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You're listening to Mornings with Pat Kratlow powered by Up North News.
Now, for my Lake Minnesota studio, here is the founding editor of Up North News, Pat Kratlow.
Welcome back on this Friday morning, as some of us get an early start to the Labor Day weekend.
And so we're sharing some highlights from this summer.
Don't worry, we still have a current event as well.
Free ticket Friday.
And I'll have today's keyword for this August 29th, coming up in a little bit.
First, some notes about our morning show, marking its three year anniversary a few weeks back.
And then we hear from the mayor of Superior, Jim Payne, about an exciting new expansion of high speed or broadband internet service.
because Wisconsin communities shouldn't have to just wait around and hope a corporation somewhere decides to put a boost into the local infrastructure.
More ahead as well, but first, somebody put some candles on a cake.
We appreciate you spending the last three years here because today is the third anniversary
of when I started doing radio here for Civic Media.
Parker Olson was in middle school at the time, three years ago, and he's come a long way since then.
graduating and everything, so how are you doing?
It's it's just it's a mood killer.
I'm not gonna I'm not gonna lie.
Yeah, it would it should be beautiful out there and We haven't been able to really take a boat ride yesterday with the rain, you know done for a few days here I took the top off the Jeep we went for a ride But within the first couple of miles our eyes were really itchy and burning from this because this is serious stuff here
So, folks, take it easy out there.
I know that the weather is otherwise, you know, positive, but this smoke is a big negative, and it is not something to necessarily joke around with.
If a young, virile man such as Parker can get headaches from this smoke, it can do a lot more damage to the more fragile of us, shall we say.
But first, happy anniversary to me.
I went back and pulled up the script.
from the first show and wanted to see what has changed and what's what's different.
We started three years ago today and I wouldn't have even thought about it but you might have heard Chad Holmes bring it up the other day appearing here with us and he was talking about he was a cognizant of the three-year anniversary that he started on August 1st 2022 and I looked and I said oh wait a minute yes we did we did start that day didn't we and
So I pulled up the notes here from show number one and I always I always begin something new with the old Dave Garrow a line when he started the today show when he said Well, here we are and good morning to you now, which is what I said three years ago.
He said I Said his uncle Joe would say folks.
It's a new week.
It's a new month.
It's Monday, August 1st I said at the time and it's time for a new show
one we hope will become part of your daily routine.
The state of Wisconsin, I said, has long been in need of a show based not out of Milwaukee or Madison, but a place where we can come together up north.
And of course, you know, up north is always up for debate.
And I certainly acknowledge that.
I said, we're going to base it here on Lake Wissota.
It's a nice place to start.
And I said, we hope this makes you
We hope it's a place that makes you feel like you can take a coffee break with us, the good kind.
Not where you're in a coffee shop and overhearing the latest conspiracy theory and wondering where people get that stuff.
We're going to deal in something really old school here.
Facts, not alternate facts, actual stuff.
More about the actual makeup of, you know, day-to-day life here in Wisconsin.
And I also made note at the end of the show three years ago.
I said, I will try to come up with a catchy sign off tomorrow.
I don't have one today.
Well, here we are exactly three years and 614 shows later, and I still don't have a catchy sign off.
Luke Mathers brought it up again the other day.
We keep talking about merchandise and things like that.
And he's like, you know, Todd, everybody else has a catchy sign off, but you.
Yeah, it just it's never been at the top of my list, you know,
that doing that marketing thing.
It's not the most important thing
I don't know.
Yeah, I know.
I do have that.
That's a that's a fine toss to commercial break.
But it's not exactly the kind of thing you'd put on, you know, a tote or a coffee mug.
As I. Yes, I have my Roy Kent coffee mug.
As
I always do on Friday.
So we're we're still working on the catchy sign off.
Ideas are welcome.
We have an electronic suggestion box called the comment section Facebook and YouTube you can send us an email radio at upnorthnewswi.com Let's see Roger and Stevens point is on Facebook going whoo.
It's finally Friday and Tony Tony asks if this is an Irish coffee break.
It is not It is tempting sometimes, but it is not
Well, that's what I said at the time of that clip, and the statute of limitations has expired on that by now, right?
Right, maybe?
Okay.
Anyway, before our next clip takes us up to Superior, let's look ahead to next weekend.
Yeah, I know we're heading into the Labor Day weekend, but you've got your dance card full already, I'm sure.
It's that weekend after Labor Day that sometimes gets overlooked.
And you can find some great things to do as well.
These are all found at the Travel Wisconsin website.
Right here close to me will be the Chippewa Falls Barbecue Fest.
I like ribs.
I like barbecue.
That'll be at the Northern Wisconsin State Fairgrounds.
The Bayfield Festival of the Arts is going on next weekend.
The National Walleye Tour Championship in Marinette.
There's the Strollen Middleton Jazz Festival.
The Economowalk Fall Festival.
the Fondue Fest and Fondulac.
I see what you did there.
Fondue Fest and Fondulac.
The Lena Lyons Dairy Fest.
There's Osceola Wheels and Wings.
The Granton Fall Festival.
Platteville Dairy Days.
And One County Fair.
Again, these are all for next weekend.
Richland County.
has their fair next weekend.
And then that's not even the last one.
There's one more left the following weekend.
That'll be from September 10th to the 14th in Vernon County.
That'll wrap up county fair season around Wisconsin.
And then the leaves really change.
Anyway, let's talk about technology up in the Twin Ports part of our state.
Well, we're certainly not the first to recognize the need for high speed, reliable and affordable access to the internet, but we're the first
city in Wisconsin the first community of any kind to create a publicly owned.
Open access broadband network there is no other network of our kind in Wisconsin and it's a unique public private partnership where we own the actual network the physical network.
And we sell internet access to private internet service providers who in turn sell it to customers so they compete.
freely on our network the same way multiple delivery services UPS FedEx U.S.
Postal Service compete on the roads that the city builds.
So it combines public infrastructure with private competition.
And that I'm glad to hear that explanation because when I first heard about it it made me wonder about a law that the Republican led legislature passed several years ago that essentially was a ban on
municipal networks, especially Wi-Fi networks, again, not wanting the public sector to compete with the private sector.
A lot of people were upset by that, saying, hey, look in some of these smaller communities, the private sector isn't coming up here anytime soon.
They're only going to want to serve the big cities.
So why block local units of government that want to provide this kind of service?
It sounds like you have found the right path through of you're not the internet provider, but you have made it easier for the private sectors to come up here and extend service that they otherwise wouldn't do on their own.
Does that sound about right?
The biggest difference is people don't have to come here to provide the internet.
People are already here that can provide the internet.
So because all we require people to do is be an ISP, they don't have to own this gigantic physical network, a multi-million dollar investment.
That allows small businesses to go into business selling the internet to customers.
So one of our first ISPs came from Duluth, Minnesota right next door and is now headquartered in Superior.
It's a really small
They only serve this community on our network.
So what we did is rather than have a giant monopoly, which was what almost every city in the country has, selling us internet at whatever price they want.
Our monopoly spectrum, they actually raised the price of the internet.
during the pandemic.
That was a kind of, we just saw that as unconscionable.
How can you exploit people that way?
So what we did is we combined what I thought is the best of the political philosophies on the left and the right.
We believe in private sector competition to lower prices and increase innovation, but the public should own infrastructure.
We shouldn't allow the private sector to control infrastructure that is vital to modern life.
And so that's what we did.
We just combined the two and we're two weeks in and it's already a hit.
And is it a network that is accessible to everybody in the superior area now or is it starting in one area and building out?
It's actually my neighborhood.
I'm talking to you on it right now and the
So it was meant to show skeptics that this could actually work.
One of the early successes, though, is our construction costs actually came in so far under budget that we're building out much faster than we had originally planned.
So we will be lighting up the next neighborhood already this fall.
And how is it that the city was able to afford to do its part of this public-private partnership?
The ARPA dollars that came to every community in the country.
What a lot of people forget is that
the ARPA dollars, which have been used for so many different things across the country, were primarily meant for utility infrastructure.
And the first utility described in that law is access to broadband.
And so we just took them at their word and we used it to build a network.
And so the first $5 million plus of this network was covered by that bill.
So President Biden had this American recovery plan and had a mission for it.
And you took that literally and seriously and made it work.
It sounds like perhaps the most textbook case of ARPA funds doing what they were intended to do at the
Exactly.
In fact, we've been trying to build this network.
since before the pandemic.
But the pandemic proved every single argument we made correct.
When we had to send people home from work, send children home from school, and they did not have access to the internet, that meant they didn't go to school, Pat.
That's what it meant.
And people are still trying to pretend like that didn't happen.
We lost a generation of kids that should have been educated and weren't because they didn't have access to this vital public infrastructure.
The Biden administration gave us money to solve that problem, make sure that never happened again, and that's what we spent it on.
That's incredible.
And you said another neighbor is coming.
How long do you think it might take for most, if not all of the city to be served?
You asked me.
I'd like to get it done in the next two years.
But, you know, we have to prove that it's a success.
I think we're already doing that.
Like I said,
We need to get to a 10% take rate.
10% of the area should be customers by the end of the year.
I think we're going to cross that in the next month.
And if we can show real success by the fall of next year, I think we'll have justified moving quite a bit faster than our original forecast of five to seven years.
Superior Mayor Jim Payne with a great update from way up north.
Jim, thank you so much.
Good to talk to you again, Mr. Mayor.
Have a wonderful day.
Always fun.
Thanks, Pat.
Coming up, I get into an explanation of why your health care costs are about to go up, even though some guy was promising last year that if you elect him, health care costs were going to go down because he had concepts of a plan for the Affordable Care Act.
First, for Free Ticket Friday,
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On this Friday, August 29th, the Milwaukee Brewers begin a short road trip, a three game series in Toronto to face the Blue Jays tonight and then Saturday and Sunday afternoons.
Then they fly home for a Labor Day game against the Philadelphia Phillies, taking Tuesday off back again against the Phillies Wednesday evening and Thursday afternoon next week before next weekend's road trip to Pittsburgh and then Texas.
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There was an announcement over the summer about health care costs that will hit all of us, whatever our level of coverage, and it led me to offer up this breakdown of how we got to this point.
The
Trump administration, the election of Donald Trump has a lot of significance.
Again, a lot of things that folks warned were coming that a group of people hostile to the Affordable Care Act are going to make sure that it's not as affordable.
And that's exactly what is happening now as health insurance companies say that their premiums will be going way up next year for people who buy their insurance on the Affordable Care Act marketplace.
An analysis from KFF, formerly known as the Kaiser Family Foundation, showed that the average person who buys affordable care act insurance will be paying 75% more for their premium.
And of course, a big reason for that would be the reduction in the subsidies and the enhanced subsidies that came during the pandemic that helped make health insurance more affordable.
with Republicans controlling Congress and the Trump administration wanting those subsidies to go away.
As one example, if someone is paying $60 a month for their health insurance this year, it's going to be more like $105 a month next year.
And as National Public Radio reports, people who are generally healthy might well decide that the higher premium is not worth it.
They will go without health insurance.
And then they're going to get sick.
injured.
With that many more people and estimated four million more people without health insurance, it's going to lead to higher bills for them, or if they can't pay it, it's going to lead to higher premiums for all the rest of us because there will be more uncompensated care.
And as more healthy people opt out of the market, the insurance pool will be left with those who cost insurance companies more, people who can't afford to go without health insurance, and so
their premiums will go up again.
And as much as Republicans have been crowing about this, and now they're, of course, referring to this as, well, this is just the unsustainable skyrocketing cost of Obamacare, according to Senator Bill Cassidy, Republican of Louisiana.
Well, yeah, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
If you attack the Affordable Care Act and make it less affordable,
It makes it easy for you to say, gosh, look how expensive Obamacare is now.
Yeah, because of you.
To which I again have to remind people and never going to stop reminding people.
The Affordable Care Act, derided by Republicans as Obamacare, is a Republican idea.
It was created by a Republican think tank that did not want single payer.
and or government run health insurance.
And so the idea was to continue using the private marketplace, but just help people afford private insurance.
That's all the Affordable Care Act is at its heart is, again, pooling our resources to help everybody have health insurance because we all save when we're all covered or we all pay
When more Americans aren't covered it is actually that simple and That's where the Republican idea came from and where the Obama administration said, okay We'll try that at least as a start and we can always work to improve it later We can add a public option for example Have have something like Medicare for all or Medicaid for all that
covers Americans and have them compete.
If the private sector of health insurance thinks it's so good, they shouldn't be afraid of competition.
I mean, isn't that what we hear about public schools all the time?
Is that they shouldn't be afraid of a little competition?
But thanks to the late Senator Joe Lieberman,
who withheld his vote, Democrats had to pull out the public option.
So there is not one in the Affordable Care Act.
And so it's all about these private companies.
And if they're not getting premium subsidies from the federal government, of course, they're going to jack up their rates.
So once again, we are living that whole lesson of those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it.
And so we are about to repeat the cycle of higher premiums.
and people deciding to go without insurance, and then ending up with big medical bills, and then ending up with more medical debt and more medical bankruptcies, and more uncompensated care, which is gonna put more hospitals and clinics out of business, and it's gonna raise premiums for all the rest of us.
That ain't doom and gloom, folks.
That's exactly what people tried to tell voters last year, and whatever the result last November, they chose the way they did,
And this is what's going to happen going forward as we're now seeing from these new estimates on what's going to happen with health insurance premiums on the Affordable Care Act marketplace coming up next year.
Let's turn now to a shameless plug for the things we refer to around here as metrics.
You're familiar with ratings for radio and TV and those things are very important, but now there are so many ways to listen and watch things that there's more than just a ratings number to measure.
There are live streams through apps and websites and social media viewers who watch live or click later on to enjoy a show.
There are those who hit subscribe to show they want to stay up to date on certain shows.
There are podcast subscribers and downloads, and now more shows than ever also have newsletters that let you follow more of what we're all covering.
So before we come back and talk about how the fight for the climate is now being fought in courtrooms, here's my ask that you follow our show as a podcast on Spotify and subscribe to one of the up-north news newsletters at our website.
I'm Pat Krightlo, this is the Civic Media Radio Network.
Quick reminder here that UpNorth News is a separate entity from our friends at Civic Media.
UpNorth News is part of Courier, a pro-democracy newsroom with outlets in several states, including Wisconsin, also affiliated with several newsletters, podcasts, video series.
Let me tell you about a couple of them really quick.
You know, our friend Mark Jacob is here on Friday mornings.
He has a newsletter called Stop the Presses.
All about how right-wing extremism has exploited the weaknesses in American journalism and what we can do about it.
And then there's Control Alt-Right Delete by Melissa Ryan, a weekly newsletter that is also devoted to covering the rise of far-right extremism, white nationalism, disinformation, and online toxicity.
So get those and all the other products put forth by Courier over at couriernewsroom.com.
So we mentioned Mark Jacobs normally here on Fridays.
So is Jim Santel a former US Attorney, but he's with us right now along with Melissa Baldoff for this week's climate check.
Melissa, good morning.
How are you?
Good.
It's nice to introduce you to Jim here because we've been talking a lot about how since the Trump administration took office, there's a
We don't get to talk anymore about initiatives coming out of Washington DC, coming out of Congress.
And so instead, the battle for a better climate has moved to the courtrooms and Jim's going to fill us in on cases across the U.S.
and frankly across the world.
But Melissa, let's start with you just to illustrate that look, even when there's a hostile entity like a president or a Congress,
There are still different ways to do work.
We've said at the local level, for example, courts are another option.
There's always an opportunity to try to do better and try to have a better, I guess, planet for lack of a better term.
There are always opportunities.
You just look to the local and state governments that we see doing work.
You look at
neighborhoods and communities who are committed and who haven't given up and are continuing the fight and are not letting what's happening at the federal level stop them from continuing to move forward because what we can't afford to do is put
put our progress on hold for four years because we don't have partners in in dc anymore uh we know that's not what the rest of the world is doing um you know they're going to be uh you know leaving us behind um we're going to be outliers here again uh by not taking the climate crisis seriously and by um you know refusing to acknowledge it um and by you know uh in fact the trump administration yesterday um you know
moving to, you know, repeal the, you know, scientific declaration that acknowledges that humans are driving climate change.
You know, they don't want to acknowledge anymore the just basic science.
So, yeah, we are having to look to others.
to see that progress because we're not seeing it from the federal government.
Which really makes it an issue, Jim, of justice.
And so we can talk about the US cases in a sec, but you are the one that alerted me that even the world court is involved in the climate crisis to a degree.
Tell us what they have been doing and talking about there.
We sometimes call it the World Court.
It's at the Hague.
And just last week, a 15-member panel of the court, a unanimous court, basically said an awful lot of things in the legal sense that Melissa just commented about.
They find that the failure of nations, yes, that includes us, but failure of nations across the globe to take action to protect our climate system generally,
may constitute, as they said, an internationally wrongful act.
That's an awful lot, awful close to coming to describing that kind of conduct as criminal.
Also finds the production of the environment as a precondition for get this, ensuring human rights and cited the support of by governments of fossil fuel production as a potential violation of human rights.
And again, this is the first time that the world court
This is a part of the United Nations has spoken out about this.
It is a big deal, and it plainly sends a message that legitimate judicial people looking at this, they just roll out beds some morning, they conducted hearings, they had what we would call trials, and they come up with this conclusion not only about the obligation, but if you don't do this, what you're doing not only to the planet, which is number one, of course, derivatively us, and also to human rights, which is a fascinating way of looking at that,
as Melissa just said, then we've got juxtaposed to that, our environmental protection agency here in this country going in just the opposite direction, rescinding this 2009 notion, um, endangerment finding.
It's the basis on which all of our attempts and our, uh, uh, undertakings to address greenhouse gases have proceeded.
It's basically that way of, of ensuring that tailpipe emissions are somewhat reduced.
That
the EPA is rescinding and for that reason the rules that would encourage electric cars and encourage a diminution of our air pollution that we're abandoning here in America.
Completely different approaches, one playing the completely wrong, one sending us some inspiration and some motivation to do something about this horrific problem.
And Melissa, when we talk about this from a human rights and a legal standpoint of other nations being wronged, there are different ways to come at this.
It's not just that in some other nations, smaller nations, that now their air is dirtier.
But frankly, I can say this from my short time living in the Cayman Islands and in other countries, they did not do anything to exacerbate the fact that sea levels are rising.
and endangering, you know, their very way of life, their very way of life.
And it's no longer like some incidental thing like, oh, we didn't understand that our smokestacks were going to cause problems for your countries.
they now know the science is there.
So I feel like there's for laymen like you and me, there is a strong underpinning for a case to be made in court about, you know, getting countries to be more responsible with their emissions with their output with their conduct overall.
This isn't a situation like you said, where we were not aware.
You know, the US is one of the
We're one of the biggest polluters in the world and we are very aware of what we're doing.
The science is there, everyone, for the most part, maybe I guess not everyone, but most people are acknowledging that this is what is causing the emissions or what's causing climate change and causing these adverse health impacts that are leading to
adverse economic impacts, and we're aware
of
There's no argument that anyone is presenting.
There's no serious fact-based, evidence-based arguments to the contrary to say that humans aren't driving climate change with our actions and what we're doing.
No other fact-based evidence-based argument here that anyone is presenting.
So it is incredibly, I think, very selfish and irresponsible that we aren't taking any steps to mitigate this, not only for what we're doing to people in this country, but what we're doing to the rest of the world.
We have a responsibility to everybody.
It's kind of, to me, it's like...
what we know about smoking cigarettes now.
It's not just harming you.
It's harming everybody else.
If you're smoking cigarettes in a car with kids, that's not just harming the person that's smoking the cigarettes.
You are exposing the kids in that car to all that secondhand smoke, which is going to be dangerous to them too.
So I think we have to be really mindful of what our actions are in this country and how they are impacting
the rest of the world because it's not, we're not isolated here.
What we do is impacting everybody else.
And Pat, if I could follow up on Melissa's comment about harm, it is stunning to hear that this administration is withdrawing what Melissa and I have talked about.
You've also commented about this rescission of the endangerment finding.
You know, are they justifying this?
They're saying that the present climate regulations that Melissa is talking about actually pose real harm to human health.
Why?
Because it will lead to higher prices and reduced consumer choices.
That's the basis upon which they're rescinding these regulations.
It's a stunning turning up on its head of the whole notion of harm beyond our borders and to other people.
Oh, it's I mean, it's it's Alice in Wonderland type stuff here, Jim.
So we've let's move from the world court to more traditional courts here in the States.
But I noticed that there was a similar case in in Italy.
But there are cases in in New York and in Hawaii.
And they're in court because you have what essentially a group of plaintiffs saying that these companies and or these governments again, know that there are dangers.
And yet they're, they're creating hazards anyway.
Congress won't do anything about it so we want this court to do something about it.
Is that kind of capturing what's happening in these
That's capturing it perfectly and thankfully our environmental laws in this country do give private parties, entities, individuals.
groups of people, what's called a private right of action to bring these lawsuits.
All they need to show, of course, we've talked a lot about this, Pat, is standing, which means, have I been endangered?
Have I been damaged in some way?
And they plainly, in all those lawsuits you mentioned, say, yes, indeed, by virtue of what, and you fill in the blank, whether the defendants are the producers of the environmental harm, they are causing me harm, that's standing.
And now I am asking.
this judicial branch of our nation, different states to come in and direct these defendants to do all kinds of remedial things.
That's what the EPA standards have always traditionally been about.
That's the basis upon which the Congress has in prior years passed legislation, the Clean Air Act.
the Clean Water Act, all those kinds of things.
That's the basis by which these are proceeding.
We know as well that just in the last term, the previous term to this one, the Supreme Court basically smacked down the Biden administration when it came to its good neighbors policy.
Again, following up on Melissa's point, this notion that there are portions of our nation, typically us Midwest, that produce these horrific gases in our airs.
They drift across the country, prevailing westerlies and affect other parts.
Supreme Court said last term, that's too much.
That's too big.
That's too novel.
The president can't do that.
Only Congress can do it.
Well, if that's the case, then Congress is not acting.
Private individuals have got to get into the fray here as they have been doing and attack this problem.
So final question and off the throat back at you, Jim, and because I'm sure Melissa is wondering this too.
I mean, we saw this happen with big tobacco that eventually it was courts that said you are liable and you need to fix this somehow.
Is that something we could eventually be seeing with fossil fuel companies and or governments?
And especially if we get what's called discovery and we find out in these civil cases, not criminal cases, civil cases, we get the emails back and forth, those memorandums that we've seen in those other cases that say, hey, we know we're doing this.
But again, money is our big factor.
We've got to supply revenues to our shareholders, that kind of motivation, that prompts courts.
Again, I'd like to believe even in America of the 2025 and beyond to do things to enjoin to stop those companies from doing what they're
doing, subject to appeal, subject to review.
But that's the way that these matters are being handled again, especially since right now, as you said, our own administration not taking these important issues on.
Most I'm always glad to talk to you about climate issues.
But I'm kind of glad you and I decided to check in with it with an actual attorney on this one.
I feel sorry for it.
We can talk about these things all day long, but somebody's actually got legal underpinnings for a segment like this.
Jim, thank you very much for joining us.
I'll
Friday.
And Melissa, thank you.
We'll talk next week.
Great.
Thanks.
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Okay, you're familiar by now with the Trump administration efforts to whitewash history at the Smithsonian and other museums.
Same goes for our national parks and related areas.
We spoke to Jeff Renneke of Friends of the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore about new signage and how visitors are reacting to the ridiculousness of trying to politicize America's history.
We're going to be talking about an executive order signed by President Donald Trump back in March.
Now this thing is given the ridiculous name the restoring truth and sanity to American history act and it says The reason for the executive order is to revitalize key cultural institutions meaning bring back Confederate monuments and reverse the spread of divisive ideology Meaning teaching an accurate and honest view of American history
Well, that all would be fine, but it even got to the point, or has gotten to the point, where the Trump administration has had some signs put up in national parks and other things like the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore that, in so many words, encourage you to snitch on your local park or people who might be teaching a part of history that hasn't been whitewashed enough.
And some folks are responding to that, to the National Park Service, and reminding us that there is still truth and sanity, the real kind, with the bulk of the American people.
Jeff Renneke joins us now from Friends of the Apostle Islands.
Jeff, good morning.
How are you?
I'm doing very well.
Thank you for having me.
Oh you bet I think well as Tony puts on YouTube I like it we should focus more on people who live in and around Lake Superior the real up north
as Tony
likes to say so we appreciate that very much Jeff before this came up before there was you know everything that the Trump administration is doing as I make that wide sweeping gesture with my arm here before all of this
Tell me about Friends of the Apostle Islands and the kinds of things the group would be doing in normal times.
Friends of the Apostle Islands is in essence a support organization for the Apostle Islands National Lakeshore.
I like to quote that Beatles song, we help the park get by and get better with a little help from their friends.
So we pick special projects and we raise funds and awareness and volunteers and public support to help the park get better for all of us.
And so you've been doing that for the longest time ever since it became a National Lakeshore and a lot of that dates way back to a visit from what President Kennedy by was a Gaylord Nelson who brought Jack Kennedy up and helped convince him of turning this into a National Lakeshore, which is not the same as a National Park and that's a discussion that we'll have another time.
Now with the Trump administration and this executive order that included these little signs, they have been seen up at the Apostle Islands.
Can you tell us a little bit about what it is that the sign says or what it's trying to get at?
Well, the science says specifically three things one is to let them know if any areas need repair and that's normal Any services that need improvement and that's always good But the third one is the chilling one any signs or other information that are negative about either past or living Americans or that fail to emphasize the beauty grandeur and abundance of landscapes and other features should be reported
So, you know, let's not say anything bad about those people who, you know, owned enslaved people or who, you know, massacred an entire group of people for their land.
Let's just set that aside.
It would be enough just to, I don't know, do an eye roll at that, but people have been responding to the National Park Service.
What are you getting from some of those responses as far as what you're hearing?
Well, first of all, of course, we would never really know if it weren't for people who were paying close attention.
This has not been released by the administration, but it has been leaked by the Coalition for the Protection of American National Parks.
And they published a 69-page document which gave all 1600 responses to that sign through June 30th.
And as you might imagine, and as I think the administration didn't expect,
Response has been overwhelmingly supportive to the staff of our national parks and the purpose of our parks.
Most people are just glowing about the job that parks are doing under very divisive situations.
Let me give you quick examples of here in the Apostle Islands.
Very well maintained and helpful staff.
Little Sand Bay was phenomenal.
Staff matched the beautiful scenery.
One person was watching the, washing the visitor windows.
Both were knowledgeable and professional and friendly.
The NPS and Apostle Islands needs a larger budget and more staff.
And I love this one.
Some people are using it to display their sense of humor.
He says, I have seen these islands and they don't resemble the apostles.
They don't look.
Like Peter or Paul, they look more like rocks and should be renamed.
I mean, you have to have a little tongue-in-cheek about this because, again, the attempt to whitewash history is what it is.
And yet, under things like the National Historic Preservation Act, the people at our national parks and other sites, I mean, they're basically charged with, we want them to teach an honest view of American history, right?
It is our national parks have always done a fabulous job at Interpreting the importance of human history in our landscapes in our national parks and as you mentioned they are mandated By law to do so, but I also think they see it's important parks are more than just postcard scenery.
They're the story of America Wallace Stegner the Pulitzer Prize winning author said America that
National Parks are America's best idea, reflecting us at our best, not our worst.
I would take a little different tact and I would say National Parks should reflect us at our most human.
And I think our signs in our National Parks are attempting to do that.
without a doubt, and the staff that is doing incredible work to do it in the face of budget cuts and just an overall tone from Washington that is not nearly as supportive as it used to be and as it really should be once again.
That was Jeff Renneke of the Friends of the Apostle Islands, and that's going to do it for us on this Friday.
Jane McNair is next.
I'm Pat Krightlow.
Have a wonderful and safe Labor Day weekend.
We'll see you next week here up north.
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