What Are You Drinking, When You’re Not Drinking? (Hour 2)

Good morning and welcome.

Welcome to Matinair on air.

Jane Matinair, Greg Bach, Calvin Mutenoff coming to you live from our studio here at Radio Park in Racine.

You can always join us.

Call or text the number is the same.

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on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter, families back together.

Calvin, welcome back.

We missed you.

Reunited

and it feels so good.

You missed us too.

Yeah.

Yeah, you know, I was in Las Vegas and then I got home and I took some R and R time.

And yeah, I was getting a little bored, so it's good to be back.

Well, we're delighted to have

you

back.

All of us back together where we belong.

We have a really busy show coming up for you today.

Coming up after 9.30, Maureen Busilaki is gonna be joining us.

She's the director of the Wisconsin Alcohol Policy Project at the Medical College of Wisconsin, and they did a study on liver disease and drinking in Wisconsin.

And so we're gonna talk a little bit about that.

Also, there have been other studies that have come out just in the last couple of months.

that fewer Americans are indulging.

So we'll talk about that a little bit as well.

Maureen Busilaki coming up after the 9 30 news.

It's Friday.

That means that Dan Schaefer is here.

So we will be recombobulating in our number two.

He's not a new column out.

We'll also talk a little bit about the Brewers.

I know he actually stood in line to get his burger.

Of course he did

at Webby's.

That's what a

multi-award-winning journalist does for the game, for themselves, and I guess for their stomach.

Good Lord.

1035, of course, that's Audio Sorbet, where we try to lighten things up a little bit.

And we're going to tie this into our discussion with Maureen Busellaki about what is your go-to non-alcoholic drink?

Mm-hmm.

All right.

If you don't drink or you decide just this time around, I don't want to, I don't want to drink, drink.

I would like something else.

What would be your go to non-alcoholic alternative?

That's part of audio survey after 1030.

And we'll wrap up the show as we always do with this shouldn't be a thing.

Today we're, we're proud of ourselves for this one.

Medium rare edition.

We amuse ourselves endlessly.

So we hope you, we amuse you too.

Just a reminder, you've got a little time.

I'm going to make you wait a little bit.

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One of the start off with this, Afima is finally on the ground here in southeastern Wisconsin, a number of local TV stations reporting that they've been on the ground in Waukesha County.

They've also been on the ground in Milwaukee County, Menominee Falls.

It just is so much more widespread, I think, than folks appreciate.

If

you weren't affected or if you don't live in this area, this was pretty widespread.

We're talking about 10 to 14 inches of rain.

It was crazy.

Yeah, it's I don't want to say it's unexpected.

We knew the rain was going to come.

But as we've mentioned many times now, southeastern Wisconsin isn't used to this kind of rainfall and flooding.

It's very unusual.

And it's very important to have a plan going forward because if you live in the area, it's good just to be ready.

just to be ready.

Absolutely.

And unfortunately this we're seeing this happen now with storms there because of the warming climate.

They're carrying a lot more moisture.

Yes.

And that comes

down in the form of rain.

So but FEMA is on the ground.

They are not expected to be writing out any checks to anybody while they're here.

This is just to do an assessment.

Yes.

So they can put together a report that will then go to Washington.

Ultimately, whether or not Wisconsin, southeastern Wisconsin will get any FEMA money is up to the president.

Correct.

And if you have been affected, it is important for you to report that by going to 211.

That just allows them to centralize all the information, all of the data they have from you.

What damage you had,

what,

you know, did your water heat get ruined?

Was it, you know, your washer and dryer?

What other, a lot of folks had built in basements, finished basements.

Even if you feel like you didn't have a lot of damage, it's probably a good idea just to say something that way.

There are ways of, you know, looking at it from like, if, if you had an inch or two of water, they know there were houses that had that.

I believe personally, any information is good information.

Yeah, definitely.

Unless you say like, I was fine, but just.

Even if you had just a couple of inches.

Yeah, it really, it really does help them.

It helps Wisconsin.

It helps our emergency preparedness departments.

The, you know, it allows them to come up with plans, depending on where people live to say, Oh, this, this area of the, of this area of the town is affected more because of where they're located.

So yeah.

Go to 211.

You can file that online.

You don't have to call if you don't want to.

They were kind of overwhelmed the first

couple of days with calls.

So

211 online, it might be

a little bit easier for you.

And again, we'll include links in our show notes once the show is over.

Again, our thoughts to everybody who's still cleaning up after this.

In some areas, I didn't realize the falls this one guy had eight feet of water in his

basement.

Oh, that was the one with it was

the whole basement and then a foot and then a

foot on the first floor.

It's just mind boggling.

Yes.

So again, hang in there everybody and let's check on our neighbors.

This just kind of broke this morning.

Elon Musk must face a lawsuit claiming he ran an illegal one million dollar election lottery.

Yeah, that raised a couple eyebrows when this first came up leading up to the election in 2024.

Yeah.

All of a sudden, Elon's announcing, yep, I'm giving away a million dollars and all you have to do is sign up to protest activist

judges or something.

So this is the second time he's done this in as many elections, like in as many years, because last year he did something similar where he said, if you sign up to say that you support the second amendment.

it was a lottery or there was like a $20 prize that you could, or $20 reward you would get.

And for Wisconsin, it was, there was something similar and then there was the lottery to million dollars to two people.

And look, I'm not a fan of it.

I don't like it.

I don't like, I don't, I don't know if I could be more proud of Wisconsin for holding.

I mean, it was literally David versus Goliath in this manner.

But I have to I my thought and I've said it before on the show is that when you're Elon Musk one of the things you have is You know a small army of attorneys and I I would have to have thought that one of them said Well, let's go through the language right and make sure it's a sweepstakes and blah blah blah But I guess not he's going to court because I mean it just on the face though.

It just looks like sheer bribery

It does.

This is from Reuters.

Elon Musk ordered this week to face a lawsuit by voters accusing him of defrauding them into signing a petition supporting the US Constitution for a chance to win a million dollars.

The federal judge in Texas said the defendants plausibly argued that Musk and his political action committee wrongly encouraged her and induced her to give up her

personal ID as part of the giveaway late in the 2024 election.

And again, I've been in this business for a long time and I know that there are very strict rules regarding sweepstakes and giveaways and whether or not it's a lottery and how you do things.

There's a lot of things that govern that.

And yeah, like you said, you kind of wonder

He's got 427,000 lawyers.

Somebody would have looked at this.

But then I found a companion article on why his lawyers say this should not be a thing.

At 10.52, stay tuned.

It's over that

median rare edition.

Yeah, his lawyers came up with some kind of interesting arguments, essentially saying none of these things have anything to do with this.

We could do this we can give away money do this.

Yeah, no Well, that's just where we're at now.

I mean there's no Musk Elon says voters were told they would be reviewed for an opportunity to win one million dollars by becoming America packs folks people He said any notion that the money was a prize

was not a thing.

Make no mistake, an eligible voter's opportunity to earn is not the same thing as a chance to win.

So it

was a job search?

Apparently.

So if you won, I mean, I guess the question I would ask is, is anywhere in the description of what you were saying?

Because again, with these sweepstakes, there's always

you know, a small novel of rules and regulations that apply.

Kind of like, you know, you can't work for the company and play the game.

I'm looking at you civic media.

I want to win tickets.

But is there anything in that description in those rules that say you are then becoming an employee of America pack and therefore must engage in speaking events or go on TV or right?

I don't think

that was when.

People were encouraged to sign up

for this

none of this was mentioned Elon claims that chance was never involved

Which that's like rigging something.

Well, yeah for a whole bunch of people who entered thinking they just had a random shot of the million dollars the kind of no Are you saying that this contest was rigged?

I am saying that they had pre-selected who was going to win this money

Well, that makes sense because one of the winners was the chair of the college Republicans of Wisconsin really just I mean

Coincidences

did

he actually get the money then or did you just have a big paper golf check sitting at home?

Maybe he just he gave it back.

Maybe it's a maybe papers worth a million dollars.

I don't know but yeah

I don't expect any, I'm sorry, I don't mean to be, I don't mean to be the unfun guy in the fun wheel here, but I don't think anything is going to come of this.

But we found out one thing is that people of a certain level of privilege and money and status, they get to do whatever they want.

And at the very least, they're just like, well, you got to pay up fine.

Oh, sure.

Okay, cool.

But it still comes back to the fact that Wisconsin said no to Elon Musk, the world's in a big way.

When we when we talk about this in in the history of Wisconsin, it's not was it the presidential race?

No, was it the governor's race?

No, what was it?

It was it was a seat for this Wisconsin Supreme Court Yeah, like it was such a it's not a nothing seat.

No, it's not a long shot It's also not the sexiest election in the in the group for him to spend this much money

trying to influence this election

Exactly, but Wisconsin we said no

We don't like that.

And I have to believe that people who voted for Donald Trump actually voted against Elon Musk in this one because people in Wisconsin do not like outsiders coming in, trying to tell us what to do.

I don't want to make it sound like we're a militia, but it's it's true.

Like people like Elon Musk, carpetbaggers.

Well, I think, yeah, I do think that at least over the last couple of years, Wisconsin's had enough with carpetbaggers.

Eric Havde, Tim Michaels.

Go be rich.

Have

a happy

life.

Yeah.

No one is above the law, says Cash Patel, except for all these guys.

More of the details on the way.

Stay close.

You're listening to Matt Nair on air.

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Welcome, welcome back to Matt and air on air Jane that near Greg box sweet Cal be coming to you live from our studio at radio park in Racine You can always join us call

text.

The number is the same at 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter after the 930 news.

Maureen Boussalaki is going to join us.

She's the director of the Wisconsin Alcohol Policy Project at the Medical College of Wisconsin, and they did a study about Wisconsin residents

and liver disease tied to drinking.

So we're going to talk about that coming up after 9.30.

Stay tuned for that.

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All right, before we get to the news, I did want to talk about this a little bit.

Former Trump administration official John Bolton.

You know, super duper liberal.

The guy with the big mustache.

Yeah, communist

sympathizer

John Bolton.

Yeah, I'm

so cray cray.

His house was raided by the FBI this morning.

And Democratic representative from Illinois, Raha Kristanamuri, says that this is a obvious weaponization of the Justice Department, which

the

Trump administration blamed the Biden administration for the entire time they were in office, as a distraction from the Epstein files, which are supposedly some of those files gonna be released today.

Whether or not,

They just redact everything except the words and and the remains to be seen.

But we have a clip from the representative on CNN.

Calvin, can we play that clip, please?

It looks political to me.

I mean, it's it's it looks political.

It looks like it's also an attempt to distract from the other big news of the day, which is the.

first production of the Epstein files that's required by subpoena from the oversight committee on which I sit.

And they want to change the conversation repeatedly.

This is going to happen every day, because they don't want people talking about the Epstein files or about their mismanagement of the economy.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, pretty much.

And I saw something online the other day talking about that we shouldn't use the word distraction, because

It minimizes the things that are happening.

Oh, these are not small

things

and that is the point I want to make is when we refer to these things as distractions We do not mean as and they shouldn't be given attention

or that they're insignificant

They're utilizing these horrible things whether it's whether it's you know filling DC with all the federal agents they can to clean up crime or you know

battering down the door of a man who, though I didn't agree with him, just his highest crime was speaking against the Trump administration.

Well, and he wrote a book.

Well, that's what I'm saying.

Yeah, that had some material in there that was apparently, I remember when this book came out.

I mean, there's thousands of copies of this book that are already out there.

Yeah.

So.

Yeah, I just want to make it clear that when we say distractions, we never mean that you shouldn't pay attention to the things happening.

We're saying that the Trump administration is using these actions, whatever they may be, week by week.

Literally, every week it's a new thing.

They're using it to also take your attention off the things like the big bill for billionaires and all the things it's going to do to us over the next year.

the tariffs as well as the Epstein files.

So you can look at both things at the same time.

My point is that they're just hoping that we'll pay more attention to John Bolton being raided than we will on these Epstein files that are supposed to be coming out today.

Or this other thing that our president said yesterday when he was meeting with police and military in Washington DC yesterday.

Was he talking about crime in DC?

Was he talking?

No.

This is a quote.

from the president of the United States.

Remember, we have no money for anything.

One of the things, this is a quote, one of the things we're going to be doing is redoing your parks.

We're going to be regressing all your parks, all brand new sprinkler systems, the best you can buy.

It'll look like Trump National Golf Club.

Trump

says, quote, I'm very good at grass because I have a lot of golf courses all over the place.

I know more about grass.

than any human being, I think, in the world.

Grass has a life.

You know, that grass has a life.

We have a life and grass has a life.

The grass here died about 40 years ago, but we're going to have new grass.

Let's not pay attention to that, though.

It's completely normal.

When my great uncle started talking like that, we took away his keys.

Did you?

Yeah.

So I don't.

First of all, I had to look at regrasse as a word, which I can't believe that's a fact.

But again, what you said, we talked about this yesterday with regard to the ICE vehicles as well as- Oh, the wrapping?

The painting, the border wall.

When you tell us there's no money and then you're going to spend hundreds of millions of dollars on these projects around the country that are very, very, in my opinion, bad spending.

Wasteful.

Wasteful.

Wasteful completely.

Then maybe we can fund SNAP.

We have news coming up next.

Stay with us.

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Good morning and welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, Calviente on the board committee from our studio at Radio Park in Racine where you can always join us, call or text.

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F A S T. We are delighted to be joined by the director of the Wisconsin Alcohol Policy Project at the Medical College of Wisconsin.

Maureen Busilaki is here.

Good morning Maureen.

Thanks so much for joining us.

Good morning.

Thanks for having me.

Absolutely.

There was an article in Wisconsin Public Radio.

Trevor Hook had the byline that encouraged us to look.

to track you down, essentially.

And the headline reads, more Wisconsin residents dying from alcohol related liver failure.

Deaths from alcohol related liver diseases jumped in Wisconsin and nationwide during the COVID pandemic.

Liver cirrhosis deaths increasing 35% in Wisconsin from 2019 to 2023.

That sounds like a pretty big jump.

It is.

It's very significant.

It's also significant that we're seeing it in younger people and much higher rates for women than we've seen in the past.

So men still have much higher rates, but women are closing that gap right now.

Um, so it's, it's really, um, disturbing.

And we're also at the same time seeing young people drink less, but there's certain young people that are drinking much more.

So do you think it is?

I mean, I am of a certain age.

I'm in my late 40s.

I almost said my mid 40s.

No, I'm in my late 40s now.

And when I was younger, drinking was a part of the culture for many reasons, two of them being not as much to do back.

then, but also kind of like if you didn't drink, you weren't cool.

And I know that sounds very weird to say now, but it's the truth.

For young people, is the difference their location?

Like if kids who live in like cities and more access to more activities, are they drinking less versus kids who might live in rural areas?

Is that what you're seeing?

Or is it just, is there any sort of data that shows which kids are drinking more?

You know, I have not.

dove into the most recent youth aerial risk survey.

So I can't answer that specifically.

But I do know that there can be these cultural divides.

And in more rural areas, we tend to see higher rates of excessive alcohol use.

But I have to say in Wisconsin, it's everywhere.

Yeah, it's pretty much

across the board.

I mean, the city of Milwaukee has a really bad rate of excessive.

And when I say that, I mean that people that are over consuming either by binge drinking, which is five or more drinks in a single session, four for women, because that means you are intoxicated.

You're at 0.08.

And for a lot of people, that is only half their binge drink, right?

And then you've got underage drinking.

You've got pregnant women drinking.

And then we also see heavy drinking, which is one to two drinks a day.

For a lot of folks, I think they think one to two drinks a day is nothing.

And that's why we're trying to get some of these messages out because I talked to

someone who works in the ICU, dealing with liver transplant folks.

And what he said to me is two to three drinks a day can destroy your liver.

My goodness.

Folks, I don't think people know that, Maureen.

Do you?

No, I

don't.

Even though we say it.

Right.

Right.

But again, and I'm older than Greg, I'm older than Greg by almost 20 years.

So

The culture when I grew up, getting drunk was almost a badge of honor.

Even as a teenager, when you were in high school and we went to field parties and stuff like that.

And it was, how drunk did you get?

Did you pass out?

Good for you.

Why aren't you drinking, bro?

And I thought that has started to change at least among the youth, but from what you're saying, it kind of depends.

Yes, I mean, we're definitely seeing much lower underage drinking rates than when I am in between the two of you was young.

And so that's good.

But again, we're also seeing a category of people that are drinking much, much more.

In fact, they had to make a new category of drinking called high risk, where people are just way over the binge drinking rates.

and consuming quite a bit of alcohol.

So we have like a subset that we have to get to.

And there's been some really great research that's come out recently, because sometimes I think we think people are using alcohol, A, just for fun and to be social.

But it turns out that you can develop mental illnesses from drinking like that, as well as it can be something you use to

deal with a mental illness, right?

But it

goes both ways.

So we really have to be vigilant with our kids.

And we have to figure out how do we support because we're seeing young women drinking in much higher rates.

Again, it's a subset, but it's alarming.

And doctors tell us they're seeing people needing liver transplants, women in particular at 25.

So and

The average age has dropped.

This used to be, you know, higher middle age that you'd see liver cirrhosis.

I was going to say 50s, 60s, right?

Yeah.

Now it's 45.

Wow.

I want to go back a second to those numbers you just gave us, because I think one of the most important things I think, especially in Wisconsin with the culture that we have.

That I you know, don't find to be funny.

I find it to be disturbing and I feel I know a lot of people who liked it like yeah, we're the we're the drunkest state in the country like that's not a badge of honor everybody I get where you're coming from but I Want to go back to the numbers because I think those are myths within like what you just said is quote heavy drinking is one to two drinks a day and that's every day That's consistently.

Yes

What are other myths that you find that you with your it with what you do you have to dispel for other people that we might not know or it's like, you know, I didn't think one to two drinks a day was

I would

say maybe don't drink one to two every day, but I would never I would never have said that's heavy drinking But what are the other myths Maureen that you find that you have to break for people for them to understand how severe and how important it is for us to take our drinking

habits into consideration.

That's a great question.

The first one I would say is the red wine myth.

It's good for you.

It's good for you.

Right, it's good for your heart.

It's the flavonoids or some noids in there that are good for you.

Yeah, it also causes cancer.

Yeah.

Seven different types of cancer.

And I don't think the public realizes that.

So the red wine study has been doing for a long time.

And I think we're getting some traction that the public's understanding that the recent Gallup poll shows that the public is shifting their alcohol.

And the fact that cancer is a real piece of this.

And I think a lot of people have ignored that.

It's been known in the field for at least a decade, if not longer than that.

And so I think that's a message that people have to get out.

The difference for men in drinking one versus two is significant for their health.

So as we look at the dietary guidelines changing, the research is showing that that one to two per day is really not a good idea.

It should be less than one for women.

and one or less for men.

And Greg, you're right on the mark.

Don't drink every day.

Yeah.

Right?

And just don't drink every day.

You know, we have meatless Mondays, right?

At an alcohol-free night or two, it's really important for your kids, too, to see that you, you know, that every time you go out,

that

you're not always drinking.

You know, I know it seems like every festival we have in this state, there's got to be alcohol there.

bypass some of that and you know encourage event you know events not to always have alcohol because we need other ways of socializing and you know and you think of our kids you think of people in recovery you know we need spaces that are.

Just good, clean,

fun.

If you're just joining us on Matt Nair on air, Maureen Busulaki is our guest.

She's the director of the Wisconsin Alcohol Policy Project at the Medical College of Wisconsin.

And we're talking about a recent study that finds that more Wisconsinites are dying from alcohol-related liver failure, which is very, very disturbing.

It's interesting that you mentioned Maureen, you know, having more spaces available for people who are sober or are, you know, sober or curious.

or whatever, we are seeing a few, there's a section now at Packer Games, right?

Isn't the yellow section still at Packer Games?

I believe there are areas where there is no alcohol available if you wanna just go there.

I believe Ampham Field has it as

well.

Has an area too.

So I guess I take some encouragement from that.

But again, it's getting the word out about these numbers and changing.

The changing how we look at some of these studies, I think it's really interesting that you brought up the whole red wine thing, Maureen.

We've talked to Dr. Kristen Lyrely numerous times and she makes a point of when a study comes out and says red wine is good for you, you may want to look at who financed that study.

It might be the red wine guys.

Well, that's, I mean, that's the thing is like we, we've, I've seen a light.

There was a great John Oliver episode where he talked about

Studies.

And I needed to do air quotes there, studies, because they're great headlines.

Oh, chocolate's good for you, or this is bad for you, or this.

it minimizes the actual details within those studies.

And one thing, you talked about the red wine factor, you also just mentioned pregnant women drinking as well.

And I feel when I was growing up, if a pregnant woman was drinking, she was going to be the worst mother who ever lived.

But now I feel like, and correct me if I'm wrong, Maureen, but that is sort of relaxed in the sense of the red wine hypothesis where she can have a drink here and there.

It's not gonna be,

It's not going to damage the baby, but you honestly don't know.

So it's just best not to, right?

It's definitely best not to

drink

while you're pregnant at all.

And the medical advice has not changed on that.

Doctors will tell you the best thing is to not drink at all while you're pregnant.

or to continue our conversation with Maureen Buselaki talking about the increasing rates of Wisconsinites dying from alcohol related liver failure.

Stay with us.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

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Good morning and welcome back to Matt Nair on air.

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We are joined by Maureen Busellaki.

She's the director of the Wisconsin Alcohol Policy Project at the Medical College of Wisconsin.

And we're talking about a disturbing study that found that more and more Wisconsin residents are dying from alcohol-related liver

earlier.

Yeah.

And so I know that I don't want to, I'm not here to police anyone's habits.

And I, and I think that less drinking is better.

I, I will say for myself, I hit a pretty big high a few years ago, and it became very cumbersome in my daily activities.

As far as just like, not even like I wasn't getting drunk at work, I was just feeling awful all the time because I was tired and whatnot.

And now I drink one Bloody Mary on a Saturday morning.

That's it.

I'm good to go.

And sometimes I even have a virgin Mary too, if I'm feeling it.

But the question I have for you, Maureen, and this is, you know, what the benefits are, of course, feel like a no brainer.

But for people who want to say like, All right, maybe I'll, maybe I'll take that.

Maybe I'll stop drinking every day, even that one to two drinks, maybe I'll just drink twice a week.

What are the feelings that people can have body wise, physically, when you stop or curb your drinking?

Yeah, so there's Dread January where there's been some studies on this and we find multiple benefits from stopping drinking alcohol for a period of time.

People find they sleep better.

I think that's one of the big ones for folks that their skin is more clear.

They have more energy.

They overall feel better.

Um, so it has a lot of benefits and you save some money, right?

Yep.

Um, so there's multiple things that happen for folks when they do that.

But even as you suggest, having some days where you're not drinking can make a big difference and just, you know, cutting back and we want folks, you know, like

Like the guidelines Canada has I think we'd be left out of Wisconsin, you know, they're like two drinks a week.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah, so I think What we need to do is meet people where they're at.

Yeah,

right.

And so if you're going out and you know, like do one less.

Yeah, right.

No and and give yourself just a break because

what is happening is there's things going on clearly with your liver and other parts of your body.

And when you're not drinking, your body can repair itself.

And so it's important to do that.

Maureen, what what kind of symptoms if if what are the symptoms of liver disease?

What what should people maybe be on the lookout for if they have been drinking for a long time?

Yeah, um, you know, I think it's probably

It's like a slow build of things, but I think that that tiredness that fatigue is definitely a piece of it I think you know losing some of your ambition can be part of you know and feeling like you can't wait till you can get that drink Yeah, is definitely a big sign of that, but I guess to

it's concerning because if something is happening with your liver

The only way you're really going to find out about that is if you go for an annual blood panel, right?

Isn't that something that keeps track of how your liver is functioning?

Right.

That fatty tissue begins to turn up in the liver, and that can turn to the scar tissue, which leads to cirrhosis.

So if you've got like jaundice, fever, confusion, the disease is already pretty progressed.

Yeah.

Well, we just,

you

know, for our listeners, we encourage, you know, I, I think if you want to find help, if you want to take it down, I think, I think that what you suggested is the best start.

It's not, don't make yourself go cold turkey.

Don't make yourself stop right away.

That can lead you to, that can lead you to bumps in the road and seeing it as failures and

then you, and then you stop

trying.

Yeah.

Just make that commitment.

Say, all right, I usually go out and I have three cocktails or whatever.

Tonight I'm going to have two.

Let's start there.

Can I, can I have two tonight?

And if I can have two tonight, I can have two tomorrow.

It's not ideal, but it's a start.

You start to slowly bring yourself down with small goals and then you can get where you want to be.

But yeah, I'm, I know some people can do cold turkey.

It's possible.

That doesn't work for

everybody.

Correct.

But I think what you're, what you suggest, Maureen, is much more attainable and much more goal driven as far as just saying, all right, let's, let's set this thing one less.

And coming up later on in the show, Maury, next hour, after the 1030 News, we're going to talk about what is your go-to non-alcoholic drink?

Because there's a lot more options that folks have now if they would still like to have the glass and have it look like something because I do think there is still that you're not drinking?

Yeah.

What like where there's something

wrong with you

or I want a pretty glass of liquid right with an umbrella in it You can do that too Maureen Busalaki has been our guest.

She is the director of the Wisconsin alcohol policy project at the Medical College of Wisconsin Maureen Thank you so very much for your time really appreciate it

Thanks for having me.

I appreciate it too.

We have news coming up next.

And when we return, we're going to recombobulate with Dan Schaffer, Civic Media's political editor.

So stay here.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air on the Civic Media Radio Network.

Good morning.

Welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on Air.

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at 635.

He is back after a little time off.

Dan Schaefer is here, Civic Media's political editor and the creator of the Recon Population Area.

Welcome back.

Good to see you.

Good to see

you as well.

Always wonderful to join all of you fine folks here on Matt and Air on

Air.

Very happy to have you here.

You managed to.

Pump out a column even though you were away for a little while.

Well, while I was away, I put a call out for people to send me questions for a summer mailbag.

Nice.

And just turned out that just about everybody had the same thing that they wanted to ask me about, which was about the race for governor.

And so maybe it has something to do with, you know, the column I wrote earlier in the summer about Tony Evers and a third term and what all that might invite.

Maybe it's just the hot political topic of the moment.

The only other questions I really got were about the bucks and the brewers.

So we could talk about that too.

I'm actually going to the, uh, I'm going to the Sunday game, the Euker celebration

on

Sunday, a couple of friends of mine and we jumped on tickets the minute they went on sale.

So very much looking forward to that.

Um, and, you know, along with, with that and the, the questions about the governor's race.

You know, I started writing it as just like a short breakdown, but anyone who reads the reconbobulation area knows that I am not really capable of a short breakdown.

Yeah, you don't do briefs.

I don't do briefs.

No

longs.

Can I

I'd like to ask you a question.

They'll going back to the mailbag thing before we get into the new article.

Yeah, you wrote the you wrote the opinion piece and I'm going to repeat that opinion piece.

Sorry, I'm still bitter about some of the backlash on that.

You wrote that opinion piece months ago, and since then, of course, Governor Evers has announced he will not seek a third term.

We are

going to

have a primary for the Democratic side of the election as well as the Republican, most likely, unless Tom Tiffany has his way.

First open race for governor in 16 years.

There you go.

What was some of the...

It's just a small timeline from writing it to the announcement from the governor to now What have you heard from people as far as like, you know, I'm not saying that you convinced him not to run

certain But

I'm sure you heard from people saying well, you know, that was like what was the any correlation or at least you know People saying well, you wrote that article.

He didn't run, you know What was your the words you were hearing from people out there in the world from people like me who you know Try to say things out loud to people who are real

political pundits and or operatives.

I think for a lot of people it was, I'm glad this conversation is happening in public now because I think a lot of people were having a conversation about what Evers is going to do.

I think they were having that conversation privately, you know, within the Democratic caucus, within the people, you know, the consultant class and whatever talking about what's going to be next for the party.

You know, should evers go back?

What are the poll numbers?

Like I think those those conversations were happening.

Yeah.

And so I think my column just brought it a little bit more out into the public so that we're having these conversations, you know, on matinee on air

on the civic media

radio network on, you know, wherever else they were having these conversations in the never.

political conversation that is happening in Wisconsin.

But I think it is just, you know, from there, it just became, you know, I think it came instead of like hushing and being quiet around the corner.

And we don't want to say this publicly.

We're

so

afraid of our own shadow.

This is how we operate

as Democrats now, for some reason.

You know, it just became more of a public conversation.

And I think

Frankly, I think that was a good thing.

Well, isn't that one of the criticisms directed at Democrats is the political, you know, the pundits and all those guys doing these deals behind closed doors and killing primaries and killing off things.

And that did not endear them to a lot of people.

No.

And I think that, you know, you got to get back to some of those small D Democratic principles of just letting the voters decide.

I think Democrats are just so careful and they're just so afraid of their own shadow and they're

just so

afraid, so risk of.

that they have become afraid of their own voters.

And so I think, you know,

They're so afraid of a primary, afraid of the uncertainty that might come without having an incumbent on the ticket or whatever it might be.

And I think you got to recognize that this is a moment that Democratic Party needs to start doing things differently.

And the people who need to set the course for the party, not the consultant class, not the party leaders, it needs to be the voters.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

And I won't belay the topic.

I just wanted to find out because I was interested in.

what your experience because you are at the center of a pretty

some pretty harsh words from people from

both

inside and out.

And I just wanted to see like what you've been hearing.

And I totally agree.

There's no, I mean, at the very least there's no problem with having the conversation.

There's no problem with saying, Hey, this is what I think.

There you go.

But to hear people say like, we shouldn't even be talking about this.

How dare you?

Tony Evers is a

God.

Until he says he's not going to run.

Then we say congratulations.

You did a great job.

What, you know what I mean?

Like you, do you actually believe it?

Or are you just

towing the line so yeah that's thank you for indulging me for a moment but you have a new article about a about the upcoming upcoming god it's gonna be upcoming but next year's governor's race

Next August, less than a year away.

So this is what I titled the two early breakdown of the 2026

race for governor.

I really enjoy your embracing of that.

I do.

That's pretty great.

Yeah.

And the two early too long breakdown

really of the

2026 race for governor in true recombobulation area form.

So, you know, I went through the list of candidates who have declared, who have said that they're going to declare, are exploring potentially someday declaring a candidacy.

for governor and went through both the Democratic side and the Republican side.

I guess we can start on the Democratic side since there's a little bit more going on there because I think on the Republican side, everything is just about getting the endorsement of one person and that being, of course, President Donald Trump.

And then on the Democratic side, I think there are a lot of different angles to go with this.

And so the way I broke it down initially was

that I think there is a big four of potential candidates

who

would be running.

And so we have Lieutenant Governor Sara Rodriguez, who is already running.

Milwaukee County Executive David Crowley

has

said he's going to run State Senator Calderois who made some news on the Civic Media

Network on the Todd Oliver Show.

She is likely to run.

And then Attorney General Josh Call, who has made it really no secret that he would be interested in running, were that to be a possibility.

And so those are who I considered to kind of be the big four.

I then talked about Ben Wickler, who I put in the category of doubtful, but not ruling it out.

The heart to say category I put I have Mandela Barnes and Cavalier Johnson.

the wild card who made some news earlier this week about who possibly being interested in running state representative, Francesca Hong, who is a friend of Matt and air on air.

I know she is.

Yes.

Very

interesting to

see what's going on with

her.

Love her.

And then running, but not for governor, Sarah Godlowski, who announced earlier this week that she's going to be running for lieutenant governor.

Right.

So that was kind of the initial breakdown, you know, on the Democratic side of the potential top candidates.

I think there are some others that we can continue to monitor.

WEDC.

CEO, Missy Hughes.

I've heard a little rumblings that she might be interested.

Uh, you know, state Senator Chris Larson is a frequent name on these types

of lists.

And then I was also at the campaign launch earlier this week for American family field beer vendor, uh, Ryan Sternad, who formerly announced his campaign this week.

So he's also in the mix as a Democrat.

When you put that story into the.

in the company chat.

At first, I read that as, oh, he's a beer distributor.

Like he owns a company that distributes beer.

And then when I

read it, I'm like, no,

this is a guy who sells beer in American family field.

I might vote for him.

There's just something

so wonderful about a guy who's like, I'll run.

And I want to hear his ideas because all of those people you just talked about before, the bigger names, the more well-known names are individuals who are, for the most part, politicians, work in politics.

know how to talk the political game.

I have a feeling that this guy is going to talk like us.

He's going to talk like people who, you know, just have a nine to fiver.

And like, these are the things that really are on my plate.

Like I got kids, I got grandkids.

I want to do this.

I, I know the possibilities of him winning, but I also very love the fact that he's doing

it.

What, what kind of message did he have?

Yeah.

So I was at his campaign launch.

He, he, he, it was at, um,

Mitchell Boulevard Park, which is right across the highway from American Family Field.

So he wanted to have the stadium in the background.

He's been a vendor there since 1988.

So, back to the

days of Milwaukee County

Stadium.

He

served many a drink on the first base side in Milwaukee for Brewer's games.

So, he talked about wanting the Democratic Party to focus more on the working class.

He said he disagreed with Democrats' approach during the COVID pandemic.

He disagreed with some of the safety restrictions and things like that, shutting down his...

Place of employment basically for several months as a beer vendor there talked about that he talked about relaxing environmental regulations and said it wanted to do away with emissions testing And he also talked about how he is 100% pro-choice Wanted to get rid of act 10 wanted to get rid of right to work laws So kind of a really interesting mix.

He also spent a significant amount of time talking about how we wanted to change the state fish from a musky to a sturgeon to promote winter

Tourism so like I have the full speech if you want to listen to

it Boy

you

covered a lot of ground.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, so, you know an interesting candidate Certainly the working-class angle and talking about You know how the Democratic Party has stumbled there.

I think that's an interesting message I think

it's

one perhaps the three of us agree with To a certain extent to so, you know, it's but it like those types of

long shot potential people outside of the political system, a guy who just like works third shift manufacturing and then spends some time at the ballpark selling, selling beers in the stands.

Like I want to hear what people like that have to say too.

We have a text from Jake listening on watching on YouTube.

He says, I think the concern with a speak no evil on top democratic elected officials like Evers Biden was that it can lead to negative feedback loop that right wing media then pounces up pounces on that shouldn't be a cover though.

we need new leadership for Dems in DC, I do think there's a real thing in Wisconsin with people being chosen behind closed doors.

And there's a lot of resentment about that.

I think you're right.

And I think, I think one of the other problems too.

And, and, and it's fun to, well, I'll cover this on the other side of our, our small water break that

we're going to be taking.

That's called a tease.

Yeah.

Do you want to know what I'm thinking?

Stick around.

Greg Bach has

thought.

We'll recombob you late.

On the other side.

We'll

recomboculate.

Oh, recomboculate.

Stay with us.

No.

You're listening to Matt Maron here.

It's Friday on the Civic Media radio network.

Don't go away.

Good morning and welcome back to Metnair on Air.

Jane Metnair, Greg Bott, Calviente on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

Join us, call or text at 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube,

And what used to be Twitter free ticket Fridays is underway the only way to play and to get in the running for a four pack of Milwaukee Brewers club level tickets for next Thursday afternoon when the Brewers host the Diamondbacks is to enter using the Civic Media app.

So open up your phone and text in the word via the app fast.

F-A-S-T, text in the word fast.

Dan Schaefer, you can't play.

A text in the word fast for everyone else, F-A-S-T.

And again, you're in the running for that four pack of Milwaukee Brewer's club level tickets.

Good seeds for the hottest team in baseball.

That's right.

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And then Maggie Dawn from 4 to 6 PM.

Text in the word right now, though, is FAST.

F-A-S-T.

Dan Schaefer, Civic Media's political editor and creator of the Multia, word-winning re-combobulation area is here.

We were talking about your latest column before the break.

Perhaps a little early for a rundown of way too early

way too early,

but I'd love that you titled it that that's pretty great I'm leaning into it.

Yeah, you are you're owning it as far as who's got who's in the running for Governor in Wisconsin next year

Yeah, so I talked about how I thought there was like a big four on there on the Democratic side and I ran a poll

on the Twitter's yesterday of those four.

And would you be interested in hearing how that poll went?

So who are the four?

So the four being Attorney General Josh Call, Lieutenant Governor Sarah Rodriguez, Milwaukee County Executive David Crowley, and State Senator Calderoy's as kind of the main four,

I think.

I

voted.

Okay.

So

who would you vote for in Democratic primary?

Who would you guess was the winner of that?

I am going to say Calderoy's.

Calderoy is not incorrect.

Sarah Rodriguez

was the

number one with about 36%, followed by Josh Call at about 30%.

David Crowley at about 23% and Calderoy's at about 12%.

I'm

really

surprised

that

Josh Call did that well.

Yeah.

I am.

Yeah.

I feel like the name recognition plus there, I think there are a lot of people, specifically Democrats in the state who are stung by the fact that he really didn't go after the fake electors.

He really hadn't made an, he really hadn't started doing anything until about last year.

Then all of a sudden he is on all of these lawsuits.

He's getting out there saying stuff and people were still kind of like, you know, Hey, little, little too late.

Exactly.

Exactly.

And I think that might hurt him in the primary.

I

do.

I think you're right about that.

Among the.

people who are like very tuned into things.

I wonder if they want to see more out of Josh Call, like

the

fake electors thing for sure.

But I think at the same time, you win two statewide races, you probably would start out the race as the front runner.

He's got the name

recognition.

I think that, you know, it probably helps that Sarah Rodriguez is like off and running and she's getting endorsements and she has campaign videos.

And she was on with you guys this week, right?

Yeah,

so.

Sort of.

Well, she was on the week before.

Oh, right, right, right.

But, but I think, uh, I think Josh call, you know, I think he would start out the race as the front runner.

I don't think he would be an overwhelming one.

Um, but I think you win, you win two statewide races.

You're, you're going to walk into it on the list there.

So I think that is, uh, what's compelling about his candidacy.

And I also think like, like Tony Evers said this one in his, um, you know, 2022 victory speech, when he was reelected, he said, boring wins.

Do people want somebody who's, as Trump is causing all of this chaos in Washington, like, do they want a leader at the state level who is a little bit quieter?

A little bit, you know, quiet, can speak with some legal authority

as having

these- Get things done.

Get things done.

Like, is that an approach that Josh Call could potentially take in this?

The question I would also ask is, and I say this knowing full well that there were many Democrats and Republicans who are not happy with the state budget, but-

When push comes to shove, Tony Evers wanted to get the budget finished, and it was an optimal for some people, and I know that, but it is about his ability to walk into a room and compromise and say these are the things.

And also, I mean, of course, Diane Hesselbein has to be appraised and applauded for walking in the room saying, let's get this done.

But I think there is something to be said about a leader who

might have to hold their nose at something, but in order to get the work done to benefit the people, they're going to do it.

And Tony Evers definitely has that.

And I think a candidate, I really like Sarah Rodriguez.