Invest In People, Not Corporations (Hour 1)

Good morning and welcome, welcome to Matt and Air on Air.

Jane Matt and Air, Greg Bach, Calvin Butenoff.

Coming to you live from our studio here at Radio Park in Racine, you can always join us, call or text.

The number is the same, 855-752-4842.

You can also leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream, on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter, and our newest way to check in if you have the Civic Media app, which you should, because our statewide

Text-to-Win Scotty Summer Contest is underway for the next two weeks.

You have to have the app in order to enter.

But if you do have the app, you can now do a voice note.

That's very, very cool.

It is cool.

You go to the app, open it up, pick your station.

You can customize, pick your favorite station.

And then when you're in that page, you can simply hit the word voice note, which is the bottom of the app.

And you just leave us a little recording.

Tell us who you are.

We're listening.

where you're listening and what station you listen or if you're listening to the app and, you know, we'll take a listen ahead of time, make sure it's in context and FCC compliance.

Always important.

But yeah, you can do that.

It's another great way to get in touch with us.

And that's through the Civic Media app and download it for free.

Do it now.

Do it now.

It's completely free.

We have a busy show coming up after the 9 30 news, the president of the Wisconsin Farm Bureau.

Darren Von Ruden will be joining us going to be talking about a number of things, including obviously tariffs.

Darren is a soybean farmer and Derek Van Orden.

Darren Von Ruden.

Derek Van Orden.

I spoke to farmers recently about tariffs.

Yeah.

He's all for him.

Right in front of farmers faces right in front of

farmers faces, so we're to talk to Darren von Ruden about that among many other things after the 930 news our number two Nathan Deming very much looking forward to talking to Nathan He is a Wisconsin native and he's a filmmaker.

Yes

who kind of spends his time in between Wisconsin and California, I believe but peach wabba

who does nightlight with Pete Schwabba from six to eight PM across the network on weekdays was actually in a film of his.

Really?

Yes.

Oh.

And Nathan has got a new project, Wisconsin focused.

Yeah.

It's pretty cool.

And then we're also going to talk about there was this proposal that came up a couple of months ago about film credits.

Yes.

Trying to encourage and entice essentially companies who are making movies to make them in Wisconsin.

Absolutely.

It's I'm looking forward to the discussion because I

It just it's it's one of those things we're like why doesn't this isn't this this seems right?

It doesn't seem like it

would be a hard yeah Yeah, it

doesn't so that's coming up in hour number two also in hour number two the segment we call audio Sorbet

around

1035 after the 1030 news There it is the light harps What's your home remedy?

What's your home rogue?

Everybody's got one

We were talking about this off the air because

of

something that I've recently been dealing with.

But what is your home remedy?

You know it

works.

And you know it works.

There might not be any scientific basis for it, but

it

works.

What is your home remedy?

We'll do that after the 1030 news

I'll even open it up to it doesn't work But you refuse to believe that it doesn't

do it anyway And then we'll wrap up the show as we always do with this shouldn't be a thing today It's the old gully G edition.

Oh

god

There is an audio portion and a video portion that we'll include in the show notes Oh warn you now when

the

audio portion comes turn them speakers down just a little bit.

Yeah, it's gonna be loud.

Yeah

O'Gully G edition of TISBAT coming up around 10.51.

Wanted to start off with this, though.

Found this this morning on Wisconsin Public Radio.

Anya then wagged a dunk with the byline.

Following failed Robin Voss recalls, rules for petition circulators could change in Wisconsin.

Yeah.

Remember when a group of Republicans.

Yes.

They were the ones who mounted this recall against Robin Voss.

Twice.

Twice.

Because the

2020 election wasn't stolen.

Correct.

He came out and said that the 2020 election was not stolen after Michael Gabelman took.

Spent millions of our dollars.

Spent whatever you want to call it, allegedly stole millions of our taxpayer dollars.

And Robin Voss, I think just finally said this.

it was fine.

It's nothing was just, can we move on?

And that really enraged the, I would say the further Magar right.

Cause Robin Voss's pro Trump voted for Trump endorses him to the whole thing, but this was not good enough for a certain group of individuals who reside, I believe in either Racine or Kenosha.

I saw the house that was the headquarters, by the way.

But yeah, they tried to recall him twice.

in one election cycle.

And now there's some people are not happy about that.

So they want to make some changes as they always do.

So here is what they're looking at.

Any under current law, the way things are right now, anyone who is eligible to vote in Wisconsin if they live here can circulate nominating papers or recall petitions.

So

anyone who's 18 and a citizen

and not otherwise disqualified can circulate these recall petitions.

Under the new GOP bill, people circulating recall petitions need to live here in Wisconsin.

This would also apply to people circulating nomination papers to get somebody on the ballot.

I know there was a lot of discussion again during this Robin Voss recall attempt that they were bringing in outsiders.

to knock on doors and circulate these petitions.

Then they did.

And I say to that, so what?

They're not voting.

And volunteers coming in from out of state is a regular occurrence in campaigning.

You bust people in, they'll knock on doors, they cover more area.

Both sides do it.

That's not uncommon.

It's not a surprise.

They're not doing anything illegal.

They're nearly knocking a door saying, hey, we want to do X. Would you like to support?

That's it.

I think this is wholly stupid.

His feelings were hurt.

Well, you know, I didn't realize that Robin Voss had feelings after the way he spoke to Lou Ann Bird yesterday.

But you know, sensitive.

Wow.

He's a sensitive popcorn king.

Supporters

of this measure.

Testified before the Assembly Elections Commission yesterday, one of the co-authors of the plan said a lot of people involved in the recall efforts against Robin Voss were from out-of-state, quote, these petitioners were not invested members of our communities.

It was an orchestrated effort by outside activists to influence our state's electoral outcomes, unquote.

I always love to use it with dramatic flowerly length, flowery.

language.

They love to beat me.

They're not invested members of the community.

Well, they're getting paid.

Well, or they're volunteers than anyone who wants to do this has to live in the same district or the county or the city or the block.

What is it going to be?

If someone is traveling usually on their own dime to come volunteer something like this, they're pretty invested in the process.

And this is once again, Robin Voss trying to end the, well, he didn't, he did not.

latch on to this one, correct?

If I'm not mistaken.

No,

Robin is inside

on it.

He is

not among

the bill's co-sponsors.

He is the eye of the storm for this whole thing.

And anytime they feel threatened, they want to change the rules because they don't like it.

So now they're going to make it that only Wisconsinites can do.

This is so dumb.

This is such a waste of time.

The supporters of this measure say the residency requirements amounts to closing a loophole, noting that non-residents

can still nominate candidates for president and vice president.

Quote, this legislation is not about making it harder to participate in democracy.

Yes, it is.

It's about ensuring that the voices that shape Wisconsin elections are those who live, work, and vote here, unquote.

If they're so, so, so concerned about loopholes,

Let's close some tax loopholes on the rich.

Let's close some tax loopholes on businesses who don't pay their fair share.

There's a bunch of, there's a lot of loopholes they could concern and close up that would help Wisconsin really instead of this absolute

bunk.

Well, and I think it's important that we keep an eye on what

their priorities are.

Because again,

we

had four meetings across the state from the Joint Finance Committee where they were listening to constituents and what were the top three things that people that the Joint Finance Committee heard from after waiting for hours to address them?

It was about healthcare, it was about schools, and it was about childcare.

And what are they doing?

Are they addressing

Any of those things?

No, they're doing stuff like this because Robin Voss's feelings were hurt.

And let's also not forget what the first major motion out of the state house was when 2025 came around and they all came back to work after a 10 month vacation.

Putting a an amendment or putting a ballot measure on the on the spring election that would in.

enshrine voter ID into our constitution.

That was the, that was, that was the pressing thing of the moment.

Oh my God, Jane, we, we are, we are.

Election integrity, Greg.

Wisconsin's in trouble unless we get this thing done.

These are the important things to them.

And it's, it's about, it's about distraction.

It's about making your power.

I mean, this, this isn't even.

This doesn't even like, this is so

dumb.

This is so dumb.

It sounds like a big waste of energy and really does and money and time.

Yes.

And again, we're not talking about people who are knocking on doors.

Yes.

Okay.

So people come from out of state to circulate petitions.

Yeah, they come up, they, they come and they volunteer to help with campaign initiatives, whether it's a recall, whether it's getting nomination papers, like.

This is the process.

This is the part of the American process of voting.

And they're like, well, if you don't live here, you can't do it.

Why?

Because it's a protective measure.

It's to protect them.

Right?

Yeah, it's to protect them and at the same time then affect the other side as well if they would do something like this That's also going to affect people who want to volunteer for the Democratic Party.

Yeah, they're they're

pushing it

Yeah, and that's that's the other thing too Jane is that this whole thing is like GOP centric because the Democrats were on the side going How about we just vote them out at the election time not two and a half months before right?

This is it's just such a like yeah, it goes back to the idea of like

Any threat to their power they've seen, any way, shape, or form.

Period.

They have to nip it in the butt, and that comes in the way of not nullifying the new fair maps, but making them so that even though you won, you don't get a voice.

Well, it's kind of rewriting rules.

Yeah, it's real petty.

It's real childlike.

But that's what we've come to know and love about this.

GOP, the Wisconsin GOP, which is, you know, I won't play with you.

I'm going to take my ball and go home.

Well, if there's anything that they're really good at, it's protecting their own.

Yeah, absolutely.

If anyone who is listening was at the joint finance committee meetings, the four that they held around Wisconsin last month where residents could voice their concerns and

Tell lawmakers what it is they wanted to see addressed in Wisconsin.

Did anybody at these nine hour joint finance committee meetings bring up the fact that we need to protect petition circulators?

We don't have to protect.

This is not about protecting elections.

This is about protecting the pre show.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, exactly.

This has nothing to do with voter integrity.

This has nothing to do.

It's just like you said, it's a

It's another squirrel.

It's another squirrel.

But in the face of true concern, they said, you know, health care, childcare, education, and they're like, hey, you know what we need to do?

We need to make sure that if nomination papers or recall papers are gone, they got to be laid out a little bit.

That's important.

Jane, the thieves everywhere trying to recall people.

They're

everywhere.

Everybody's

out to get me.

Yeah.

When we return...

There's a rip in the fabric of the universe because I agree with Marjorie Taylor Green.

Oi.

Well, I

gotta go.

We

got

all the details on the other side.

Stay close.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

We'll be right back.

Good morning.

Welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, our resident young person, Calvin on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine.

You can join us, call or text.

The number is the same, 855-752-4842.

Leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream, on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter.

Our Scotty Summers statewide text to win contest is underway

through next Friday.

So you want to be listening in the 7, 11, 2, and 4 o'clock hours for the keyword that you want to text in via the Civic Media app.

It's your chance to pick up either $100 in cash.

Everybody could use that.

Or a pair of Milwaukee Brewers club level tickets.

And then you are in the drawing for the grand prize summer vacations in either Dore County or in Baraboo.

And we've got your guest money too to get you there.

And at 11 o'clock, just listen for me or Jane to give you that keyword during the Tom Hartman show.

Exactly.

Our wonderful velvety voices.

Delsit.

Julie and Aliva.

Julia Naliva won, listening on WCFW.

Oh, nice.

And Ashley, listening on WIRI in Wisconsin Rapids.

Also, one of our winners in our Scotty Summer statewide text-to-win contest.

So make sure you're ready, make sure you have the Civic Media app.

That is the only way to play.

Correct.

And again, after 11 o'clock with Tom Hartman, we will have that next keyword for you.

So good luck with that.

Right now, though, we're gonna spend a little time about something that we have been meaning to talk about.

and just kind of gets shoved off the page when we get up in the morning because there's lots of things.

Lots of things breaking all the

time.

But in this budget bill, there's lots and lots of things they jammed in here.

And as we have found out, many of our lawmakers don't really bother to read the whole thing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's something we see.

I feel like every time there's a massive piece of legislation or a controversial piece of legislation, there's always going to be one to, I don't know, five people who admit on camera.

I didn't actually read

that.

I didn't know that was in there.

Whoops.

But, and I can, I guess I can understand that the lawmaker isn't necessarily going to read all 1000 pages themselves, but isn't that what they have people for?

You have.

three staffers in your office, and it's like, you read the first third, you read the second third, you read the last part, and then give me a synopsis.

Yeah.

I always like to say this though, if you ever looked at it, if you were held a bill in your hand from state government, it is- It's pretty weighty.

Well, it's weighty, but it's also tighter margins, a third of the page is empty for notes, and it's triple spaced.

So if you took all the-

A thousand pages in your hand is a lot, but it's not as long as we always like to think it is, but yeah, that's something you farm out to aids, to interns, to legislative affair and say, provide me a briefing of the things you think I should know about.

Well, so I know what's in this measure before I vote for it.

That sounds like a good plan.

Well, Marjorie Taylor Greene from Georgia.

Essentially admitted yesterday, she is completely unaware that inside of this budget bill, there is a 10-year ban preventing states from regulating artificial intelligence.

Say that again.

There is a 10-year ban that will prevent states from regulating artificial intelligence for a decade.

Yeah.

Yeah.

She's against this, which I...

I am also against this.

That seems like a really bad idea.

Correct.

When

we look at the way that AI is being used now and the amount of deep fakes that are coming out, and some of them are really good as far as looking legitimate, looking real, I absolutely think we need to have some regulation on AI as this is a

as a net, this is an evolving technology.

I absolutely agree.

And I think one of the problems we've faced too is that you have a few companies who are a few years into it.

So they're a little more advanced in their technology.

And with an additional decade of unregulated existence, they are going to make it.

And I'm sorry if this sounds very tin foil hat type of thing, but they are going to ensconce themselves into our

culture so deeply that when that 10 years is finally up, it's gonna be so difficult to regulate them.

And to get rid of it.

Well, I'm not even saying get rid of it, but I'm saying just to even regulate it at all because not only that, but over the next decade, they're gonna build up

a lobbying army that's going to rival the pharmacology industry as well as the gun industry.

And it's going to be like, how are you going to regulate us?

We are part of your lives.

We write your reports.

We do this.

We blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And then it's going to be some states will just say, forget it.

I won't do it at all.

And we'll be in trouble.

Very deep trouble.

There is another Republican lawmaker.

I believe it's a flood who came out and addressed this as well.

But

It's just interesting.

Once you read the whole thing, you know, some things pop out at you a little bit.

You kind of want to know those things before you vote in favor of said things.

Yeah.

But it's too, too late, Marjorie.

You already voted for it.

It's, it's, it's at the Senate now.

So hopefully maybe you can talk to your Senate friends if you have any over there and say, Hey, can you take this provision out?

Or I mean,

The bus left the station a while ago.

We have no idea what AI will be capable of in the next 10 years and giving it free reign and tying states hands is potentially dangerous.

This needs to be stripped out in the Senate.

I agree, MTG.

I agree with you.

And that

is where we put it on.

Well, one, if there's anyone listening in Georgia.

Never know

find a way to get a hold get a hold of Marjorie Taylor Greene's office and press her to press the Senate folks in Wisconsin Go to my vote dot wi.gov.

Yes, call your congressman call your senators and tell them that we want the Senate to pull I mean, there's a whole bunch of things in this in this bill But this one specifically if this one bothers you call them make your voices heard and tell them you want this aspect stripped out of the budget because it is gonna be

hard to regulate them in 10 years if they can at all.

And with all of the things that AI can do, which I think there are some great things, on the other hand, I also think that AI is going to do nothing but make us really stupid.

We have news coming up next.

Stay close.

You're listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

News is next.

Good morning!

Welcome to Matt and Air on Air.

Jane Matt and Air, Greg Bott, Calvinator on the board, coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine, where you can always join us.

Call or text the number is the same 855-752-4842.

You can leave a comment on the live stream if you're watching on Facebook, YouTube, and what used to be Twitter.

He joins us on the first Wednesday of the month.

The president of the Wisconsin Farmers Union, Darren Von Ruden, is here.

Good morning, Darren.

Thanks for joining us.

How are you?

Good

morning, Jane and Matt or Greg.

Thank you for having

me.

Absolutely.

It's always a pleasure to talk to you.

We did want to start off with this and this is from Lucas Hunt, a civic media news reporter nice on our civic media website.

US Representative Derek Van Orden made an appearance at a cheese plant last Thursday where he voiced support for the Trump administration tariffs.

I'm just wondering if you happen to be in that audience, Darren, or did folks do you know talk about this?

No, I was not present for that event, but they have heard a few different comments from some of the individuals that were either there or seen press releases of it.

And what have you heard from folks?

Well, you know, not necessarily happy.

You know, the terrorists are something that's really...

turn this country around and not necessarily in a good way.

You know, it's a short-term gain, but I think there's going to be a lot of long-term effects from it that are not going to be on the positive side.

So how do we, you know, go about doing our business when we're not sure if we're going to have a market six weeks or two years from now?

And I'm sure that

Derek Van Orden had all kinds of specifics about what he's going to do.

Oh wait, no, that's probably not what happened.

Yeah, you know, it seems pretty vague and certainly looking at this big beautiful bill that's being talked about in DC right now.

He said that he's going to protect the nutrition title of the farm bill to the last extent, which means that he should be voting no on that bill.

He voted yes on it because there's

$230 billion that's going to be cut from it over the next 10 years.

So how is that helping the people that are in most need, which at one point in time in his life, he was one of those people.

That's something he was, you know, we have on video and we played it on various shows and he made a, he not only made a very, very impassioned argument for protecting specifically snap.

He, this was, he was, he was talking about snap benefits, but he also, I mean,

accused the Democrats of lying and to me this is a not Democrat or Republican issue this is a helping people issue and that snap benefit issue is within the Farm Bill if I'm not mistaken correct Aaron?

That is correct that's where it's at and you know currently there's 160 plus Republicans that are trying to separate the snap.

title or the nutrition title from the farm bill and trying to make it a farm specific and a nutrition specific bills, which is not good because food and agriculture are all in one.

And so let's keep them together.

Well, and I guess Darren, it's almost like.

They want farmers to come out and say you're against SNAP and you're not.

It's not like this is something that farmers have been calling for, that we need to get rid of SNAP because it's overextending us.

That's not accurate.

Yeah, it's more or less coming from the right wing of the Republican Party and trying to save some tax dollars.

In reality, the folks that are benefiting from that program,

are a lot of those same folks that are voting for those right wing candidates.

And you look at where most of those dollars go, it's to more of the red states than the blue states.

And how do we make sure that we're keeping those programs going in order to help the most needy?

And one of those programs I want to highlight really quick that was, I believed, got

forgive the term doged but it was part of the big you know it happened this first quarter of the of the year was the program which gave farmers money to grow food to get to pantries to give to people so they cut a program that would allow farmers to make money to grow their food to feed those who are hungry I mean

I don't know if there is another thing out there that you could cut that shows that they do not, they don't care about farmers and they do not care about the poor or the hungry.

They're not mutually exclusive.

I, when I saw that, and I think we spoke to you, I know, I know that Pat spoke to Hans Brighton Moser about it, but it's just such a blaring example of how little they care about the actual people of this country.

yeah that's the LFPA program local food purchasing assistance program and you know here in the state it's been 189 farmers have benefited directly from that because those payments come to the farmers in the beginning of the year and make sure that they have the cash on hand to put the seeds in the ground to grow the crops that then ultimately end up in the

food pantries, the tribal elders box, you know, it's all going to help the people that are in most need of a daily new nutritious meal.

And so getting rid of a program that's benefiting farmers directly, but also making sure that there's a system in place to

help that food go 10 miles or 20 miles instead of having to travel 1,000 miles or 1,500 miles, which that takes a lot of those dollars directly away from the farmers because you have all those middleman dollars that are being dispersed and a program like the LFPA program has certainly connected the farmer more directly with the consumer.

Yeah, this, again, this program seems like a win-win to me.

It's good for the farmers who are incentivized to produce this food.

It's good for the food pantries.

It's not like the government is coming to Wisconsin farmers and saying, you have to grow X acres of food, and then I want you to give it away to hungry people.

That's not what we're talking about.

There's a payment based system there on what the farmer is going to produce for this market that's been established.

It's there.

It's also something that's getting those fresh fruits and vegetables more directly into the consumer hand and making it more available for more people.

When we look at what's going on in the general grocery store aisles, most of those products are not fresh anymore.

They're getting to be a week or two weeks old because of the distribution network.

They go from the farm to a processor.

to a distribution center and you got a whole week that's passed already before it ever gets that local grocery store shelf.

So, you know, this is getting something in people's mouths within 72 to 96 hours from when it was picked off the land.

And, you know, why aren't we doing more of this across the whole country?

You know, versus depending on.

food system that's really broken at this point.

Well, and again, now we're talking about making more restrictions for people who do receive food stamps and those kinds of benefits.

We want to restrict what they can buy in the stores because we want them to buy healthier things.

And then yet at the same time, we're going to take away these healthier options and hurt our farmers at the same time.

There's so much stuff working at cross purposes in this bill.

Yeah, it is.

And certainly,

We would like to see the farm bill pass as it is.

There's a ton of improvements that can be made, but in this current political situation, that simply isn't going to happen.

But let's pass the farm bill as the farm bill and not have it in this big, beautiful bill that's going to be a detriment to the whole country, not only on the.

budget deficit that we're going to see, but also, you know, the programs that are being cut and not being helpful to number one, the American farmers, but number two, the consuming public.

If you're just joining us, we're speaking with the president of the Wisconsin Farmers Union, Darren Von Ruden.

He joins us every, joins us the first Wednesday of the month to talk about all the things that are going on in the farming community here in Wisconsin and abroad.

And the

One of the things you, we're talking about here now is like the cutting of this is the LFPA program.

To me, like all I'm hearing right now is investments being canceled because you invest in farmers, they make the food, they take the pantries, those food pantries are giving it away and it is proven that when people aren't hungry,

morale improves, productivity improves, just general

lifestyle learning

improves.

So I just, to me, like everything about this seems so easy, as you said, Jane, not to mention, and we.

brought this up before.

If I'm a politician, Darren, I want to knock on your door and say, guess what I just did?

I protected the LFPA program because it's important for you.

It's important for our neighbors.

It's important for everybody.

And yet they're taking these programs and they're cutting them.

And I don't know what they're going to go home to knock on doors and talk to them.

Well, they're not showing up to town halls anyway.

So it doesn't really

matter.

But

what I wanted to bring up really quick is one of the things you brought up as a discussion point was cuts to public radio.

NPR Darren, do you want to speak on that?

Yeah, you know, it's something that I think affects not only farmers, but rural citizens across the country.

You know, I hear more and more people that are listening to the programs that public radio offers and that national public radio or TV.

You know, how do we keep those programs alive?

And a lot of that is through public funding about half of the funding or a quarter of the funding story.

to NPR and public radio comes from private donations so you know it's one of those programs that I truly I listen to a lot when

I'm

driving down the road with all the windshield time that I have and it has a lot to do with the news source that you're that's there too it's an independent news source it's not a viable to one particular promoter you know at the end of

different newscasts, they'll say that one of their sponsors was actually somebody that they were talking

about.

What radio stations do you hear that on?

You just don't.

And so how do you know who's pushing what button that they can report on and what they can't report on where public radio and public TV really gets to the source.

And most times if

opposite sides want to be on the stage at the same time.

That's what they would much rather do, but we're seeing a lot of pushback from the far right saying that it's not a good news source.

Well, if you don't show up and

talk about your point, you really can't say that.

It's like the local tabern affiliates or customer that complains about politics all the time but never goes and votes.

You

really don't have the right to complain about it if you're not willing to be on the program.

I'm very, very surprised that you and other agriculture producers in Wisconsin are NPR fans and I think

That helps explain a little bit to me at least why they would like to cut funding because I think they would much prefer that Wisconsin farmers were listening to different kinds of media outlets.

Yeah, and you know and certainly nowadays with modern technology and if you are lucky enough to own some of the modern equipment You can get serious radio and listen to whatever you want But there's a whole lot of us that are still farming with tractors from the 80s and 90s and still have AM radios on our dials too yet So having as many new sources as we can is what we prefer versus getting to a point where we're half

fewer and fewer

or or a God forbid a government controlled media outlet.

Yeah.

I want to make one thing clear too.

And people because this is the NPR it can get NPR public radio.

They lost in a lot of minutiae and this NPR receives one 1% of their fine other other budgeting comes from the US government.

It's about five hundred and thirty five million dollars.

And some people will say and it's a lot of money.

I take it.

But that is point zero one two eight percent of the federal budget.

That is how much.

Funds public radio 0.028.

It's minuscule.

It's minuscule.

So let's not make the like, oh my gosh, NPR is such it's it's important.

It's necessary.

And as you just said, Darren, it's very vital for those out there on the farmlands.

We're going to continue our conversation with Darren Von Ruden, the president of the Wisconsin Farmers Union.

Stay with us.

You were listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

We'll be right back.

Good morning and welcome back to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Box, Sweet Calvary on the board coming to you from our studio at Radio Park in Racine where you can join us.

Call or text at 855-752-4842.

Leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube and what used to be Twitter coming up a little bit later on today from 2 to 4 p.m.

Todd Alba our friend and colleague.

He's going to have pat quite low and senior advisor of the Lincoln project.

Trig V. Olsen will be recapping all the headlines of the week.

And then of course, Todd always does what's worse.

which is kind of like our audio sorbet when they just kind of lighten things up a little bit.

Join Todd today, it's a great show.

Two to four PM across the Civic Media radio network.

It is the first Wednesday of the month, so we are joined by the president of the Wisconsin Farmers Union, Darren Von Ruden is here.

Darren, we had a couple comments coming in on the text line and also on the live stream.

Tom from West Alice asks,

Does anyone think that the government is trying to bankrupt family farmers so that corporate farms can take over?

Well, that is a very good question.

According to a lot of farmers, the answer might be yes.

And certainly looking at how the structure of the farm bill has changed from its original intent of protecting farmers of all sizes back in the early days of the farm bill.

to what it is today when there's a lot more corporate dollars that go to corporate farms or the very largest farms in this country.

I think one of the stats I've seen from USD in the last seven to 10 years here is that 80% of all dollars that go directly to farmers are to the 20% of the largest farms.

So, you know, farms of my size of Hifty Cow Organic Dairy Farm really get that

the 10th of 1% or even less of the dollars and you know looking at the original intent to there there was payment limits at one time so you could only get as a farmer you could only get so much you know today that's up in the $750,000 range I think is what the maximum payment that

you can receive.

So what the largest farms are doing is making multiple entities so that they can get millions of dollars and that's something that there's actually an attorney that I think located down in Arkansas that that's all that he does for a living is trying to help farmers navigate through those systems in order to get maximum benefits.

In the in the previous part of the first part of this discussion, we were talking about the cuts to the LA the cut of

the LFPA program, which is a program that allows farmers to be paid to grow food and then give that food to pantries in their community, which has been cut under the Doge and Trump programs.

Cassandra in the live stream commented on that saying, we are actually currently seeing the effects of first, we affects firsthand in New London with the LFPA program being canceled.

We will have significantly less food here in our pantries and going on to say,

There was a woman that would donate a whole cow.

She can't afford to do that without the tax credit.

So those not only are the effects, but they're happening immediately.

Yes, they're there and

they're happening it immediately and locally.

Yeah,

so.

Yeah, yeah.

We had back in May during the last program, which the connection was not the best, which is hard to understand coming from our nation's capital.

You think you would have connection all the time.

But we had a one producer out there that has just about $25,000 worth of fish that were raised to

the point of thinking that they were going to have a market for them this year.

So now they have to try to find a market for that $25,000 worth of fish.

I'm probably going to be looking at taking a lot less than that because the markets are, you know, controlled in that sector by certain things, certain entities.

And so how do you just take a, you know, probably a $10,000 loss on a market that you'd established that had been very viable for two years.

And then Uncle Sam says, bye, see you later.

It's too bad.

Now it's gone.

Yeah.

Again, we I go back to the original point is that you know individual and and and we have said this before and Darren I'm sure you can attest to this that politicians on both sides of the aisle have used the American farmer as a Great place to hold an event get that podium there standing in front of a field full of breakfast or soybeans and say I love the Farmers and then they go back to Washington and they do things like this and a lot of it comes under the radar because it's there's so much happening in the world but

Just to be aware of everyone who's listening to be aware of these small these these cuts I'm not gonna call them small cuts these cuts to programs that directly affect people like Darren and his friends and colleagues and The politicians there's no one holding them accountable to that they just happen and we have one right here in the state Snap benefits are important.

They're not gonna go down a nickel That's a quote and he votes for this bill which cuts snap benefits along with other

entitlements.

In fact, the CBO just came out with their latest estimates on this budget bill, and the CBO estimates it will add $2.4 trillion to the national debt over the next decade.

So again, when we talk about cutting some of those programs, which is an incy-beancy teeny tiny part of what we spend on an annual basis in this country, cutting those things does not seem like the right way to go about it, just doesn't.

Yeah, you know, and looking at the charitable side of most Americans, it seems to be disappearing because this is one of those things that it's helping those that are in most need.

And how can we, as true Americans say that we should get rid of a program that's being beneficial to those people that are most in need, but also helping out multiple facets between the farmer and the consumer too, because it isn't just the farmer and the consumer.

It's all above.

So

all of us.

It's about all of us.

Darren Von Ruden is the president of the Wisconsin Farmers Union.

He joins us at the first Wednesday of every month.

Thank you so very much, Darren.

We will see you in July.

Thank you much, Jane and Greg, and happy June, very days.

Make sure you eat lots of cheese and drink lots of milk.

We

are on

it.

We are on it.

Absolutely.

We have news coming up next.

Stay with us.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air on the Civic Media Radio Network.

Yeah.

Good morning and welcome.

Welcome to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Bach, Calvin Butenoff, coming to you live from our studio here at Radio Park in Racine, where you can always join us.

Call or text the number is the same 855-752.

4842.

We'll leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook, YouTube and what used to be Twitter talking about making movies in Wisconsin and joining us right now.

A native of Fair Tomah, Wisconsin here in the state.

Nathan Deving is joining us.

Good morning, Nathan.

How are you doing?

Good morning.

I'm good.

Nice to meet

you.

Nice to meet you as well.

So we hooked up because you know, Pete Schwabba,

who is the host of Nightlight with Pete Schwabba from 6 to 8 p.m.

across the network.

And you guys made a movie together.

Yeah, Pete was nice enough to be in my first feature called Speaking in Tongues.

He plays this kind of crazy mega church pastor that shows up for about 10 minutes of the film and takes over.

I can see him as a mega church pastor.

I bet that was, I bet he was great.

He could lead a cult if he wanted to,

you know what I mean?

We're lucky.

We're lucky.

He just wants to make movies and do stand up and radio.

Seriously, how did you get into moviemaking considering that you grew up in Tomah?

Yeah, no, I just love movies growing up.

Kind of made them all the time in the backyard.

I told this story a couple times recently in high school, we got

I think I was the right age where they were starting to assign like they would say oh you can write an essay for this project or you can make a video and I was always like I'll make a video and my big masterpiece was this Julius Caesar adaptation where as like a 14 year old I wrote the capital and asked if we could come and film the stabbing scene of Caesar in the capital.

And they said yes.

And this is like at the height of the like the terror watch list years.

Wow.

In 2004, 2005, like 12 really gangly teenagers from Tomah came into the capital and then all steps cease her in bedsheets.

Who are those young kids in bedsheets on the stairs right now?

This is.

I want to know what grade you got on

that.

Yeah, they were like, okay, whatever, I guess we'll maybe do a paper next time.

So did you move right out to California?

Where did you go to school?

No, I actually, I guess as far as the industry goes, I really got my start because I went to film school in London.

I'm wearing my shirt today to represent London Film School.

This is British filmmaker I really love named Mike Lee, who is the head of the school at the time.

I just love British cinema.

I love European movies.

And that was kind of my entrance into the industry and really learning a lot.

And then afterwards, because of the difficulty of staying in the UK on a work visa, I came back and actually wanted to stay in Wisconsin at the time, which is the one reason we're going to talk today is because I came back here and Wisconsin did not have

the infrastructure in place for filmmakers.

And so, I mean, it makes it sound like a bad thing that I had to move to California.

Part of me wanted to, but also part of me did want to stay here.

And a lot of my films have been set here and I'm making a lot more films over the next 10 years here.

So like, I love Wisconsin.

I would like to be here.

And yeah, so it's really bummed that.

Well, and I would think, I would think for filmmakers because we have such a

diversity of nature, that this would be, Wisconsin would be a great place to shoot for all kinds of different movie projects.

Yeah, no, we have a lot of different kinds of locations.

I mean, so the trend the past 10, 15 years in Hollywood has been that nothing's shooting in Hollywood anymore.

And if you go on and look at the trades, like all the headlines are like,

Hollywood's leaving Hollywood.

I always felt like when I'm at parties, the room I goes into floods out.

I'm like, oh, I'm always late to the room.

And now I'm like, I moved to Los Angeles.

Everybody

leaves.

It's you.

It's you,

Nathan.

It's you.

Oh, go on.

Go on, Nathan.

Go on.

Well, I was gonna say, but it's because of this really boring policy just called tax incentives, which is that different areas are incentivizing productions to come film there.

It's becoming kind of a battle between them now.

And people, I think, don't realize how versatile filmmaking can be.

Like, there was a movie, a big movie that came out last week called Substance that's set in

LA,

but shot in France.

It's actually not that hard to do that.

And I'm just saying this because you said Wisconsin has a lot of locations and we do, like way more than you think.

You can film anywhere in Milwaukee and make it look like most cities in the world.

You can come to Eclare and actually, uh, make it look like a lot of different cities in the world.

And then all you have to do is drive 15 minutes out of town and suddenly you got rural farmland cows and all the classic kind of heartland scenery.

And yeah,

I mean, there, there was a movie that came out earlier this year called love hurts with key, uh, key wing hot, I think it was the last name.

He won an Oscar for.

everything everywhere all at once.

And the

movie

takes place in Milwaukee, but looks nothing like Milwaukee.

And it also, he's dealing with the huge mob of Milwaukee, which I thought was very weird, but that's beside the point.

It was a fun movie.

But

one

of the things, and we're talking about tax incentives, one of the things that blew my mind, Nathan, was when I found out that California doesn't really have tax incentives for filming.

I would think if anyone did in this country, they would as...

that's where Hollywood is.

And that's where like, you know, you also have access to different types of locations and weather and whatnot.

But I mean, they don't.

And that that to me says that's probably one of the reasons why Hollywood's moving out, because it's just getting more and more expensive to make movies.

Yeah.

And just to define it really quick in case anybody doesn't know what they are, basically, these policies are like saying, okay, you want to film your movie or your TV show?

If you come film it in Racine, Wisconsin, you're bringing in $2 million to film here.

We'll give you 20% of that back, 30% of that back, you know, depends on the state.

So that's the draw because communities know that when a film shoots there, there's a lot of benefits, you know, and money.

It's just kind of like free money showing up.

New Mexico is a really good example of a state that has been really successful with this.

I mean they had two huge shows in the 2010s with Breaking Dad and Better Call Saul.

Those weren't written to be set.

Yeah, they weren't written to be set in New Mexico.

New Mexico had good tax incentives so they set Breaking Dad there and suddenly it exploded and then I'm on a road trip and then I got to stop at the car wash to see where...

Walt and Jesse were doing their thing, you know, because there's these long-term benefits too.

You just don't know that, you know, it's like, you don't know what kind of show is going to pop off and then everybody's got to go to Appleton to see the thing that happened in that show that they love, you know.

Well, I mean, I think one of the best examples too is Georgia.

You watch movies and TV shows.

And when you see that Georgia logo with that big peach, that was made

in part probably it was made in part there, if not entirely.

And the biggest example of that is Marvel.

Marvel is like located their studios to that state.

Pinewood Studios, which is a world famous studio overseas in England, has a location there.

And Georgia has, I mean, they've become, in my opinion, the best example of a state saying, let's get in on this.

And to me, it seems like a no brainer.

And to me, it doesn't make make sense why Wisconsin wouldn't do this.

Yeah, the other thing to be clear about is that Wisconsin is one of 13 states that has none currently and there's like a little bit of a history there But I think it's just kind of like wrong thing at the wrong time Meanwhile, all these other states clearly the majority of them Are killing and then it's and now we're just hitting this confluence where technology is changing Hollywood's changing and like I said Hollywood's like leaving Hollywood

So it's going everywhere these tax incentives are and right now our neighbors are picking up a lot of work Illinois is getting a lot of work Minnesota is getting a lot of work because they have tax

incentives.

We can't have anything nice here.

Minnesota always takes our lunch money

steals our girl smokes our weed Shouldn't you be

more mad at Illinois?

No

Close to the border.

No, no, because I'm not Maddie Illinois.

I'm always mad at Chicago.

It's a different thing.

But Minnesota is always like, oh, we made you a casserole with all the best and greens.

We're like, ah, man, Minnesota.

The Wisconsin Department of Tourism is pushing film tax credits as a top priority.

Increasing group travel to the state, outdoor recreation.

They're hoping for $35 million in funding proposed by Governor Evers.

Of course, I'm sure the Republicans stripped everything out of that.

As you as you mentioned, Nathan, the 30% tax credit would apply to income paid to state residents up to $250,000 a piece, transferable credits for film related expenses to the state, and credits for acquiring or improving property that wasn't owned before December 31st of 2025.

Yeah, there's

this group called Action Wisconsin, which is like a network of filmmakers like me and then even city governments like

the city I'm in Eau Claire just recently endorsed the film incentives and it's just a network of people and also hotel owners restaurant owners because a lot of people benefit from this.

We're pushing for this legislation and yeah right now it's living in two forms.

Governor Evers added it to his budget which is really cool and then also Republican Senator Julian Bradley wrote a bill that is now circulating.

in the legislature.

So it's batch partisan, which is pretty cool.

And it's something that I think we need to act on pretty quick if we want to get in the game, because we're basically just leaving money on the table.

I mean, even there's there's you talk to producers in Chicago, they have too much work, you know, they would like to share some of it over the border, they need to sometimes.

And,

you know,

it's just like, but

if you don't have these incentives in place, also we're one of three without a film office, which is the second thing that is a part of this whole legislative package, which the film office is just a touch point.

Like right now we're basically like a store without a phone.

You know, if anybody wants to film in Wisconsin, which we have great locations, we have great crew, we have a lot of acting talent, but there's nobody at the phone.

No one's there to pick up the call.

Yeah.

Yeah.

If Hollywood wants to call, they have to just look up and maybe see my name or see somebody else's name and go,

I guess I'll ask them, can I film in Racine?

And then you go, yeah, okay, I'll connect you with this person and this person.

But that's what a film office does.

That

is a

coordinator.

Yeah, Nathan Deming.

The city of Chicago has one, you know, and we don't.

Nathan Deming is our guest.

He is a filmmaker that's from Wisconsin.

He's from Tomah, but kind of spends his time going back and forth between California here and Wisconsin.

We're going to continue our conversation about this.

I'm just thinking, Nathan, when you talk about

what movies bring.

Think about people who make clothing.

Think about costumers.

Think about all the community and professional theater troops that we have in Wisconsin who would be wonderful to get into the movie making industry.

We've got actors here.

We've got makeup people here because it's not like when crews come from California, they bring all those folks with them.

No, yeah, that's the thing and I think that's what's been really smart about the message that Action Wisconsin is kind of focused on because I really care about the cultural benefit I'm a filmmaker.

I'm an artist.

I think I think it would do wonders for Wisconsin just on that level But the truth of it is it's also just an economic driver It's kind of like the circus a hundred years ago when the circus came to town Which is kind of what happens when a film comes to town right a lot of Influx of people they hired local people most of the time for jobs like carpentry, you know if if you have

flowers in your movie.

You're not going to fly out of florist from Los Angeles.

You're going to hire the local people, not to mention hotels, restaurants, all that stuff.

All that stuff.

We're going to continue our conversation with Nathan Delming, a film maker from Tomah.

All about movies in Wisconsin.

Stay with us.

You're listening to Matt Nair on air.

This is the Civic Media Radio Network.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back.

Happy birthday

to you.

Happy birthday to you.

Happy birthday to

Nathan.

Welcome back to Matt and air on air Jane Matt and air Greg box sweet Calby on the board coming to you live from our studio here at radio park in Racine You can join us call or text the number is the same eight five five seven five two four eight four two leave a comment on the live stream on Facebook YouTube and What used to be Twitter our guest is Wisconsin native and filmmaker and birthday boy Nathan Deming is here and we're talking about

about trying to get some credits for movie makers to make movies in Wisconsin.

We were talking about that, Nathan, right before the break.

And you had mentioned this group that is kind of trying to help facilitate this, and they have a website.

Yeah, so the group is called Action Wisconsin, and also thank you.

I've never been wished happy birthday on the radio, so that's fun.

Yeah, actually Scott's and they have a website action wi.org you can read more about like who benefits from this I think it's a lot of local people You know more than you think more than just actors writers things like that And there's also a really important button We're trying to get people to check out would just take action because the really simple thing people could do to help out is just There's like a pre-filled out letter you can send to your legislator and super and Get in touch.

Yeah, and I was gonna mention earlier.

You also mentioned the like

the $30 million pot it's called.

So it's just one point of confusion I think a lot of people have over it, right if we so because it's a little confusing, is that it's actually not like $30 million it's like just being set like set aside and given to filmmakers.

It's like a pot that can be accessed per year.

And I believe it's actually $10 million starting.

It's going to go up to 30 if the program's successful,

which a lot

of states do.

And again, it's a tax credit that's given back of the money that's spent.

So I'm only saying that because I think sometimes people have this impression that we're just giving a handout to filmmakers.

And it's not that at all.

I wouldn't honestly, I wouldn't really be fighting for it if I thought it was.

But you're right, that's a very important clarification.

It's not like we're saying, here's $300,000 to come to Wisconsin and make a movie.

It's essentially, if you spend $300,000 in Wisconsin making a movie, we will give you a...

A percentage break on that.

And in the current bill, it only applies to Wisconsin vendors, Wisconsin crew.

So the production is totally incentivized to not just fly in everybody from California, because they won't get the credit on anything they got suspended on.

Interesting.

Okay.

Well, the website will be in the show notes, along with everything else we've been talking about today.

And I just have a really quick question.

This is my moment to be Hollywood.

So, Nathan, what you working on right now?

What you

working on?

Great question, Greg.

Well, I just had a lot of fun touring the last film I made called February around the state.

And I'm doing this kind of crazy passion project on the side of my normal work.

I have this

passion project for Wisconsin I'm doing um we're basically over the next 10 or 15 years I'm going to make a film for every month of the year uh all set in Wisconsin all about different characters so they're not documentaries they're fictional stories but uh kind of like that filmmaker I mentioned Mike Lee um the British filmmaker who I love I mean he's very good at kind of documenting realistic life in England and I guess that's my dream is to do the same for Wisconsin so

I want to capture Wisconsin stories, Wisconsin people.

I'm going in order, so I'm only two in.

You can guess what's coming after February.

But I

had so much fun, like we hit up over 30 cities in the month of February a couple months ago and after like a whole premiere last year at the Wisconsin Film Festival.

And it was just so cool to feel people connecting with it and saying, oh, that's a...

That's a side of Wisconsin I haven't seen before on screen because that's I guess another thing I'm really passionate about is you know I've been in California and London and you know people say Wisconsin where's that uh is that bike in is that bike Kentucky is that by Florida like they do it's like

do they have cars there do they ride cows

yeah

Or they'll say something about cheese in the packers, which fair enough, you know, but but I think in general we have this kind of like in the media, or at least in cinema, we often have like Fargo image or something like our lives are silly.

Yes.

And I don't like that.

We have exactly the same kind of lives as everybody else on this planet.

And I'm really excited about telling stories that I think

capture Wisconsin culture accurately.

And the last film was about ice fishing.

It's about this Mexican immigrant who struggles to fit into a small town until he finds ice fishing.

And then this kind of crazy local ice fisherman takes him out.

And one of my favorite things about touring the film was that across the whole state from Chano to Milwaukee to Madison to Ashland, everybody was like, Oh, I know that guy, the ice fisherman guy, he lives here.

His name is crazy Carl.

Crazy Carl.

Crazy Carl is his name, and he is a Wisconsin guy, which I love so much.

Yeah.

That's fantastic.

I'm just putting it out here, Nathan.

If you need a six-foot-two, face-for-radio guy, long hair,

bearded,

I'm available.

I'm

a

chubby middle-aged lady, you know.

Quite,

quite, quite producer.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I haven't, I haven't revealed the marches yet, but maybe.

Oh, keep us in mind for March and April.

Yeah.

Keep us in mind for March and April.

That would be great.

Well, continued success.

Uh, we will include a link also to, uh, is there anywhere people can see February right now?

Yeah.

Well February, so January is online.

Uh, that's already like been out there on YouTube and Vimeo, but February is going to premiere on September 5th.

And we have like some social handles.

So if people want to follow me on Instagram, I'm just Nathan.deming or the film.

That film's Instagram is February that year project.

We also have a slightly popular Facebook page.

So you can check that out too for updates about that.

I also put Nathan's website on there too.

So I feel like that's a good hub for everything you

got a lot of links.

Yeah, exactly.

Nathan, Deming, Wisconsin native and a filmmaker talking about film credits.

Hope to have you back, Nathan.

That would be

fantastic.

Happy birthday.

Thank you.

Yes.

Thank you.

Really nice to meet

you.

Nice to meet you as well.

News is coming up next.

When we return, what is your home?

Heck.

Wow.

That you always use.

That's on the way.

You are listening to Matt Nair on air.

Stay close.

You are listening to the Civic Media Radio Network.

Good morning and welcome back to Matt Nair on air.

Jane Matt Nair, Greg Mock.

Calvitini on the board coming to you live from our studio at radio park in Racine You can always join us call or text the number is the same eight five five seven five two four eight four two You can leave a comment if you're watching on the live stream on Facebook YouTube and what used to be Twitter Hey, if you were looking for some new merch Say you're looking for a new t-shirt to wear out for the summer.

Maybe a new hat.

I love

hats.

Maybe what a tote

New tote bag.

A tote?

A tote bag.

It's totally cool.

A

tote

bag.

Go to our store, civicmedia.go to civicmedia.us, click on shop at the very top, and that will take you to our merch store, and there is a rumor, Greg Bach.

There

might be new merch coming.

This is a conspiracy theory I

can get behind.

Right?

Yeah.

Nat and Aaron air merch.

Yeah.

could be close.

I've

heard that the deep state is putting out their march for madness.

They're working on it.

They're working on it.

See how

dumb that sounds when you say it out loud, people?

So

when that happens, we will tell you.

So you can jump on it

while

they're still available.

First edition.

First edition.

First edition of the Matt and Aaron Air Merch Run.

That's what I'm saying right

here.

We're watching for it, so we'll give you a heads up when that comes around.

Also, don't forget that we are well underway with our Scotty Summer Statewide Text to Win contest.

After 11 o'clock, Tom Hartman will have a keyword for you.

to text in via the Civic Media app.

We are playing for either $100 cash or a pair of Milwaukee Brewers club level tickets.

And then everyone who enters is in the running for the grand prize, a nice Wisconsin summer getaway to either Dork County or Baraboo and gas money to get you there, baby.

There you go.

And for the 11 o'clock during Tom Hartman, you're going to listen for me and Jane, because one of us will give you the keyword.

Yes.

So you're like, wait, that sounds like Greg.

And that's me.

So yeah,

11

o'clock, 11 o'clock, four times a day for the next two weeks, the seven, 11, two and four o'clock hours for our Scani summer statewide text to win contest again, your next chance coming up after 11 o'clock.

So right now it's audio Sorbet where we like to take a break and get away from the news and take a little breath from things.

And so.

A lot of this

stems from

discussions that we have that happen off the air

as

we're prepping the show.

And I shared with Greg this morning that I had to go see the dermatologist last week as I had this thing on my head and I didn't know what it was.

And it's never good when you find a thing on your body that you don't know what that is.

And so I went and it was just this little bump on my head.

And so she did, she slight, we froze it and we sliced it off and she biopsied it.

It is not cancerous, which is, I'm thrilled and grateful.

This

is not cancer.

But what I was told when they left the message yesterday was, no, don't worry, it's not cancer.

It's a head wart.

Now it's a what?

So when you said that, so like when you call it, like anytime you call a doctor and you like get testing done, if they find something,

Benign or whatever and we always want to be benign, of course It should have a more technical name like a a cranial sub hematoma I know doctors and nurses that's not the cry that is an actual thing but like there should be syllables fancy your name for it based in Latin in the history and that you had to study to remember But it's like what do I have head warts?

Yeah,

it's a

lot so we started looking up how to get rid of warts and one of the things that came up

was duct tape.

To be fair, Jane was looking

this up

again.

But duct tape

came up and I

said yes.

You vouched for this.

I absolutely vouched for that

duct tape can help you get rid of wards.

You have to be vigilant with this.