Hey, I'm Matt Rothschild and welcome to this episode of the Wisconsin Forward Podcast
on the Civic Media Radio Network and over at civicmedia.us.
Today I'm delighted to have Bianca Shaw as my guest.
She's the new Executive Director of Common Cause of Wisconsin, which makes her a leader
in the Pro Democracy Ecosystem of our state, Bianca Shaw, welcoming the Wisconsin Forward
Podcast.
Thank you so much and thank you for having me today on this very cold day.
Well, when I saw that you got this new job, I said, oh, I got to get Bianca on the
episode on the podcast.
And you're continues so far away.
I remember you back when I was at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign where are many zooms and
I appreciate your input back then and delighted to see your new career opportunity here.
Why don't you give the listener and me some background on, you know, where you grow up,
what your career has been like before you got the Common Cause.
Yeah. Well, I'm a third generation Wisconsin.
I did grow up in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
I spent some time in Memphis, Tennessee, too.
I have about 10 for 15 years.
Spending Memphis, but I've been back in Wisconsin since 2007.
I live there in the primary caregiver of my 14 year old daughter.
She just turned 13 January 13th.
I'm sorry, she's just turned 14 on January 13th.
Well, that can be a handful of congratulations.
Definitely. Thank you so much.
We made it.
So yeah, I live here.
You got some time ahead of you, too.
Oh, lower.
Yeah, that's another podcast.
So yeah, I live there and I'm very active in community.
I consider myself a child of God and advocate and a mom.
And that has led me on this journey to where I am now.
But as far as my career goes, I've spent my career at the intersection of democracy,
equity, and systems change.
And I primarily help communities move from being impacted by policy to helping shape it.
And what were a couple of your prior posts before coming to Common Cause?
Yeah, most recently I was in statewide campaigns.
I helped to build multi-sector coalitions and train advocates and work closely with election
administrators. I've worked with legislators, legal partners, and community organizations.
And that's been in positions.
I've been a political appointee from 2019 to 2022
and Governor Evers first administration.
Where were you there?
I was in the Department of Children and Families
as the director of the Office of Urban Development.
Excellent.
Yep. And from there, I went to all voting as local, worked for a lobbyist
and senior campaign manager for them.
I love that group.
Yeah, I do too. They're amazing.
We are all in the same coalition working, you know, hard at this work.
It's almost like we recycle each other in the movement.
Like we all know each other are all in the same space.
And what attracted you to Common Cause Wisconsin, then?
So Common Cause Wisconsin definitely aligns with my goals.
I apply because I believe deeply in the mission and the legacy of Common Cause
for over 50 years, Common Cause has been one of the nation's most trusted guardians of democracy.
Our four pillars, which are voting in fair representation,
anti-corruption accountability, factual media and technology,
as well as protecting our freedoms.
They align directly with the work I've been doing throughout my career.
And the role allows me to bring together policy expertise, coalition leadership,
and community trust to help strengthen democracy in a very tangible way for all Wisconsinites.
And democracy is so much hanging by a string right now.
It's kind of a little thread.
What can you see Common Cause Wisconsin doing about this current crisis of democracy
that we're facing with Donald Trump?
Yeah, there is so much. I think just, you know, federal, state, and local.
I think I know the first thing that I have to get to is Common Cause
Wisconsin members and everyday Wisconsinites that are ready to help shape what our new government
is going to look like because this isn't about reform, it's about transformation at this point.
And I think that means creating clear pathways for people to take action and win
that means showing up, speaking out and holding power accountable.
And so I see Common Cause Wisconsin being a convener in the space.
I see us being an intervener as well as a place for members and Wisconsinites that are aligned
with us a place to make sure we have that avenue of taking action and winning.
So there are a couple of things there. One is there's a defensive strategy against Trump
and these assaults on democracy that we're facing. And then there's the transformational
visionary concept that you're articulating there. Just on the defensive end, you know,
what can we do as a state? What can we do as citizens of Wisconsin to protect our civil rights
and civil liberties, which is one of your priorities there on your website and that you're
mentioned just now? Yeah. I'll start with Justice Individuals. One thing that's very important
is knowing your neighbors, like we really have to get to a place of where we know one another
on a familial and intimate level of you caring about your neighbor. And that means you may have
to take a meal, you may have to watch a child, you may have to provide transportation.
There is something for everyone to do for those folks that are advocates that want to be in the
state capital, want to be in local buildings, municipal offices, making sure that you're
connecting with their local officials to educate them on the issues you care about.
Legislators don't know everything. They're elected in their area of expertise and is in their lane.
And so it is the responsibility of all citizens, voters, constituents alike to make sure they're
connecting with their policy makers and their division leaders. So we talk a lot about
elected officials and election officials, but there are civil servants that we need to be connecting
with as well. I would say for those activists, I would say making sure that you are standing the
line, it's going to be difficult, making sure that we're coordinating with all coalitions,
not just coalitions on the issues you care about, because democracy is at stake. And so
all issues are on the table at this time. And specifically in terms of legislation,
common cause was constant. We are working in the capital. I'm here when I leave here,
I'm going to be in the state capital building today as well, working on supporting and opposing
a few bills that are in the circulating in the building right now.
What are a couple of those bills?
Sure. Assembly Bill 517, that would oppose a loophole by expressly, expressly prohibiting foreign
nationals from contributing to refer random committees. And we support those guard reels for
transparency and integrity. Assembly Bill 906 is a similar proposal. We're still reviewing
for the details and implications. And as well as Assembly Bill 752, which would add new penalties
tied to drop box mill in ways that risk increasing fear and confusion without evidence of a
real problem. So we definitely oppose that. Another one that I mentioned is Assembly Bill 547,
that deals with voter list maintenance and change of address verification. And we're very cautious
with this one. As any list maintenance must protect eligible voters with strong notice and due
process. And one last thing that I do want to mention that was hot off the press. I started
December 1st and by December 18th, we were in a federal lawsuit. So we're in a federal case right
now with the United States Department of Justice lawsuit against the Wisconsin Election Commission.
The Department of Justice is seeking Wisconsin's full, unredacted statewide voter file. We don't
want that. We have intervened to help protect voter privacy and prevent federal outreach.
And we're working with law forward and ACLU on that case. And the way I understand that case
with the federal government with the Trump administration wants is all the data including people's
social security numbers and other real private information that they're not entitled to. And we
want them to have. Exactly. We don't want them. And we have three voters that have intervened with
us to tell the case of why they do not want their information in the hands of any federal government.
And working with law forward is great. I think you're going to enjoy that. They're a terrific
pillar of our democratic battles here. So it's interesting. You said know your neighbor. I think
that's really good advice. A funny thing. I lived south of Madison. No, I used to live next to
West high school for ten. No, for 25 years as our kids were there. But part of it is knowing how to
be a neighbor. And it's weird because it breaks. It doesn't break on political lines. There's a
guy who voted for Trump who lives two doors down and brings me maple syrup every Christmas from
his farm up north. And then there's some more liberal folks in between us who are new to the
neighborhood and are just getting used to how to be neighborly. It's improving, which is good.
But and then their neighbors a few houses down who I think would turn me in if they got a chance.
So it's always a little delicate, isn't it? It is. As a trained facilitator saw in 2016,
I was trained by the Frank Zyler Center for Public Discussion. And so a difficult conversations
are something that I lean into. And here's the ideal behind neighborly relationships.
We will argue over issues, but we can come together over values. So that neighbor that brings you
to serve you value, good serve, you value, good breakfast. You know what I mean? I'm just speaking
in layman's terms, but there's there's always going to be issues. But your mind can change on
issues very quickly. Whereas your values pretty much remain the same through life sometimes they change.
But I need people to understand that we can disagree over issues, but meet where your values are
connected. My old friend, Lisa Lucas has an expression, don't bring a fact to a values fight.
That speaks to the real thing that you're talking about right now, which is you can't persuade
people at least off the bat with facts or arguments. You've got to connect, build a relationship
on a values basis and go from there. But Matt, why persuade? You know, when we're listening to folks,
we should be listening to receive and not persuade. I think that is a part of the issue is that
everybody wants to be right when our democracy in fact depends on difference of opinion.
And us being able to disagree, agree to disagree, excuse me. And I think that again, you definitely
want folks are no common sense. We want to persuade them into common sense. But I think that there
is a value to having folks that make you think outside of the box sometimes and being able to have
those conversations. You know, you remind me about the importance of listening, which is such a good
point that there's an organizer in Milwaukee, Miss Anita, Miss Anita Johnson. We were at a training
session 10 years ago. And some Washington folks flew in to tell everyone in the room how to do
organizing. And Miss Anita has been doing organizing for decades. And so this person goes through,
here's how you should go to doors. Here's the wrap you should do at the door. And she raises
her hand. She says, you know, when I go to a door and I knock on a door, the first thing I do is
listen. And with such an important, powerful statement, both about her strategic insight and
experience, but also just on her human ability to connect with people that it stayed with me to
the stage. I love Miss Anita. Right. Why do I have one of these to say, you listen long enough,
you can learn something from a fool. Oh, there you go. That's the truth.
Tell me about the issues that are most important to you. You know, common cause when I think about
common cause Wisconsin, I think about money and politics and gerrymandering. Are those still
going to be vitally important to you over there? Definitely. For as long as they are to the
American people and and all Wisconsin nights. So common cause. We're going to focus on three
major areas for 2026. It definitely will expand over time. Can't expand over time. But we're
going to focus on increasing campaign finance, transparency and accountability. So voters know
who is influencing their elections and their policy makers. We're also going to focus on advancing
non partisanship redistricting to finally end gerrymandering in Wisconsin. Wisconsin voters
need to choose their representatives and not the other way around. And last but not least strengthening
protections for election administration, including safeguard for voters, election workers. So
our elections remain secure, accessible and trusted. Those are the areas that I plan to focus on
and have been focusing on in these first few, you know, 50 days that I've been in I'm going to
say in office, but in a position. It isn't office. How those first 50 days have been treating
you? They've been well. I think I couldn't have started at a better time. Having already been in
coalition, not missing a beat. You know, the on boarding process is one thing, but this work
continues. And I'm just grateful to have had coming into a legacy, um, that I am 31 years from
Jay Hick and having laid the foundation so that there is not much ground that I need to necessarily
be urgent and covering, but just making sure that the support and sustainability is there.
One thing that Jay did a long time executive director over at Common Cause Wisconsin say hi
for me too. The next time I talked to him was he was just so great with the media. I mean, he was a
human quote machine. And I just wonder, how are you going to try to follow those footsteps?
You know, I'm a creator. So I am so very honored to have, you know, come in the footsteps of Jay,
but I plan to create an impression for the next 30 years for the next 50 years. And so I don't,
you know, I've asked Jay to stay on. He may not be here physically, but definitely I was just
texting him last night. Oh, and so I think that he'll still be around. And when he's ready to
tap back in, he definitely has a space. So for me, it isn't about trying to feel his shoes more
so than continue his legacy and uphold the things that we need to continue like, you know,
anti-corruption, gerrymandering money and politics, but also creating that new wave because we're
in a new space of media and technology. And we have to move that way as well. And you've got
shoes of your own. So I always felt when I took someone. Very cute ones. That's today is
nothing. All right. I had to take a look. But yeah, when you took take someone's place, it's always
a question. I mean, and it's hard when someone's been there a long time. I remember when I became
editor of the progressive after the tragic death of my predecessor, Irwin Nol had been there for
decades. It was like a colleague of mine said, do you feel like you got the weight of the world
on your shoulders? Which was a little grandiose, but it is a weight. You must feel a little weight too.
I do. I do. In the area of membership engagement and donor engagement, that definitely has been
weighing on me. The work, I can do it in my sleep, but I think the part about engaging members that
been with someone for 30 years, engaging donors that's been accustomed to one way for 30 years,
that's been weighing heavy. But I also have a great team. Erin Grenzi is our program assistant,
and she's amazing. And so she's been able to help me to transition in a way that I couldn't have
asked for, coming into a position as such. And donor work is just relationship building,
just like everything else. And I can tell you're, you'd be good at that. So I don't think that's
something you need to fear. I'm sure you'll be able to tackle it quite easily. Thank you.
Give us a comment cause Wisconsin, y'all. There you go. And what's the website while you're making a
pitch is common cause dot org, www dot common cause dot org and look for Wisconsin to donate there.
And it is tax deductible. It is because that makes a difference for some people. I used to think
that was crazy when I first started doing donor relations, but it makes a big difference. And
then you have to do foundation work too. Do you have experience doing that? Yes. So I've been
trained technically in that area through a nonprofit in Wisconsin to do coalition work, foundation
work, as well as fundraising. You know, on the website I mentioned you've got civil rights and
civil liberties. I couldn't find anything in there. So I want you to fill that out for me. What your
priorities are in that particular sector. Yeah. What's there working that out? But for me, as I'm
coming in a basic needs campaign, I think is going to be the first and foremost. I've been
speaking with Mary Beth Collins. It's from the UW office of civic liberties and just
brainstorming what it looks like to meet the basic needs of advocates, activists, organizers,
as well as voters. When we think about those persons that are incarcerated, many of them 70
percent of folks that are incarcerated actually have the right to vote because they are awaiting
pre-trial in most cases. That's a national. And we're drilling down those numbers in Wisconsin.
But when people are worried about how they're going to eat, how they're going to sleep,
how they're going to make it the next day, they are not concerned about showing up to a public hearing.
They're not worried about coming out to a judicial race. And so how can organizations,
funders, connecting with social service programs, begin to actually meet the needs of individuals.
Those are large housing crisis in Wisconsin right now. And what are we doing to meet that need?
I plan to come to the civic liberty and civic justice pillar with the idea that I can't
accept a person to do something for me if I'm not actually caring about that whole person.
And of course, common cause when Wisconsin can't pay for housing, we won't pay for food,
but we have access to connect folks with those programs and to make sure that funders are aware
of the needs of the folks that are on the ground as well. Yeah, I think that it's important
in an organization like Common Clause as it was at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign to view
these issues of democracy and justice in a broad way. And so I'm excited about that possibility
too for you. You mentioned incarcerated persons. There are between 40,000 and I think 60,000
formerly incarcerated people in Wisconsin who are citizens but who still don't have the right to vote,
which is crazy because in many states including Illinois when you get outside the prison bars,
you've served your time. You have the right to vote but in Wisconsin because you're still on paper
as it's called, you can be deprived of the right to vote for five years, ten years,
fifteen years. And that's a crazy kind of disenfranchisement is common cause Wisconsin working on that
issue as well, the getting the vote back for formerly incarcerated persons.
Well, we support the Wisconsin Voting Rights Jill Voting Rights group where I'm the co-chair
of their group. Oh, I didn't know that. Oh, no, no worries. Yes, so yes, we're not working maybe
specifically on that. We have a list of priorities for 2026. Again, the basic needs, ID,
and there are other priorities there too, but we have a group of
made up of ACLU, the league, all voting is local, common cause, where we meet on a regular basis
monthly to talk about the rights of those who are formerly incarcerated and currently incarcerated.
And you mentioned the league. The league, of course, is the league of win-voters of Wisconsin and
traditionally common cause Wisconsin, the league of win-voters of Wisconsin work well together.
Yes, we still do. That's great. Yeah, those are important allies. We're talking here just
after some horrific scenes up in Minneapolis with the murder of Renee Good and Alex Pretty.
What do you see common cause Wisconsin doing about this grotesque violation
that ICE is imposing in Minneapolis and may be imposing here in Wisconsin?
Yes. And just to say, for my families and those families and communities that are going through
the tragedies that we're experiencing and witnessing in real time, just heartfelt prayers,
positive thoughts, and much action has to take place in response to that. Common causes
row to defend civil liberties, the democratic accountability, and the rule of law.
A federal enforcement actions raised serious concerns about transparency,
use of force, due to process, or community safety, the public deserves clear answers,
and independent oversight. We support the efforts that demand accountability.
We support the efforts that demand lawful conduct and respect for constitutional protections.
As well as communities, we feel that communities should never have to feel intimidated to use
their First Amendment rights or any right in the Constitution. So we are supporting these
investigations to make sure that what happened folks are held accountable for the murders that
were written witnessing. What was your gut reaction when you saw that video of ICE
pretty getting gunned down by those immigration folks? This has been, and I don't want to become
emotional. Well, it is emotional to order about that. It's been very hard. As an African-American
woman, this isn't the first time we've been here. So for me, the gut reaction is the question,
is what is it going to take? Is it going to take our children? Is it going to take,
you know, what will it take for us as an American people to stand up together? Despite the issues,
as we talked about earlier, we're always going to have pro-life or pro-choice. There's always going
to be whether you believe in public education or school of choice. Those are always going to
be issues, but the value of life, the quality of life, should never be an issue that we have to
discuss. And so for me, my gut reaction has been preparing my family for what's next, preparing
my community for, you know, we scenario planning in this space, but our family scenario planning.
Our community scenario planning. We have to get to a place where we're prepared for
any of the things that might happen and that can happen. And for me, looking back in history to,
you know, this isn't the first time, but it's a new time for all of us. And so it has been very,
it's been difficult, it's been emotional, and I've just been in the space of, I'm a woman of
faith, so in a prayerful space, in a space of being positive, and in a space of wanting to be
a resource for folks that need me. Yeah, and it's hard not to be just hitting the gut.
And we all do scenario planning. I'm a Jewish American. I was raised with knowledge of and study
of the Holocaust, and wondering, you know, if you were Jewish in 1933 in Germany or in 1934 or
1935, when did you get that out? And so the question always in my mind and the minds of many Jewish
Americans is, you know, are we on the road to Auschwitz here? Or, you know, what do we do here?
And when do we leave? Or do we stand up and fight? Which is my impulse, but, you know, the thought about,
you know, hell, you know, I'm an old man now, you know, I want to be in my last few years with
this craziness, this fascism. But I'm more interested in the scenario planning that you're doing
organizationally, I don't want to ask personally, what in the pro-democracy non-profit sector in
Wisconsin that I was a member of, when I was at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign, what is the
thinking about if ICE comes to Milwaukee or Madison in the volume that it and the ferocity
in Italy, Galilee, that it's come to Minneapolis, what do you do? And so I am not at a position to
share publicly what those are, what I can tell you is that we are convening. There was a convening
last month, and there is another happening in February for, because each organization has their
own of what they're going to do, but we have to have that coalition messaging, a plan of action
for when and if it does happen. And so the first week, second week of February,
the Wisconsin Voting Rights Coalition is convening to talk about some of those things as well as
continue to grow through the scenario planning. But what I can share is that the collaboration
with boots on the ground organizations that are doing the work, that are standing the line,
and how we support them, not just through our being president, but financially, because financial
support is needed for organizations to make sure that they're able to stand the line in these times.
And so the collaboration piece has been the most influential and major piece of the scenario
planning, because each of us does something will, and not one of us can do it alone. And so making
sure that we're leveraging our resources of time, people and money to make sure that not just
the coalition organizations are supported, but those organizations that are boots on the ground.
Well, I'm glad there's convening and strategizing going on, because we certainly need that.
Here's an easier but kind of trickier question. I mean, it's a less loaded,
emotionally, and as far as the urgency of what's going on right now. But I know a lot of
organizations, legacy organizations, like Common Cause, League of Women Voters, Wisconsin Democracy,
campaign, ACLU, Wisconsin, have a problem of tracking younger people. That's just a straight-up
fact. And I'm wondering, coming into Common Cause Wisconsin, and knowing that, I'm sure,
what your response is or strategy for trying to get some more younger people involved.
Well, I'm a pretty young thing myself, so I'm just saying.
Make me feel bad now. I am a young woman, so I'm going to meet the young folks where they are,
just kidding. I am very much, um, collaboration is key for me. However, I do know from my work and time,
just in community, what has worked in my organizing years has been meeting people where they are.
And so I think that what legacy organizations have to do is begin to come out. And again,
we've been in this remote space for so long, and so that's where we're used to being. And for me,
it's about touring Wisconsin Colleges, going to make sure that college students alongside of
campus votes with my dear partner, Kristen Hanson, making sure that we are there to support the
students, whether there's questions, there's issues or there's support needed. I also think that
creating spaces for them that are enjoyable for them. So if there is a concert happening,
us going to that concert and creating a space there for us to be able to provide the information
that is needed. Another thing that I think that is important is to make sure that we are creating
a pipeline of leadership that actually pays students or youth that want to be involved civically
because they want to be involved. They may not have the right guidance. And so creating those
leadership opportunities where the leaders that who are trained are able to go back into their
communities and bring more along. So for me, there are a few different ideas that I have,
but most importantly is talking to the youth and figuring out what it is that they want.
I think a lot of times we can sit around tables and come up with ideas about what youth want,
but until we ask them, we really don't know. So true. Is there anything you want to add before
we finish up that I haven't asked you yet? There's a lot of areas we could go into, but I just
wanted to give you an opportunity to say a last word or two or answer a question I didn't ask.
Yeah, I have just, I appreciate the opportunity. I appreciate your continued support. I'm really
eager to serve in this position. There was constant people to make sure that we are
sustaining our democracy and making sure that we are creating a force of unity in the space.
I have a question for you though. No good. What advice would you provide? Because you are a
legacy builder. You are, I admire your work, have followed your work for many years and so
just want to know I'm about 50 days into the job, maybe 55, but what would your advice be to me
for continuing to legacy build from Jay Hick knowing that we're going into this new phase of the
next 50 years of common cause? Well, I think the most important thing I guess is just to take care
yourself and don't feel like you have to work that extra 10, 15, 20 hours. 40 hours is fine.
People died for the weekend. Take your weekends and the marginal utility of those of the 55 hours
compared to 40 is pretty low. So just do your 40 hours, enjoy the job, but make sure you take
time for your own hobbies and your own family and prioritize those things to otherwise the job can
consume you and we don't want you to burn out. You're you're you're a rising star and we don't want
you to flash out and burn out. So I wish all your luck at Common Cause Wisconsin. Thanks for
being my guest today and the Wisconsin Ford podcast. It was great fun getting to know your
little better and just having a conversation. So I also want to thank my engineer and producer Dom Lee
who's always great to work with and I want to thank Sage Wilde of Civic Media for giving me
this platform, but most of all, I want to thank you for listening. I'll be back soon with another
episode of the Wisconsin Ford podcast where I think I'll be discussing fascism right here in the
United States and what we can do about it. You won't want to miss that one.
