Folks Who Use SNAP, Live On Your Block (Hour 2)

Good morning.

Welcome.

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Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, Calvin Butenoff coming to you live from our home at Radio Park in Racine.

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We have a busy show today.

Lots of guests.

Amy Barilo from Clean Wisconsin.

Going to join us after the 9 30 news.

Going to talk about water in Wisconsin data centers in Wisconsin, getting a lot of attention, especially in the last couple of weeks.

So that is going to be a great conversation.

I hope you can stick around for that.

Emily's F.O.

is going to be joining us in our number two.

She, of course, is running for office.

She has been on the program many times before.

She's going to talk about her campaign and what she is hearing out on the campaign trail.

So stick around for that.

Last half an hour of the show, as we always do, we lighten it up with a little audio sorbet where we take a breath, get away from the news.

Talk about silly things salad wars

Yeah, that's on the way nothing but the hardest-hitting news and the biggest questions asked here at baton air and air first runner-up for a WBA award That's right.

We have a piece of paper

Salad wars.

Do you what do you like on your salad?

Do you have salad rules?

Are you a on the side Meg Ryan kind of salad person?

Are you against?

Nuts and say cranberries in your salad some and this is just among the three of us because these are where these come from

Yeah,

it's a pretty strong feelings about salad.

Yeah, who knew do

you hate salad out right and And we have we'll talk about that

too.

Yes salad wars coming up after the 1030 news and we will wrap up the show as we always do with this shouldn't be a thing Halloween themed this week

This ghouls for you addition.

Yeah, so stay tuned for that wanted to start off with this Milwaukee This is from WISN Milwaukee launching a city-wide food drive Amid the federal shutdown because snap benefits are going to run out on Saturday.

Yep Milwaukee community leaders Starting an emergency city-wide food drive to help out families affected by the shutdown which will cut cut off snap benefits for thousands of people there about

230,000 people who typically get SNAP food share benefits in Milwaukee County.

It's about 160 bucks per person that they get on the first of the month.

Live in large on 160 bucks a month.

Yeah.

Because I

went to the grocery store over the weekend.

I had one bag that was $48.

Oh,

it's gotten so much more expensive.

And I don't know if you know this, Jane, but grocery prices have not gone down at all.

They haven't.

Some items have.

There are some items that have and people like to look to the infamous eggs that were talked about last year.

That was a big part of the campaign.

Rally of Donald Trump the eggs are so expensive.

Yes And the eggs were expensive for various reasons and the egg prices came down one of the big reasons is because there was a bird flu that affected the Production and the demand and that has gone away and things have even itself out so egg prices have come down.

That's great.

That's great, but

That doesn't affect your toothpaste your pasta your this

your the

meat the meat the meat itself has gone up so so much So yeah, it doesn't surprise me.

In fact, I would say a sack of groceries for 40 some dollars That's that's getting the new the new norm the new norm the new thing of like what seems almost like a deal What was in there?

You know,

well, I was thinking about everything's a dollar

Now, it should be everything starts at $5 because everything is $4.99.

For $20, we're going to give you a bag and you get two minutes and whatever you can put in that bag, you get for $20.

By the way, our president said yesterday, quote, in nine months, we've lifted over 600,000 Americans off food stamps.

Wages are rising at the fastest pace energy prices are down gasoline prices are down grocery prices are down Donald Trump president yesterday grocery prices are down everybody I think he just thinks that if he says that over and over and over enough times people will start to believe it even Although the evidence provided by their own eyes is different.

Yeah, and

Lifting people off of benefits isn't the same as taking their benefits away from them.

There's a big difference between cutting benefits.

Yeah, if you if you worked to raise wages and worked to maybe

Create a more affordable More more solutions towards affordable living whether it's by the state or partnership state and federal like there are ways of doing this But none of it's happening and in nine months all they have done is just destroy the East Wing fire lots of people And and and do nothing about the things that affect you regular Tax paying folk who just live their lives.

So yeah, I

Again, this whole notion of, like, he's done so much.

Prove it.

Well, again, for himself, his family's done really, really well.

Yeah.

Really,

really well.

Yeah.

Since he's been back in office, like, tripled there.

Oh, yeah.

They're net worth.

Oh, I know.

I

mean, they're selling so many things on the side too.

It's just a feast for the pockets right now for them.

And people who are around them, we're seeing a lot of, it's good to see billionaire business owners come out of the woodwork to show their support for America.

I mean, Donald Trump and give their money to things they're doing.

I mean, I guess the Department of Defense is taking donations, $130 million.

And yeah, I think troops should be paid.

Yes, absolutely.

but you know what, I think Congress should work too.

They're getting paid.

They are getting paid.

Sorry, I wandered off the point there for a moment, but it's just, it's really frustrating because you're right, Jane.

He just keeps saying these things.

And no one disputes it.

No one ever disputes him.

It's just, oh yes, we'll all nod our heads

and

repeat what he says and be his stenographer, essentially, instead of pushing back.

Feeding America will have bins out.

Donation sites include Milwaukee City Hall, the County Courthouse, the Marsha Coggs Health Center, PhiServe, all MPS schools, police districts, public libraries, and the Masonic Temple Church.

We will put this link in our show notes if you would like to help out, make some donations, make some food donations.

Peanut butter is really good.

These are non-perishable

things.

Yeah, we need

non-perishable foods.

So things that are gonna last on the shelf.

And donations are absolutely wonderful and that's great.

And I love seeing communities come together and help each other, but at some point those donations and those resources are finite and we have to turn to our government that they make an investment on their people.

And whether it's the, you know, we're talking about the government.

and shut down affecting SNAP, but do not forget that because of the big bill for billionaires, SNAP benefits are going to be decimated by many nickels, Derek Van Orton.

But also, we can't turn to a state either for help too.

There's- Well, Mary Falskowski said it.

We have, and yeah, and if you want proof of that, Calvin, we have a clip from State Senator Mary Falskowski on the topic of SNAP benefits and what the state could do with a four plus billion dollar surplus.

The state now says food share benefits come November will run out 700,000 Wisconsinites, $114 million a month from the federal government.

Is there any scenario that you see that the legislature would step in if this is prolonged?

I, you know, 114 million is a lot of money.

And my heart goes out to people, but this is a federal issue.

And I don't see the state having the resources to do that.

I just wish that the Democrats would sign this continuing reservation and vote for it, and let's move on.

They shouldn't be playing games like this.

Oh,

right.

Let's not play games, Mary.

That would be bad.

And in $114 million, that is a lot of money.

That is a lot of money.

You know what you can't really, I'm not going to expect the people of Wisconsin to do, donate that much money and or supplies.

We can donate peanut butter and soup and things and clothing and do what we can with in in our budgets But at a certain point it falls to the government and if the federal government isn't gonna get their butts in gear and do something Then the state should do something about it and Maryfels Kowski just going it's a federal issue and the Democrats fault

Tell

me a better example of leaders not leading.

I mean that is

my dog ate the homework or he started it or well I don't want to cool why are you in office well and

again we have money for all kinds of things yes we've got 172 million dollars for new planes for christie gnome yeah we have all kinds of money for other things but when it comes to helping out folks who need who a lot of them are working and we talked about this yesterday yeah

People who receive SNAP benefits in many cases work for companies like Walmart.

People who receive SNAP benefits are people like

farmers.

Farmers receive SNAP benefits.

Farmers are also on the ACA.

It's not just lazy, non-working moochers.

And

what happened to the tariff shelf?

Yeah, there was a tariff.

There's

all this money sitting trillions on the tariff shelf, according to the president of the United States.

Yeah, those are his words.

Why can't we just grab a couple million from that, from the tariff shelf and keep the, the SNAP benefits going

because there are people out there who, who think that apparently it's not like this whole, this whole notion of like, well, the government doesn't have to do X, Y or Z. And, and yeah, they do.

Do you know why?

Because we pay our taxes.

And that tax money has to be used as resource for funding and investment.

They use the money for wars, they use the money for foreign aid, but they should also use the money here.

But instead what we're doing is we're taking programs, we're gutting them, and we're gonna hand them directly to billionaires.

And what really makes me laugh, not in a ha-ha way, but more like a, are you serious?

Are people who say, well, there's nothing wrong with this.

Are you a billionaire?

Are you gonna get any of this money?

Because they're doing it to you as well.

Doesn't make America great, doesn't make your kitchen table economy great, but you defending this kind of behavior, I don't understand it.

Is it just a, I gotcha, I get to win type of thing?

Cause you're not.

Meanwhile, Attorney General Call, Josh Call in Wisconsin suing the Trump administration over suspending the food share program.

This lawsuit has been filed by a number of states.

It argues the U.S.

Department of Agriculture refusing to use emergency monies.

Congress has made available for circumstances just like this.

They want a court order requiring the USDA to use emergency funds to help maintain SNAP and stop this lapse in payments.

In a statement, the Attorney General said millions of Americans, including children, seniors and veterans, are on the verge of losing access to the food assistance they rely upon.

No one should have to go hungry because of dysfunction.

in our federal government.

And going back to Derek Van Orden and Mary Felskowski and well, not Mary, but certainly Derek Van Orden.

Five months ago, all the Republicans voted to gut snap.

They all voted for this.

To cut, what, $500 million?

Quite a few nickels, I will

say.

Yeah, there were several nickels involved.

I think it was $400 million.

I can look that up really quick.

But yeah, it's...

it's also this this negotiation people's head that people as you said people who take snap people who take Medicare Medicaid people who take any benefits from the government are lazy moochers good for nothing shiftless all I know they're veterans their families they're seniors and fixed income they're seniors they're farmers they're all these folks that who we would just

You

probably see them on the street.

They're probably in your neighborhood in your town.

But you're right.

You're right.

The government has no responsibility to do anything whatsoever except exist.

Take our money and give it to their billionaire buddy friends.

You're right.

We solved America, everybody.

There you go.

All right.

I can't wait.

I can't wait for the next thing.

Maybe maybe they'll just accept expect me to live on like juices and berries.

Could you do that?

Probably can't afford that.

They're very expensive at the store.

Yeah, don't get very expensive at the store.

Fresh foods, very expensive.

Stay close.

When we return hanging around with more of the best people, you're listening to Matt Nair on air.

Stay with us.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

We'll be right back.

Good morning and welcome back to NetNair on air, Jane NetNair, Greg Bach, the board lord coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

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Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter coming up after the 930 News.

Amy Berrio from Clean Wisconsin.

is going to be joining us talking about data centers, which have been getting a lot of attention the last couple of weeks after Mount Pleasant rejected one.

A Caledonia.

Thank you.

And Port Washington is going ahead.

Yeah.

People kind of waited a little bit late to make their voices heard about that.

So we will be talking about that after the 9 30 news.

I hope you can stick around for that.

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Why don't we share this real briefly before before we go to the news.

This is from the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

Mary Spakouza, Daniel Bison, Molly Beck have the byline Wisconsin candidates Maria Lazare and Tom Tiffany facing criticism after attending events.

with 2020 election denier, Michael Flynn.

Remember Mike Flynn?

Michael Flynn twice pled guilty for lying into the FBI.

And then he reversed himself right before the Justice Department came in and dismissed the case.

He'd been working for Russia.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Essentially.

Yeah.

But he got a pardon.

I don't worry about it.

So it's all good.

So apparently.

Mary Maria Lazare who is running for the Supreme Court and Tom Tiffany now who is thrown his hat into the race for governor We're both at the Republican County Republican Party of Brown County Lincoln Reagan Trump dinner

Oh, they've added Trump's name to it

It used to just be there the Lincoln Reagan now it's Lincoln Reagan Trump dinner on October 24th, which featured Michael Flynn

Again, you pled guilty to lying to the FBI got pardoned by Trump force Mike Flynn also big on the 2020 election denial Misinformation embraced by QAnon.

He's a big

QAnon fan.

Yeah about pizza gates and all of that crazy.

Yeah

That's who gets to hang out with them.

Yeah, and by the way, if you don't know Maria Lazare

Lazar, I can't remember if it's laser.

Lazar is running for Wisconsin State Supreme Court.

You know, the branch that maybe looks at cases like trying to overturn elections.

It's good to know who she hangs out with.

I'm really happy to know that someone like Michael Flynn, who is a convicted criminal, gets to hang out at the Lincoln Reagan Trump dinner.

Good God.

If you want to, like, look.

What happened to the Republican Party, Jane?

Just say Lincoln, Reagan, Trump.

It's right there in the name.

Judge Laza, a spokesperson for Laza, defended her attendance there, saying she attends a wide range of community events to engage with constituents and promote civic dialogue, regardless of who else is there.

A spokesperson for Tom Tiffany did not respond to a comment for the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

If you want to know who she hangs out with and who she likes to discuss with and defend and talk about talk Look at who she has worked with in the past.

It's it's a it's groups who are very much at the tables Well conspiracy there's but also like very pro-life Anybody anybody that she worked with is at that dinner They're all apart.

It's on the pot.

She was she is a more palatable version of Rebecca Bradley Rebecca Bradley

was very outspoken in her thoughts on the last year's election.

Very outspoken.

She did not stay in, she did not run for election, but this new candidate is the same thing.

Same beliefs.

With polish.

Yeah, same beliefs, but a little more toned down.

Yeah.

So that will just be interesting to see going forward.

And they are not letting the 2020 election thing go away.

Yeah.

Seriously, it's almost like they don't have anything else to talk about because they can't campaign on successes unless they're lying about it like grocery prices or gas prices or energy

Everything's down everybody.

Yeah, everything's down.

That's why we must have Donald Trump for a third term to heck with you Constitution.

Yeah, that's a whole nother

That's a whole discussion.

You know, it's a very burnable document.

It's just Burton on paper.

Who cares?

The Constitution.

Yeah, we'll forget about it.

Rip it up.

News is coming up next, and then we're talking to Clean Wisconsin on the other side.

Stay with us.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

Don't go away.

Good morning and welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Box, Sweet Calbee on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

You can always join us, call or text.

The number is the same at 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter.

Data Center's a big issue.

Not just around the country, but here in Wisconsin.

Joining us to talk about data centers and some of the concerns around that.

Amy from Clean Wisconsin, Amy Berrio is here.

Good morning, Amy.

Thanks so much for joining us.

How are you?

Good morning.

I'm great.

How are you doing?

We are wonderful.

Thank you.

Really looking forward to talking to you about this.

This is from the Wisconsin Examiner.

Henry Redmond had the byline.

Environmental groups raise alarm on AI data centers use of energy and water.

And I think this is something that people are starting to pay closer attention to as we see our energy bills going up and our water bills going up because these data centers

are big.

They suck a lot of both, right?

They do.

I think that's what we've seen so far, right?

These are different kinds of data centers.

They're not the typical that we've had in Wisconsin for years now.

They are big.

They are AI data centers.

They're doing a lot of computing.

And so that article you mentioned references an analysis from Clean Wisconsin that

seeks to look at just how much energy, for example, are these AI data centers going to use?

And we found that just the full build out of the data center in Mount Pleasant and then just the very first phase of the Microsoft data center will use far more energy than all of the homes in Wisconsin combined, for example.

Then the entire state.

Correct.

So, you know, we're saying about 4.3 million homes worth of energy for those two facilities, and we only have 2.8 million homes in Wisconsin.

So, again, that's just to show the scale.

And I think people are starting to realize the strain that that scale of demand will put on the resources that we all share.

When, okay, really, because I feel like data centers

Yes, you said there are smaller ones.

They've been around this day centers are nothing new, but I feel like this push

and in wisconsin too especially because i hear commercials on the radio for a data center lobbying group that's telling us all the wonderful beautiful things about data centers when did this start as such a push because we were introduced to something called the data center tracking map online which shows you the location of every data center in america and there are hundreds upon hundreds of them but when did it become such a uh i don't want to say fashionable thing but in the news mainstream thing

for us to be concerned about.

And these

big massive, these massive data centers.

I think because people started realizing the impacts.

So initially, you know, it felt like AI kind of just like ran onto the scene and all of a sudden, and then you started seeing data centers being built all across the country and all across the world in a hurry, big AI data centers.

And you started to see those impacts.

You mentioned water use, the

I guess you could call them older AI data centers.

The ones from a few years ago did use massive amounts of water on site.

And people saw that happening and were really upset.

These data centers would come in and build really quickly.

Here in Wisconsin, we're at the center of the largest freshwater system in the world, our Great Lakes.

We have a lot of open land because of our great farming history.

And so we're pretty attractive.

And then in 2023, we passed some tax incentives for data centers.

So they don't have to pay sales tax on any of those computers and other things that they need in their buildings, really everything.

You and I, we have to pay sales tax if we go buy some computers, but these richest companies in the world don't have to now in Wisconsin.

And so you saw Wisconsin becoming more and more attractive to these data centers.

I will say when you

read a press release from data centers right now in Wisconsin, they'll talk about how they are minimizing water use on site.

And that may be true.

And so we're going to be coming out with a new analysis that looks at offsite water use.

So when you have a data center that needs more power than millions of Wisconsin homes, those power plants need water for cooling.

Power generation is responsible for more than 70% of water withdrawals in this state.

And if we see power plants built to serve the needs of data centers, which we are already seeing with the first phase of the Microsoft data center, we're going to see a real impact to our water resources.

And that's something that data center developers are not talking about.

Jade, that's shocking.

If you're just joining us on Matt Nair on Air, Amy Berrio from Clean Wisconsin is our guest.

And we are talking about data centers, especially in Wisconsin.

When you talked about these tax incentives that they were given in 2023, you know, when they talk about bringing jobs to communities, there are jobs when they are constructing these data centers.

But once they're built, from my understanding, they don't require that many bodies.

It's unclear, right?

I think you're seeing data centers, particularly the Oracle, OpenAI, Vantage Data Center in Port Washington, trying to say, oh, we are going to have, I think they're trying to beef up their jobs numbers to try to appear more appealing.

But we don't really know how many jobs they're going to need on site.

We know those buildings are going to be full of computers,

not

people, and that is for sure.

I think what a lot of communities are calling for is how about some real guarantees, some real guarantees about how much water you're going to use on site, some real transparency about how much energy you're going to need, and some real guarantees that you're going to deliver on some of these job numbers as limited as they may be.

Right now, there's really no teeth to anything.

Well, and that's something that I wanted to talk about just there because you mentioned just a moment ago about

the way they talk about their usage of water, the way they, you know, it's, I want you for a moment, Amy, to be our data center whisperer when it comes to messaging.

Cause you're the communications director for clean Wisconsin.

And they're going to, they're going to throw a lot of fancy business sentences and fancy words that will probably quell some people when they use things like we're going to minimize our usage and we're going to, uh, I think the other term is a closed system and things of that nature.

Can you talk about those two things?

And then also from your standpoint, from clean Wisconsin standpoint, what is a good level?

What is something that would be acceptable for you all to see from data centers as far as their water usage, energy usage to say, look, it's not optimal, but this is something we at least kind of get behind because it's not going to be billions of gallons a year.

I mean, that's a lot to throw at you, but it just feels like when people are talking to us about this,

There's a lot of information coming at us, and the biggest concern is water and energy, but they do a really good job of judging up the language.

Obstuscating.

Yes.

One could say.

Yeah, for sure they do.

And so they'll talk about their sort of average amount of daily water use that they'll use.

And that's fine.

But what we really need to know is how much water are you going to use on the hottest?

days of the year.

Those are the days when from what we understand those new technology cooling systems aren't going to be enough.

Those are also the days when our water systems are the most stressed.

We know with climate change we have hotter summers, we know we have the potential for longer more severe droughts and so when we're in a situation in Wisconsin where we are in a drought

where it's August.

We haven't had rain in a couple of weeks.

Farmers are needing to water their crops.

People are needing to, you know, flush their toilets in their homes.

Everything's under stress.

What kind of a guarantee do we have from a data center that they will say, oh, we recognize this, we're gonna, we're gonna cut back.

We're gonna maybe not use this data center as much as one of our other ones in some other part of the country.

Where are guarantees that

this is

going

to

happen?

What we don't have is any insight zero into how much water these data centers are going to use on the hottest days of the year, and it's important how much power they're going to use during those times, either when our water systems are stressed, because as I mentioned, those power plants need water, or when our energy systems are most stressed, when our grid is stressed.

From what we understand, what we've seen from these data center tech companies,

they want to be able to access full demand, full everything 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365 days a year.

So there is no what we would call demand response.

No, oh, we'll back off if the state, other people need something.

And I think...

What we really need right now is transparency and some kind of mechanism to ensure that these data centers, when we are stressed, when there isn't enough to go around, will be required to back off of there.

demands.

If you're just joining us on Matt Nair on air, Amy Berio is here with Clean Wisconsin.

We're talking about data centers, specifically about their water and energy usage.

It's interesting, Amy, because I saw an article last week that talked about some communities that have data centers.

They actually want people to individuals to sign up and say that we will give the data center permission

to lower our usage so they get priority.

And I think that's kind of speaking to what you just said about who's going to be prioritized for needs when things get tight, when electricity gets tight, when water gets tight.

Do the data centers get it over my neighbor, March, who needs fresh water?

Seriously, but that's what we're talking

about.

That was going to be my follow-up.

I felt like I didn't make that up in my head.

I felt like you or someone else had said that there's almost a thing where they're going to prioritize the business over the people.

And that really quick too, and as a side note, is something that you then want to talk to your elected officials about and ask them questions and ask them for transparency in those deals.

But yeah, can you speak more on that, Amy?

Well, I mean, that is what we've seen happen in some states where, and you know, you kind of know that if you sign up, for example, for the metering program with MG&E where they can,

you know,

come in and on days of high demand, like slightly lower your, what you're using, that's something that is typically a good thing, right?

things are stressed, you can help back off a little bit so that the peak demand doesn't get too high.

But when there's a priority made that maybe you didn't sign up for, when there are certain entities being prioritized over who gets what, I think you're seeing people in other states, I can't remember which one, it may be West Virginia.

Getting pretty mad about that.

Yeah, and so you're seeing these states kind of like, you know vying to see who can draw in the most data centers who can be the most attractive and Wisconsin's played a bit of a part in that as well But I think communities are

getting more and more upset.

You've got nondisclosure agreements, you've got shell companies, you've got very little idea of what's going on before these data centers kind of come to town.

by the time they realize what's happening, it's too late.

And so we don't want to get in that position here in Wisconsin

where it's

too late.

In 10 years, we're regretting all these decisions we're making right now.

Well, and as you said, I think Amy, that more people are getting educated about this and what this means.

And we harp on this a lot on this show.

Knowledge is power.

Knowledge is power.

And the more you know, the better

off you're going to be.

And I'm going to put the data center.

It's called datacentermap.com and specifically slash USA because I

I'm pretty sure most people would not know this, but there are 4,150 data centers in America.

And we're actually below the average, but

there's- For now.

For now.

Because they see that last, you said, Amy, and you said, Jane, they see that freshwater as a commodity.

And I don't want to say it belongs to us, but-

We're the people and I feel like we should be prioritized over these businesses.

We're to continue our conversation with Amy Berio from Clean Wisconsin.

Troy, I see you.

We will take you on the other side.

Stay close.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network and we will be right back.

Good

morning and welcome back to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, our one, our only calzone on the board coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine where you can join us at 855.

7 5 2 4 8 4 2 leave a comment on the live stream on Facebook YouTube and what used to be Twitter.

We are talking data centers in Wisconsin.

Amy Berio is our guest with clean Wisconsin.

Amy, we had Troy from Mount Horab has been very patient waiting on the line.

Good morning, Troy.

What did you want to say?

Good morning, everyone.

I'm just curious with all the water that they're using if these communities aren't

getting that out of the Great Lakes, and if they are, could we use that to stop them?

Because I know Waukesha had to beg for water to get water out of the Great Lakes, and every surrounding state in Canada had to approve that.

Yeah, what kind of, I mean, but obviously, Amy, they're getting, thank you, Troy, appreciate you checking in, but obviously they're getting okays for this from the state.

Well, they don't really need okays from the state, typically.

Like what you're seeing in Port Washington is they are hooking up to the municipal water system to serve them, same in Racine.

So I think, and what Troy was talking about is the Great Lakes Compact, which Clean Wisconsin had a hand in getting past, I believe in the late 1990s, early 2000s, and that is meant to protect

water in the Great Lakes region, because you not only have data centers coming to Wisconsin, you have them coming to Michigan and Minnesota and all these other states.

And there has yet to be that level of coordination that there's supposed to be when it comes to protecting water withdrawals from the Great Lakes.

Again, Racine and Washington are allowed to withdraw water from the Great Lakes.

because they're municipalities

because they're tapping into the city system

right so you know I think again that what and also what is not recognized is the water that's being used by power plants to serve these data centers which can be quite a lot

And so that starts to be where things get fuzzy.

Most of these data center proposals, like the one in Dane County, the one that's been approved in Beaver Dam, even the latest Microsoft, one that was announced a couple of weeks ago, have not even said how much energy they're going to use.

So when they're not saying how much energy they need, then you don't know what their water footprint really is, and then you don't really know what the impact is going to be.

And so it's just a black hole of information that we have right now.

That seems bad.

I go back to just the simple idea of transparency and I think I to speak to what I think what if I'm hearing Troy correctly it seems like the question ultimate is and as always is Why does the municipality or the people have to work so much harder to get the water or get the thing?

Whereas businesses seem to just be able to walk in and be like we want the thing Okay, and granted you're right.

They're tapping into the municipalities that have access to the water, but

I feel like if a data center was moving into Waukesha, they say, we need Lakewater.

They'd be like, very good, sir, let's do this.

It seems like it's always easier for the businesses.

Well, and while we're talking about water, Amy, because again, I'm not even, I can't even say I'm a science adjacent.

Why can't they all have closed water systems?

Wouldn't this alleviate a lot of these problems?

Or is there some way that the water gets contaminated as it's going through that initial cooling phase that they can't reuse it?

We tried so hard to science during the commercial break.

Yeah, we couldn't.

That's why.

Well, okay, there's a few layers here.

First of all, Microsoft and Vantage, the two data centers that have been talking the most about what they're going to do, say they are going to use closed loop systems, which means they're not going to be actively withdrawing millions and millions of gallons of water on site every day.

But those systems are proprietary, so we don't really know how they work.

We have some information that on the hottest days of the year, they won't be as effective, and there will need to be more withdrawals in those days.

We do know that our power plants, coal, gas, nuclear, do not use water reuse systems and in fact can withdraw quite a bit of water.

So we think that data centers, when you look at their real water footprint, the ones that we're talking about will be pulling an entire city's worth of water as their water footprint when you include the electric, you know, the electric needs.

So.

These are things that, again, it comes down to that transparency.

Why don't we know how much energy the new Microsoft data center is going to use that was announced a couple of weeks ago?

Why aren't they talking about it?

They say it's going to be the most powerful in the world.

We don't know what the energy use is really going to be, what that demand is going to be on our energy systems.

I think it's hard to discuss these issues with any kind of real knowledge, whether you're science-y or not.

if you don't have any information.

And that's where I would say folks, if this is a situation that concerns you, and unfortunately we can't take all the calls this morning on this, if this is a situation that concerns you, especially transparency, this is when you go to myvote.wi.gov.

Look up your county supervisors, your council village members, tell them that, okay, if they're going to talk to groups that want to put data centers in, we need

points of transparency here so we know what they're doing and how it will affect our communities because just saying yeah go ahead and let's find do it later that's not good enough we need the transparency.

Seriously I don't know how you can expect it to make an informed decision when you don't don't have all the facts.

Yeah and you'll see these companies coming in and you know the landowners sign on disclosure agreements the local municipalities are under NDAs and then it becomes really hard to get information you know until it's

already proved.

There's an old saying that comes to mind about mushrooms and keeping them in the dark somehow that just keeps popping in my head.

Not going to go into that.

We're just

about out of time.

I was

told there'd be no

science.

There's no science.

We're not good at science.

Amy Berio is Communications Director for Clean Wisconsin.

Thank you so very much

for

your time.

Amy Will.

We'd love to have you back.

We know you have a new report coming out.

That's right.

Happy to talk about that anytime.

We'll have you back when that report comes out.

Thank you so much.

News is coming up next.

Stay with us.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air, coming to you across the vast state wide country wide.

You can pick us up around the world on the Civic Media radio network.

Good morning and welcome to Matt and Air on Air.

Jane Matt and Air, Craig Bach, Calvin Butenoff coming to you live from our home at Radio Park in Racine where you can always join us.

You can call or text the number is the same at 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube,

and what used to be Twitter.

We are delighted to be joined by our next guest.

She is the chair of the Out of Gamy County Democrats and a candidate for the state Senate.

Our friend Emily Zephos is here.

Good morning, Emily.

How are you?

I'm doing well.

Thanks.

I'm excited to be here again with y'all.

Busy, busy, busy woman.

You had a column in Dan Shaper's Recon Population Area.

talking about why you are running again and if you don't mind Emily I just want to read just a little portion of your piece which is fantastic and we'll include this in our show notes so everybody can read it.

This is just a portion again of Emily's piece in the Reconpopulation area.

National media outlets are being forced to sign loyalty pledges to gain access to briefings for the Department of Defense.

Those who refuse our denied entry, federal agencies being purged and repopulated with loyalists, governors in Texas, Florida and Iowa fast tracking new restrictions on voting, rolling back child labor laws, gutting environmental oversight, Wisconsin's own far right lawmakers watching closely, ready to duplicate all of these policies.

Here I am.

deciding to run in another unwinnable district again.

Why did you decide to do this?

I think it kind of lays it out right there.

There's a lot that's falling away right now.

and a lot that's being turned back to the states.

And what we need in order to prevent like the dam from fully breaking is people that are willing to stand up and willing to do the right thing.

And I really, I mean, even in an unwinnable district, they deserve better representation than they've been getting.

They deserve someone that knows it well enough to fight for exactly what it needs.

And I'm dedicated to chipping away at the mountain out there.

I think that now with everything being in crisis,

it's really, really important that those of us that can step up do.

I mean, it doesn't surprise me that you're running.

You are like every time we talk, you are doing 10,000 things because you're very, you just keep yourself so engaged in the community.

And yeah, I mean, it, unwinnable, I beg to differ on the, that matter, but I think with someone like you, you bring, as you said, so much knowledge because we see so many people out there who just, especially in the

pre fair maps Wisconsin who kind of just got to run and win because they just said the right things and then they didn't really have to work for the people and that's not how you how you roll personally and how you would in office I would imagine

Yeah, I think it's just really important to like have someone there that is making a candidate work or making the incumbent work and responding to issues and offering just like a different way, a different approach, right?

Like there are a lot of problems that persist and the GOP's in charge right now.

So I think contrasting, you know, like this is still a pain point for you, which means they haven't solved it.

Let me tell you what I'm going to

do to fix

it.

that's what we want to do.

And that's what those folks deserve.

So it's a lot of one on one and all that stuff.

Well, and that leads us to the next question.

I'm curious.

First of all, Emily, tell us about the district that you're running in.

What does it encompass?

Where is it?

And how many places does it cover?

I am really digging into the map right now because it's so new.

So it covers the 56th Assembly District, which is where I ran last time, Appleton and Westward.

So we're talking Black Creek, Shiocton, Maple Creek, New London, but this now extends into like Wapaka and Washera counties and then down into Winnebago

and

a teeny tiny little bit of portage.

There's like all

in

Wisconsin in there.

So I'm learning about all these like new towns and I'm excited to get out there and start connecting with folks.

And that's something that, you know,

We talk to a lot of candidates on this show and on this network and one thing I always want to ask our candidates for our offices.

What are you hearing from the people at doors, at events, on the phone calls?

Specifically the ones that the concerns people have that connect us regardless of who you voted for.

you know, kitchen table economy is something that affects us all, jobs, affordability for housing, for childcare, all the education, marijuana legalization.

What are the things that you're hearing out there that's kind of the through lines?

And also, how is it connecting people who may come from different political backgrounds?

I think it's like the cost of things.

And when we like talk through things, you know, like, I think there's so much manipulation happening that caused you to like say these, you know, they're repeating.

Headline or banners.

Yeah, exactly.

Yep.

And so to dig into that and say, Oh, okay.

So you're talking about like safety in schools and making sure our kids are safe.

Like I agree.

Like, yes, our kids should be safe in school, but the approach is different.

And I think like when you.

acknowledge like we've got that in common first let's work toward like understanding like what is actually going to treat the root of a problem rather than something that is manufactured or that is simply a Band-Aid over you know a bleed like we really need to get back to that and that's what i'm hearing what i always try to connect to like no one's i don't ever want to go to a door and be like your problem's not real like yeah that's not a

bad way to vote for me

yeah but can i have your support

yeah

but i think like to say things like you know like i hear you

I understand that you're operating out of fear and anger.

But here's what's true about that.

Here's what's not.

Let's go back and forth about it.

And it's really refreshing to have people, other certain people, that you're like, OK, well, we're too far gone.

But there's a lot of people that are like, oh, I'm just a little misinformed, because people can't get into the weeds.

So that's another problem, right?

Well, if you're just joining us, Emily Zippos is our guest.

She's the chair of Out of Gamey County Democrats and also running now for the Wisconsin State Senate.

I think it's what you say Emily is so important and this is evidenced by Senator Lindsey Graham.

It was either yesterday or the day before Got busted in a committee hearing when his phone announced call Sean Hannity the Republican Party has in an information juggernaut, so they tell Sean Hannity

What message they want put out and Sean Hannity does that and all the right wing podcasters pick up on that and they keep reinforcing this message over and over and over again.

And it's really hard to fight that as as you're finding out in real time.

And I think like the only way to break through that noise and what I thought like last time when I ran to is like door to door.

So it's like, it's painfully slow.

But like when you get to know somebody and you don't ask for that transactional, just vote for me.

But you're like, let's hear it out.

Let's have this discussion takes a little longer.

But I think that's where you can start to like, you know, make cracks

appear.

Yeah.

And you're like, reconsider this and it helps to open those conversations up.

And that's something too that, you know, we see in for, for the show, for the show.

whether it's livestream comments or text messages or emails or voice notes, there are times that people are speaking where I just want to say, look, I'm not telling you you're bad or anything.

I'm telling you that you have been lied to.

And it's about trying to say that without one being as dramatic as I just got right there, but also allowing someone the space and comfort to really think through and have that self, that's tough in this day and age,

but

also knocking on doors when you have a timeframe, but really trying to make them understand that, look, I'm not going to belittle you, say I told you so, but I'm here to talk to you.

And I think this is where.

Our state representative comes in because this is a direct line.

The things that Emily, you would be talking about and deciding on and voting on have direct impacts.

And it's important for people to know that here is, here's the transparent results I want to present versus just talking points built on lies, built on fear.

It's almost a form of deprogramming to a sense.

I agree.

And I think it's really important because I see so much of the time that people are like, you voted for this, like, no.

Nope.

That's not what we do right now.

What

we do right now is we say, I am so sorry that you were lied to.

Yes.

He told you that

prices were going to go down.

He told you all this stuff.

It's not happening.

And you were lied to and you were used.

I'm not here to do that.

I want to know what hurts so that I can help.

And I

think like going and having us do that, like as a party, whether we are elected or candidates is so critical right now, not to rub anybody's face in it, because if they're hurting, that's real.

And we

have to acknowledge that and try to fix it.

That's such an important point, Emily.

There's, there's so much, you know, FAFO and now you're finding out and ha ha ha.

And that's not helping anybody and that's not going to fix anything.

And I think there's plenty of evidence to support that when society.

gotten people's faces to say they were wrong or you're wrong for asking questions or for being frustrated or being angry that instead of having the conversations instead of getting people instead when you've gotten people's faces and said well you're horrible or whatever it didn't really help the cause it didn't make them vote for you it didn't make them want to communicate it only drove drove them away and taken more information from people who supported those confirmation or I shouldn't say confirmation biases those concerns

that then created confirmation bias.

So yeah, I don't disagree.

I see videos all the time, especially pointing fingers at farmers.

And I know that's a deep nuance discussion as far as voting, but absolutely do not do that to them because this is a far deeper issue.

And I can't even imagine the conversations, especially up where you're at having with farmers and the farmlands and the things, especially right this moment they're going through.

Well, and again, I think the bigger fight is not

middle class and lower class and working people fighting each other.

It is us versus billionaires.

That's where, that's where the fight is.

And that is our common, I'm sorry, enemy because it is.

That's so important.

And that's something that I pointed.

I did this little thing on Snap because we're doing a food drive right now.

And I was like, you pay on average, like average Wisconsinite, which makes about $68,000 a year pays like a little less than 50 bucks annually.

In taxes to cover that that's their contribution to snap.

We pay a thousand dollars that same person in corporate subsidies, right?

We're not fighting work and the while we're fighting each other They're laughing.

Yes all the way to the bank.

Yes.

It's wild

a thousand dollars in corporate subsidy Emily I'm sorry.

I'm about to get snarky and sarcastic or that sounds like socialism to me

Well, you know welfare for the wealthy.

I

mean, you

know, absolutely and and and while you're on the topic

Tell us about this food drive you're doing.

I mean, we know why, but give us the background of the food drive where people can go and how they can be either of service or get some, get some service if they need it.

Sure, yeah, I will say that these things are happening across the state and across the country, which is incredible.

It's ordinary people

that are

showing up and doing the right thing in this moment here in the 19th Senate district.

What we wanted to do was demonstrate like a coordinated kind of effort so that we have multiple drop off points from why we go up through black correct over to grand chute and we're trying to.

specifically target and supplement those smaller rural food banks that don't have deep shelves or a lot of storage space, but are going to see an increase come those benefits being taken away on November 1st.

And so it's on my website.

I sound like a politician.

It's EmilySephos.com is where you could find more information on that.

But I would

encourage you to look into what your local community can do.

So because you can make a real impact right

now.

And I think it's important also, Emily.

People have this misconception of people who use SNAP.

So when we're talking about rural areas, a lot of these people are working people, correct?

Mm-hmm.

Oh, yeah I think that's like 89% like we but I went into it because I've been getting different comments about like snap in general and it is Staggering the amount of people that are working as hard as they can and they still can't get by and frankly It's because these systems are set up to not to prevent that from happening like it's that's the way that this whole this whole thing is broken Yeah, so what we need to do is build it better But like I think it's really important that we combat all of that, you know again It's those headlines and the misinformation that exists out there to say this is exactly

exactly how many people and I don't have it in front of me.

But it is the majority of people that are using Snap are employed.

They also like maybe are using it one or two weeks out of the month to just get by.

As

a supplement.

I'm really

worried.

Yeah, but I'm really worried about those people that are on the bubble that are like, I'm doing everything right and

I

still can't make it.

I'm doing what I was told I need to do.

That's always, this is what America told me I need to do and it's still not enough.

We're going to continue our conversation with Emily Cephos on the other side.

Stay with us.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

We'll be right back.

Stay close.

Good morning.

Welcome back to Matt and Air on Air.

Jane Matt and Air.

Greg Bach, sweet Calbee on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

Join us at 855-752-4842.

Leave a comment on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter.

We are joined by the Out of Gamey County Chair of the Democratic Party and the State Senate candidate, Emily Zefos is our guest.

And Emily, the last time you were on the show, we were talking about, once again, an article that you wrote for the Reconpopulation Area, and that one was titled, How Democrats Can Rebuild Trust.

And you are a Democrat.

You are, you wear multiple hats, one of those hats being the out of Gamey County chair for the, for the Democrats.

And I want to, I want to talk about that article in as much as your campaign right now.

Democrats have a lot of work to do after last year's election.

And I want to know now that you are hitting the ground running, knocking on doors, making phone calls, representing the party, what are you doing to help rebuild that trust, help bring people in and build bridges and networks and just, you know, kind of form those coalitions that are needed to fight for everyday folks.

And as we said earlier, folks who may have voted for Donald Trump last year, but are finding out that the sting wasn't worth it.

I think you're muted him.

Oh, there we go.

There we are.

I'm good.

We're doing a lot.

I feel like we're running 500 directions every day.

But one of the things we're really focused on is connecting those pain points to policy.

What's unique to us is that while there are like nonprofits that are doing incredible work locally, they can't say, here's why this exists.

Like here's what we're trying to do because of policy points like we can.

And so if you're not a gaming county, we really feel like that's part of our work right now is to make sure that as things are hitting you in the face or you're feeling it in your pocketbook or you're sitting at your table, like wondering how you're going to pay your bills at the end of the month, like to talk about all of the different policy decisions that were made, whether in

Madison or Washington that led to that pain.

Um, so doing that and then showing up authentically, I think it's like doing the community aid and not asking for anything in return too often.

I think politics is transactional.

And so we're really trying to show up for our neighbors and just be like, we're just here.

Like we're just a chance.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I'm not going

to ask you

for a donation.

Yeah.

I know.

Like I don't need, I'm not going to send you, I don't know about you guys, but the texts and stuff like that.

I'm like, yo, there are big issues that we are trying to help our community with right now, not the time.

Yeah,

definitely

not

the time.

And that's definitely something that can turn people off and we hear about it every time in elections.

And there's, and in Wisconsin, I think we can all say safely, there's no such thing as election season anymore.

We're always in election mode in this state.

So yeah, I mean, I think those are important points to talk about that.

You know, you're just you are of your regular folk trying to represent other folks and trying to get things done.

We were talking before we went to the break, Emily, about trying to beat misinformation.

And our president continues to say almost on a daily basis that the price of everything is down.

The price of everything is down.

Calvin, we have a clip of Donald Trump.

Let's hit that clip, please.

So I just want everyone to know prices are way down.

Way down.

That's a big thing.

groceries, everything.

If you look at fuel, $2.35 a gallon, a lot of that, but we actually had three states, four states where it's down $1.99.

Are you hearing this at doors?

Do people say prices are down?

Prices are down everywhere because the president says so.

Yeah, I mean, you do like think you do that.

And then when I go, you know, as a neighbor, I'm like, Oh, I go to the pig, the wiggly, right?

Like eggs were up last week.

Like, I don't know, but I don't know what eggs you're buying.

But my eggs like cost a lot more.

And so to say that to them, like, I'm your neighbor.

There is evidence.

I shop at the same place as you.

Yes.

Oh my gosh.

Breakthrough and they're like, Oh, yeah, that's true.

But if you don't just like counter that, then they're like, Oh, well, yeah.

And just as a, well, first of all, the fact he said 199, he's back to that, but that was what he was saying for the longest time.

In fact, he said 235.

I'm like, oh, even your gas prices have gone up.

But as of today, as of right now, the triple A national average is $3 and about three, four cents.

And Wisconsin average is about 278, which is down.

But as we talked to Matt Randolph earlier this week, the reason why the prices have gone down is because the season changing blends.

This is not the work of him or any president.

No,

it's not.

Gas

prices, no.

Real briefly, Emily, because we're just about out of time, let's talk about these missing

posters.

The Green Bay, yes, there's a lot happening up here, isn't there?

Yeah, so there was a press conference last week where Tony Weed and a couple of local electeds came out and they said, I mean, there were missing posters put up, or yeah, there were posters put up around the area.

Where's Tony Weed, right?

Where's

Tony Weed?

Yeah, where's Tony Weed and all that.

And what kind of came out of that is like,

the decrying Democrats and to be clear this is unsubstantiated like there is we don't nobody knows to put those up it was an individual like no idea but the rhetoric from him continues to be Democrats are you know are dehumanizing us and they're using violent rhetoric and stuff like that and we're just like we're so tired of it because if you're gonna call it it shouldn't exist anywhere but if you are going to call out anything a make sure that you are applying that

equally to both sides, because I know a colleague of yours over in the third congressional district that is always on Twitter.

I think we know

who that is.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So it's just like, it's really, it's really, it's, it's unfortunate that we continue to, he doubles down on this stuff and continues to try to make news about it and really like.

It shouldn't exist anywhere.

It's existed for a long time.

Like ask any woman running for politics or holding elected office about what's in their DMs, right?

Like what's in their emails and things like that.

It is awful and violent.

And so like what we need to do is across the board condemn it without trying to score those political points.

I think that's what's the most frustrating thing for me.

Like be genuine about it.

If you really think this shouldn't exist, then just condemn it across the board and don't try to, don't try to use us.

Absolutely.

And if he's so upset about those missing posters, then maybe we should just put him on a milk carton.

Maybe that'll be a little.

a little more palatable, unless he's lactose intolerant.

Emily Zephos is the chair of the Democrats in Audigime County and running for state senate.

Thank you so very much for your time.

Emily, really appreciate it.

We'll talk to you again soon.

Thank you all have a great

day news coming up next and then when we come back with a little audio Sorbet it's salad wars

yeah

all the important things talked about on this program stay close you're listening to Matt near on air this is the civic media radio

network

food salad yummy yummy food salad

Good

morning and welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, our one, our only gal zone on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

Join us at 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream.

Good morning, live stream.

Hello!

On

Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter.

Thank you to our guest, Emily Zephos.

Again, we have all kinds of...

links in our show notes that Greg puts together.

It's really great.

Check it out at civicmedia.us.

Go to shows at the very top, go to mat and air on air.

And there is an archive of about two months worth of

shows.

And Greg has a great little compilation of what we talked about on the show, who the guests were, and then all kinds of links to the articles that we referenced and all stuff like that.

So take advantage of it.

If you would like to find out more, go to civicmedia.us.

I wanted to read this really quick because we didn't get a chance to get to this with Emily Cephos.

And I also want to thank Amy Berrio for being here too.

This has been a fantastic show.

Great guest.

She just, I wanted to drop this really quick because she made mention about who uses snap.

And she dropped some information here.

She said 15.7 million workers.

That's about 10% of all us workers were in households that participated in snap the past year.

Nationally, 55% of families are of snap.

are working as well.

So that's just a nice, no pun intended snapshot of who's using it and why it's important we should help them out.

So,

there you go.

There's working people and kids and senior citizens on fixed income who avail themselves of Snap.

This is the portion of the show that we call Audio Sorbet where we get away from the news and take a breath.

So we don't crack up.

I essentially think it's for me.

So I don't crack up.

I just got a call saying that apparently with audio Sorbet we clean their ears with fun.

That is that is

what we

say.

Thank

you very much.

Have a good day.

So today's audio Sorbet topic salad wars.

Yeah.

It started yesterday.

Off air by the way before and after the show.

Sometimes we get a few of them in one discussion

argument.

Hex extended extended discussion will say over salad First of all, do you like salad?

Mm-hmm.

What are your salad rules?

Yeah, are there things you won't eat on a salad?

Yeah, my father hated salads.

Did he ever say why?

No, okay, and you didn't ask I was gonna say of that generation you never asked you never asked you just he just didn't eat salad But you have

Hard and fast salad rules

all right once

At least as far as you the big the savory sweet thing Okay, you're very adamant about

Last week we spoke about Was it no breakfast

breakfast?

Breakfast wars breakfast wars and I made the claim and I stick by this that I don't particularly

Enjoy mixing my savory and sweet.

There are always moments where it can happen and it does work.

Caramel and sea salt that always works for me.

Okay.

I do not want to be the poster boy of intolerance towards this topic.

Salad

intolerance.

And

every time we talk about it, I may just seem like I am the grumpy shaking his fist at the sky.

Grandpa, who just can't handle the new things and the technology of the youth.

I just don't like putting cranberries in salad.

See, and I love like a cranberry walnut with feta.

Salad it's too

many competing

flavors.

Oh, it's yummy.

That's

great It

all

works together