybe it's called a mercy rule.

Yeah, you're getting an extra bye week just because we can't stand to watch you.

Why don't

you just take a little break?

They're really letting you gear up to play Washington.

Yeah,

yeah, might win this one.

So you get two weeks to prepare.

So again, we try not to get too deep in the weeds on sports talk, just enough for you to like engage in a conversation at work and sound a little bit like you know what's going on.

So

LSU Louisiana State University has been a bit.

Oh Parker Parker's about to give us a hot take on this LSU has been a football powerhouse for the longest time and they fired their coach Kelly I don't remember Brian Kelly Brian Kelly that's it and you know he's he's not a terrible coach and that's not a terrible program but down there it's like when or else and he's only the latest in several

high-profile football coaching firings in mid-season, which used to not be a thing, but now in this NIL era where players are getting paid, there's so much more money swirling around the system, so much more pressure to perform that you have universities this year that have been firing coaches, owing them tens of millions of dollars and saying that that's less expensive than having a losing college football program.

That's weird.

That's that's there's too much money in

there.

That's all I got to say about that.

That is the problem with college sports is that too much money is getting into it on a lot of different levels.

LSU, by the way, overall five and three this year.

They're not five

and three.

Yeah.

Fire a very expensive coach

to two and three in conference.

They're 11th place right now on the SEC.

So like, I guess there's an argument there.

Um, I would argue Brian Kelly should never have been hired and probably should have been fired from Notre Dame and probably shouldn't be allowed to coach after he basically killed the kid at Notre Dame, but

That's just

my thoughts on Brian Kelly

and

But there's a but there is a celebrity culture to coaching in the college football ranks and he will end up somewhere else.

I mean, that's just how the cycle works.

So eventually he becomes a TV analyst or something like that.

Now, not everybody is is into college football.

And some people are happy that the NBA season is underway.

Alicia puts on YouTube, I will be watching Detroit Red Wings tonight hockey is my jam.

Which is great.

Tonight, by the way,

Is one of those full schedule nights in the NHL all 32 teams 16 different hockey games to choose from tonight.

There will be baseball tonight It's and there was baseball last night.

What do they call it the sports solstice or something?

We're all four leagues are in action at the same time Yes, I think there's only one or two days a year

when when that's the case It's a beautiful day and I would bet I would wager that there is a conference USA

Football game on tonight.

So you could get a little sprinkle of college football in tonight, too.

Yes.

Yes.

So the, uh, I said solstice.

No, it's the sports equinox is what's going on tonight.

But you get, I mean, you get all the sports.

This is, if you're, if you're running like a sports bar or something, don't you like really play that up and say, come on in for our chicken wings and things like that.

Tony says, there's a word for it.

It's magical.

Yes.

It's a, it's a magical sports day.

It

is.

It's a very big day.

It's very

important.

Yes.

We were talking in terms of news headlines earlier about how the costs for health insurance policies under the Affordable Care Act are about to skyrocket and we're learning details of the extent to which that is going to happen.

Again, Republicans shutting down the government to protect health insurance company profits.

Now, I know there are people that disagree.

There was a comment earlier that said something along the lines of

Pat, you have the stupidest take on everything.

Health insurance companies only started making record profits after Obamacare was signed into law because it enabled health insurance companies to skyrocket prices since the government is paying the money.

Well, that is an interesting take on how that all worked out.

To say that insurance companies weren't making record profits before the Affordable Care Act came in is, again, a case of amnesia in history that continues to be fuddle me.

that folks have forgotten just how horrible it was before the Affordable Care Act, where you'd pay premiums of your hard-earned money all your life, you'd get sick and they'd say, oh, wait, you had a hangnail at the same time.

Sorry, thanks for paying your premiums, but the insurance doesn't cover that anymore.

Instead, under the Affordable Care Act, it was, we're going to use your tax dollars to make your health insurance more affordable for everybody, and health insurance companies have to take you on.

they can't deny you for pre existing conditions.

But as a result, they're also going to get more customers.

And yeah, they're going to make more money, but they're going to have to play by a tighter set of rules.

And at first people were like, I'm not so sure about this.

Now look at the polling for the Affordable Care Act.

It's off the charts because people understand how much better life is compared to then.

But it was not perfect, and should have been tinkered along the way.

But rather than trying to make it better, so that

Again, health insurance is affordable for everybody.

And so that there aren't these junk plans out there, Republicans just kept trying to kill it.

And now we're heading back to the days of junk plans.

That's when people go, hey, I never had a problem with health insurance.

Well, you never needed it.

Or if you did, it was for something kind of small.

And yeah, the health insurance company paid out for that.

But again, there were plenty of junk plans that seemed affordable until you actually had to use them.

And so again, there are ways that we could be making health care more affordable, and then there are ways we could be making health care more expensive.

Guess which way Republican politicians chose.

Now again, for people thinking that I'm being too mean and negative to Republicans, I simply ask this, what's the plan?

What's the plan?

What's the alternative?

I'm so damn sick of hearing repeal and replace, repeal and replace.

Where's the replacement?

Repeal and replace, repeal and replace.

Where's the replacement?

The market.

We saw what the market did.

The market took your money and then said, tough hop.

When you said, I've got this diagnosis and it's time for my health insurance to work.

These are the things we could be doing.

But here's what's happening instead in the state of Wisconsin.

If you are 60 years old, if you're a couple and your income is about $85,000 a year and you live in La Crosse County.

You are currently paying $606 a month for a silver plan.

I mean, that's still, you know, that's not a small chunk of change.

You're hanging on.

You got five more years till Medicare and Social Security check, you know, kick in $600 a month, 606 to be specific.

Starting Saturday, that same policy is going to cost $2,698.

Do you have an extra $2,100 a month lying around?

Because that's an extra $25,100 a year.

If you're just a 26 year old, and maybe you've seen that there's, you know, cancer in the family or something like that.

So you don't want to think you're not young and bulletproof.

You know, you need coverage.

Okay.

You're in Eau Claire County.

You've been getting a silver plan policy for $219 a month.

Starting Saturday, it goes up to $386 a month.

That's $2,000 a year.

As a 26-year-old making $48,000 a year, you have an extra 2,000 line around?

No, you don't.

So if Republicans don't like the way the benefits are set up right now, they could certainly work with Democrats to come up with something more affordable, but they're not choosing that.

They're choosing simply to let insurance companies jack these rates back up and let people flounder without any coverage, take a chance and risk more medical bankruptcy.

Where is the public service in that?

We're going to be talking about the shutdown impact on national parks and the Apostle Islands National Lakes short coming up.

I'm Pat Crightlow.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

It is 38 degrees right now here in the Chippewa Valley.

Let's welcome in Dan Hagen from NewsWatch 12, WJFWTV, and Ryan Lander.

Mr. Hagen, how are you?

I am doing great, Pat.

Good morning, Vietnam.

I've always wanted to do

that.

There you go.

It's been set.

Uh, how many days till the Berkey?

Were you telling me?

Yeah.

So 116, not that I have a calendar,

um, you know,

on my wall.

I

was able

to get out roller skiing this weekend.

I did eight miles Saturday, 12 miles Sunday.

And I'm actually going to go to a ski camp in British Columbia with my dad and my two brothers.

And we're going to ski if there's, well, there should be snow in late November.

So I'm really excited for that and just trying to get ready.

I would bet that there would be because I mean I I know there's snow at elevation like in Idaho because I got photos last week from my grandsons uh 19 and 11 years old and each of them got a big old mule deer and one of them got an elk and the photos are there you know they are they are in the snow covered mountaintops already so it's yeah

I'm feeling good

So can your son take me on hunting and maybe get me an elk or a deer?

The mule deer that he dropped, and I mean this thing was big.

I didn't ask about weight.

But the 11-year-old got this from 327 yards away.

Wow.

Now his dad, to be fair, his dad is a professional hunting guide.

and fishing guides.

So they have had years of tips and advice.

They are, you know, they're learning from the best.

That's still really impressive for an 11-year-old.

My dad tried to take me hunting when I was 11 years old and I was invited to go back and wait in the truck.

So, you know, I'm very proud of the 11-year-old and the 19-year-old for being able to do that.

But we're still waiting on the big one for you this season, right?

Yeah, that's right, you know, I didn't get the benefit of my dad teaching me because my dad shot some pheasants for my for my mom on date number two or three

Mm-hmm,

and she was she did not like that

So that was the end of his hunting career.

Wow.

The things we do for love.

He

also sold his motorcycle for the engagement ring.

So my dad, I wish I could have met him back then.

And now you're doing ski camp with him?

And now I'm doing ski camp with him.

And now

he's

a boring, boring man doing Whirtle and the mini Crossford every morning.

And still kicking your butt, you know, in the, in the, yeah.

And so, and yet you're, you and I thought maybe you'd go to ski camp without him to try to, you know, learn from him.

And I play it.

Okay.

Here's the truth about, you know, television and you know this, Pat, you

know,

we hammered up a little bit, right?

I hammered up a bit.

I, I.

My favorite thing to do is to ski with my dad, but the people seem to enjoy the rivalry, so

I

like to play it up.

Oh, no.

Of course, it's all in good fun.

Looking at some of the news you're covering here, and it is, there's never been an easy time to be a public library.

There's always budget pressures and things like that.

And there's one that is on the Marathon Clark County border that is facing its own unique situation.

What's the story out of Dorchester?

Yes, so I would invite anyone to look at a map of the Clark and Marathon County border and you'll find that there are four villages that exist in both counties and it's just kind of an anomaly, but unfortunately it's partly leading to the Dorchester library's potential closure because

more people from Marathon County come to the Dorchester Library than Clark County.

And this includes sending items, you know, to different libraries as well.

But the Clark County Board of Supervisors is going to stop reimbursing libraries from materials sent to Clark County.

And you might be wondering, well, why isn't Marathon County

doing this.

Well, it's also not to use the word again.

It's an anomaly as well.

Marathon County is not doing this reimbursement because Clark County and Marathon County made a deal in 2000 that they're just going to, they're about the same amount of people are using library materials from each other's counties.

So let's just zero it out.

But now that has become an imbalance with more and more people from Marathon County using Clark County materials.

So if the rule, this new rule was in place last year, Dorchester library would have lost $16,000.

So it's reasonable to think they're going to lose another around $16,000 this year, all because of kind of this finicky rule and this finicky location of the library.

So the Dorchester librarian is trying to rally people to go to the next County Board meeting and see if there can be a change for this.

Well, maybe so, but also what a what a stinging indictment for residents of Clark County.

Hey, Clark County folks, why don't you read more?

Well, you know, there's a population imbalance as well.

Okay.

But yeah, it's not just that it's something where you could again like anything else in politics We just talked about this with the affordable character and everything else you come back and revisit things you tinker with things you make things work That that's what government is supposed to do not just in Congress, but even at the county board level.

Yeah, we struck this deal in 2000 Let's revisit it.

Let's see how it's working right now.

I mean you and I've covered enough of these things We know that there is a deal that can be made.

It's all a matter of will these particular people

In this case, in these county boards, will they figure it out?

And that's no doubt what you and your team are watching.

yeah and libraries man they're just an amazing thing right you can

go there

there's no say there's no pressure of being sold something it's free and it's for everyone so yeah important resource

uh yeah and and again related to that would be my usual rant about shared revenue coming from the state legislature and again you can go to any municipal official any county official and they will tell you about the impact of decreased shared revenue from this legislature and the impact that it has on local property taxes and then on local

services and we'll certainly harp on that, you know, repeatedly at other times in the future.

But in our final few seconds here, you got Halloween coming up.

Is Halloween a big deal for you?

It's on a Friday night.

Are you gonna, are you a candy hander otter?

Are you a party goer?

I will be a party goer.

I don't know if you've seen Adventure Time, but I will be going as Ice King.

Ice King from Adventure Twin.

You might want to look down on that

pass.

I was going to say, you've lost me on all counts, but Parker liked it, so.

I have an image in my head of what I vaguely remember that to look like.

Got it.

All right, Dan Hagen, catch him on WJFW News Watch 12 out of Rhinelander at WJFW.com.

Thank you, Dan.

Appreciate it.

Bye, everybody.

All right.

Have a great day.

And coming up next, we'll talk to Jeff Renneke from Friends of the Apostle Islands, impact of the government shutdown up north and on national parks all around the country.

I'm Pat Crightlow.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

Welcome back at 735 on a Tuesday morning, October 28.

Nice to have you along.

Hey, get signed up for our UpNorth News daily newsletter.

Head over to UpNorthNewsWI.com.

Click subscribe and the banner at the top of the homepage.

Included in today's edition is a link to my story about the Trump administration giving a big old no.

to Wisconsin for some of the disaster relief that was applied for following massive flash flooding in August in southeast Wisconsin where some places got more than a foot of rain and there was all kinds of damage done to houses and so individual disaster relief had been approved.

But the Trump administration rejected Wisconsin's application on behalf of six counties for infrastructure damage that was caused to public buildings and roads and bridges and things like that.

And you might say, well, that's fine.

I mean, as long as the individuals got their disaster relief for their homes, who cares about the infrastructure stuff?

Well, it's still got to be fixed, which means that instead of it being, you know, helped.

instead of some of it being paid for in part by the federal government.

It means it's all going to fall on local taxpayers or state and local taxpayers as the case may be.

So you can read more about that in our newsletter.

Again, sign up at UpNorthNewsWI.com.

All right, time to go way up north as we do this time every other Tuesday.

And this time around, we're getting to know our friend Jeff Renneke from Friends of the Apostle Islands to talk about the government shutdown and its impact on our national parks.

Jeff, good morning.

How are you?

Good morning, Pat.

Always good to be here.

I wish we'd have some good news on National Park some morning.

I really, you know, we're going to, we're going to get there again.

But right now we've been dealt this hand, which deals with a government shutdown and letting people know of the impact, you know, here in Wisconsin and beyond.

So

I guess the best way just to start is to ask from a general standpoint, as you look at things across the country, how are our national parks faring during the shutdown so far?

Our national parks are a very diverse collection of landscapes, as you know, from mountain tops to deep canyons, from seashores to, you know, deserts.

And so it's not surprising.

I don't think that the impact of the shutdown is hitting different parks in different ways.

And it didn't help so much that the Department of Interior sent out kind of a confusing contingency plan for parks, literally only hours before the shutdown.

And in that contingency plan, they told parks that while the National Park Service will be conducting no park operations and offering no visitor services, the outdoor areas, trails, exhibits, and overlooks will remain generally accessible.

to visitors.

So in other words, most of the buildings in national parks are closed, visitor centers, museums, that sort of things.

You can still maybe get to the trails, bathrooms may be locked, trash pickup may not be happening.

In some parks, it's become really free for all because of the lack of emergency services and search and rescue.

In one park,

An American flag was hung upside down in the distress symbol of our national parks.

So it's not a good situation in our parks right now.

No, I mean, and it leads not only to maybe trash piling up and programs not being run, but safety concerns and also concerns about damage.

Have there been any reports of damage with the lack of rangers in the parks?

Unfortunately, yes.

I mean, you have to put it in perspective that...

some 9,000 National Parks Service employees have been laid off.

These are often the frontline people that would be out there keeping an eye on things.

So there's examples like squatters coming into National Park campgrounds, ignoring the time limits and just setting up home.

There's illegal base jumping going on in Yosemite, some off-roading situations in various national parks.

And the situation is expected only to get worse.

During the last extended shutdown, there were things like rock art panels that were vandalized at Big Bend.

Joshua trees were toppled in that park.

You know, our parks don't run themselves.

Leaving the gates open with no rangers inside is a very strange way to run a business.

When you think about it, the national zoo is closed.

The Smithsonian Institute museums are closed, the Air and Space Museum.

And when you would ask why, they would probably say, well, there's nobody inside to protect the resources.

Well, there's nobody inside to protect the resources of our national parks either.

And that's a situation that could lead to

disaster.

And it's such a perfect way of looking at it.

I mean, you wouldn't leave the museums and things open and say, well, we just trust you to be good with the paintings and, you know, not let the trash cans overflow.

So has it led to any kind of formal call to close up some of these parks so that they stay protected?

You know, it's a difficult decision.

Everybody understands that.

People love our national parks, their economic engines.

Even this time of year, some parks like Shenandoah National Park, the Great Smokies and others, they get up to 25% of their visitation in October because people coming to check out the beautiful fall colors.

So it's a very difficult decision, but most people in the field say they should be closed when there aren't rangers.

There was recently a...

group of 40 national park former superintendents and directors who sent the letter to the secretary of interior asking that the parks be shut down and another letter by 450 former rangers saying that this can't go on the parks are too fragile without the folks who are

hired to take care of the parks inside of them.

Our parks simply won't run themselves and some of the parks have shut down.

The iconic Carlsbad Caverns National Park, the caves there are protected, mirror woods, white sands.

They're pretty much shut down but in the meantime others remain open and therefore vulnerable.

So let's take it a little closer to home and we're talking to Jeff Renneke from Friends of the Apostle Islands and let's talk about the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore up north here.

And again, it's maybe not an apples to apples comparison with some of our national parks, but I have a feeling the shutdown still has impact.

Even at a place like that, that is a little more, you know, seasonal in its operations.

What's happening up there?

Yeah, that's a really good point.

You know, our park is very seasonal.

So if you were to come here as a visitor right now, you would find the visitor center in Bayfield closed, the visitor center at Little Sand Bay closed, but then they always closed.

It wasn't because of the shutdown.

It was because of the seasonal nature of visitation.

But that doesn't mean that things are fine in the park.

Think of all the things that go on behind the scenes in that visitor center.

There's no park planning.

going on.

There's no staff training.

There's no hiring going on.

There's no cataloging of artifacts.

There's no continuing wildlife research.

There's an awful lot that happens at our parks that people don't see to make them run as smoothly as they do when there are a lot of visitors there.

So just because a park isn't necessarily looking a lot different doesn't mean that there's not damage going on behind the scenes.

We need to get our parks.

open and funded or closing down.

Now Jeff, there's a website friendsoftheapostleislands.org and you recently wrote a story for the website about the government shutdown and the things that you might or might not see at the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore and you address the construction of a Myers Beach accessible walkway project.

What is happening with that?

Yeah, that's another good example.

So friends of the Apostle Islands with the help of more than 500 donors and sponsors raised almost $800,000 to

be part of our commitment to help the park be more accessible to all.

And so we got approval to replace the 45-step stairway down to the popular Myers Beach kayak launch with a all-accessible ramp.

It's all paid for.

It's all ready to go.

All we need is a rubber stamp from the park service.

Unfortunately, the park service is closed and so that rubber stamp won't happen.

until it reopens.

And up here we have a very short construction season.

So every day that goes by may limit our ability to get that done in one season.

So things don't stand still just because the park is closed.

So you'd want to start this next spring and finish it by next fall and... That would be the plan, yeah, and that's not

going to happen if we can't get it out to contractors for bids and have them poised to go as soon as the weather is decent.

Yeah, again, like in all these things that Jeff was pointing out, there are plenty of things that happen behind the scenes that aren't going on right now as well.

There's also the case where...

Again, because there's no staffing and people are still going into these areas, you know, they're not paying the fees that they would normally pay.

But there are some folks that still understand that without the fees, there won't be support for the upkeep, for the programs, for the maintenance and everything else.