Hey, Matt Rothschild here, host of the Wisconsin Ford Podcast all across the Civic Media
Radio Network and at civicmedia.us for the next several episodes of the Wisconsin Ford
Podcast.
I'm going to be interviewing Democratic candidates for governor.
What has been the response since your announcement?
I, so I'll admit, I'm not actually a huge social media user or I have folks who helped
me with that.
But to watch our launch video get a million views to have now, you know, over 700 volunteers
who have signed up for our campaign and are volunteering their talents, their time building
a community with another volunteers.
And then folks who are curious, there's not enough curiosity in politics.
And so, you know, this, this working class, Falmouth, restaurant worker, current bartender,
I think folks are watching to see how a working class candidate who is still considered an
outsider or as my friends like to call me a wild card.
This is, that reception has been really phenomenal, has given me a lot of energy and encouragement.
You mentioned social media, I thought there was you making all those social media videos,
I see your social media stuff all over the place.
I have gotten better and more comfortable.
It's, it's weird to me to look at a screen and talk to it, but I just remind myself that
this is a way to reach many people where they are.
We talked about this being a movement moment, explain that a little more.
We are seeing all across the country, especially now, people rejecting the status quo, recognizing
the harms of the Trump regime and really struggling with, you know, having their basic
needs meant because of the rise in the costs of living.
And so, in order to bring about the change that is really going to center working class
people, we need a movement, we need a large coalition of working class people who are in
different zip codes who have different lived experiences, but their central need is to
be able to afford where they live, care for themselves and care for their loved ones.
And so, to organize all those folks and then help them bring about change and let them
know that change is possible, this is what a movement looks like for me.
And that was a mandami movement in New York City that was so successful that must have
emboldened you.
It was so encouraging to see how working class people came together to believe in a campaign,
and again, there may be different lived experiences and even opinions, but the three things that
he ran on resonated with folks. And when people are ready for change, they want to do it in
community. And I think I was really encouraged that that's what we share. This movement is about
building community as well. And so, this is what we're learning is that people are ready for change
and they want to make a difference and they want to get involved. And for a campaign to be more of a
cause, I think that's what his campaign and my campaign share. And what are the issues that are
most important to you in this cause?
Fully funding our public schools, ensuring free and universal childcare, we're an aging state.
So, elder care and long-term care is incredibly important to ensure every working has fair and
good working conditions and can make a living wage. And then ensuring that everyone, that no one
has to pay between, has to decide between making a paycheck and making rent. And so, pay
for all is another key cornerstone of our campaign.
Yeah, I mean, rent is crazy here in Madison and crazy all across the state, I imagine. And you've
been traveling around the state. I think people, some skeptics would say, well, yeah,
Mandami, one in New York City, French Eskong, maybe able to win in Madison, but how is she going
to play out of Madison? How do you respond to that?
I've been fortunate to be able to travel across the state for the last five years in my time in
the legislature, whether it's knocking doors for candidates or being invited to speak with
communities about issues that really matter to them. And those issues are what is helping to build
our movement, free and universal childcare, fully funded public schools. These are universal
issues. And what I always tell folks is that fascism not only aims to divide us and distract us,
but it tries to take away our dreams, our vision for a better world. And when we reject this notion
that it has to be this way, it encourages folks to think bigger and bolder. And the dire moment
of this, how dire this moment is, this is something I'm hearing all across the state. And these
conversations are important. And whether it's popular, superior, we went to Grantsburg,
Wasas Stevens Point, headed to Appleton very soon, Blanchardville, Ployte, every single corner
of the state. Folks are curious, wanting to talk about change and make a difference in their
community, but also really, really stressed. And I identify with that stress because
I am right now as well, you know, working multiple jobs, trying to do the best for my son as a
single mom. And, you know, I work in a stressful job in the state legislature with a very
abusive, harmful Republicans who just don't care. And when you have a story or lived experience
that you can connect with someone else with, when the candidate is relatable, I think it allows
me to open up conversations and encourage people to really see that I'm actively listening and
caring about what they have to say. You talk about the economic stress people are living in,
you alluded to the political stress we're all living in under Trump in this fascist kind of government.
It's not enough just to be anti-Trump though. I mean, Kamala Harris learned that. We all learned
that in the last presidential election. But how would you as a governor deal with Trump as president?
I mean, when he brings ice in, when he does all sorts of threatening things as he did the governor,
he versus when governor, he versus just said he was going to let everybody in state agencies know
how to respond if ice comes knocking on the door. I mean, this is a challenge.
It's the responsibility of the executive to protect all of the communities in the state.
And whether that is through executive action, whether that is through, you know, arresting ice agents.
And one of the most important things is to ensure that local communities have what they need
to keep each other safe. We're seeing, you know, in Chicago, people come together whether it's
trainings, whether it's literally putting their bodies on the line, you know, using community
organizing strategies to make sure that everyone understands the urgency, how important it is to
keep all of our neighbors safe. And so ensuring local communities have what they need standing up
to the regime by, you know, the governor has the largest megaphone in the state. And when you make
it clear that we are standing up to this fascism, that we are prioritizing Wisconsinites and protecting
them first and using every mechanism that we can, it sets the tone and allows communities to
know that their governor is on their side. And what, how would you react as governor,
if, say, Trump wants to bring the National Guard out either in Wisconsin or sending him to
Portland or Oregon for God's sake? We heard Nancy Pelosi say she's willing to arrest ice agents.
And I think that while, you know, I have differing opinions about how to utilize law enforcement,
I think that that would require ensuring that local governments have what they need to make
sure they have, can protect their communities. And again, looking at every option possible.
And fighting just kind of on the back then to prevent them from coming here. And it's, we know
we're a target because we have sanctuary cities and we have people who are actively working to
give each other resources and keep their communities safe. But again, the executive has to use every,
you know, everything that is available to them to ensure that whether it's the National Guard,
whether it's ice agents that we are exploring every legal tactic. And then again, like I'm willing
to put my body on the line too. There are some sheriffs, a few counties in Wisconsin that are
playing ball with ice as governor, how would you respond to that?
Well, I was really proud to introduce the keep families together, legislative package,
and it would prohibit cooperation with ice, including 287G agreements,
ensuring that if there are families who need legal resources to ensure that they can have,
you know, they can use these legal resources to protect themselves,
ensuring that ice agents have to have proper identification, can't be cowardly and wear masks.
And so this type of legislation, especially if we have the Democratic trifecta,
I would push for my, for the legislators to ensure that these laws pass.
If we don't have that Democratic trifecta, how would you deal with what you call the abusive
Republicans? And I saw them being abusive when I would go in there and testify when I was at
the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign, not so much abusive of me, but just totally dismissive
of their Democrat colleagues, both procedurally and personality-wise.
My first priority is to ensure that every Wisconsinite has basic needs met and can
live a life of dignity, have opportunity, and economic security. And if Republicans are interested
in working with me on that, I am going to hear them out and make sure that they are at the decision
making table. I think with a Democratic majority in either house, which I believe is going to
happen in the Senate, there is going to need to be negotiations and compromise on the part of
Republicans as well. If they care at all about keeping their seats, they're going to need to deliver
communities that I hope is going to be one thing that we share is that we know communities deserve
better and we have to enact universal policies to make sure they're improved their lives. And
that's the expectation I'm going to set for the legislature. And can you say an example of how you
worked with Republicans in the legislature? I've passed legislation with Republicans,
the Asian-American education bill that require Asian history and talk about lived experiences
that would need to be in every K-12 classroom in public schools. And so this was a bipartisan bill
that the governor signed a couple of years ago. And it showed that they are still capable,
and even the fall mouth lefty from Madison is capable of working with Republicans to pass legislation
that is meaningful communities and especially takes care of our kids. You mentioned fall mouth.
I know some reporters when they're reporting on your campaign site that is a fact. It is a fact,
is it for people under 40 or under 50 it may not ring in their ears is such a clang but for some
of us over 50, not me, you should hear me on the tennis court, but there are those who do not like
to hear swear words. Do you think you're turning, do you risk turning people off by that?
I think one of the mistakes that Democrats made is that we are not making an emotional appeal.
Folks are angry right now. People are stressed. People are depressed and sad. And I think if politicians
do not show how passionate they are about how they feel about the current circumstances and what's
going on in the world, it makes us less relatable and it doesn't give voters. They have to see us
as humans too and part of their communities. I think that is what helps make an effective
legislator. This is how I talk. I came up through restaurant kitchens. I work in politics,
swearing is part of the everyday conversation for me. Being myself, but also showing that I am
passionate and emotional about this moment as well, I think shows an authenticity that many voters
identify with. Anyone who has watched any episodes of the bear knows that there's a lot of swearing
going on there. I will say that folks who were talking about decorum in the past and gave me
candid, unsolicited advice about my language, they are now in a place where the governor is
swearing. I think again, it speaks to the urgency of this moment and people want to see their
politicians fight for them and they want people to be authentic about it. And share the outrage.
Your friend of mine has a bumper sticker on her car for Bernie because and it says F this BF.
I laughed when I saw it. I mean, Bernie is not running right now, but that's the kind of attitude
that you're tapping into a little bit. Yes, and again, I think that authenticity piece where
being an elected official was not in my plan. I wanted to be a small business owner to create
a community space and nourish folks, care for folks. That's what being in the service industry
means to me. And I bring those lived experiences to the legislature, but that my lived experiences,
my background, the fact that I am going to swear because this is how I talk. I think
that relatability again, that authenticity is something that folks are curious about and oftentimes
support because look at where we are. Yeah. You identify as a democratic socialist. You're one
of three or four members of the socialist caucus in the legislature. And how do you define
democratic socialism? Democracy in society. This is about democratizing elements of the economy
to ensure that there is fairness, that there is care, that everyone has their basic needs meant
in housing, education, food, and this is common sense for many folks and regardless of labels,
it is the issues first and again, so central to democracy because whether it's participation
or who the government serves, how power is used, who power answers to. When we talk about who
should have power, it should be the people and the way for the people to have power when they have
their basic needs meant, when they're able to participate, democratizing that economy and how
we run government is something that makes sense for a lot of people when I bring it back to the
issues about democracy, society, and workers. But you're not talking about taking over businesses,
you're running your own small business. Small business and workers, labor came together as an alliance
to fight megacorporations and holding people accountable, recognize who is the villain here and
it's the folks who are gaming the system, not paying their fair share of taxes, making it so
that a system only works for them. Democratic socialism is how we move towards an antidote
for that system so that more people have power. And it may be more popular than some people think,
I'm just anecdotally remembering, Miami wins a right wing friend of mine on Facebook says,
oh my god, here comes socialism in New York. And then another friend of mine who I didn't
know is very political and may not be very political, responded to him saying, look, capitalism
isn't working for me and my family hasn't been since the crash of 2008. And I think a lot of people
can relate to that. I mean, we talked about housing. Rent is just ridiculous, people are spending
30, 40, 50% of their income on rent here in Dane County and in many places in Wisconsin.
What would you do about the rent issue, the housing issue, the ability to buy a house if
you're a young person, which seems just out of reach? Housing is a catastrophe right now here in
Wisconsin and across the country. And so it's going to require a multifaceted approach. And I
think one of the ways that we can best do that here in Wisconsin is actually to make it easier
to build affordable housing. There's a lot of things that the state controls that make it's
harder for local communities to build. And I think the other thing is this goes back to the
unfairness of how the system is rigged. I talked to folks in small communities right outside of
Rhinelander and corporations coming in buying housing, jacking up prices and making it harder for
the folks who live there, have been there to be able to afford rent. There has to be additional
regulations and protections for communities to make sure that folks can't come in and make it
harder for Wisconsinites right now who are working hard, who are trying to make a living,
deal with rising costs. They absolutely deserve affordable housing to be able to make their rent
and not have it take up so much of their income. A lot of it, you know, hedge funds buying up half
in Milwaukee practically. You know, they're out in California, they don't live here,
they're absentee landlords and they're just buying it out in a speculative boom. It is outrageous.
Enforcement and accountability, you know, Republicans talk about that all the time but they select
who that applies to and it has to apply to the folks who are actually coming in and making it
harder for working class people to live their lives. You know, I've been reading this book that
Ezra Klein co-wrote on abundance and he talked about making housing more affordable and the
bureaucratic problems that stand in the way sometimes of liberal governments making things happen
as biggest as example was high speed rail that never got anywhere in California. Of course,
we could have had high speed rail here in Wisconsin if it weren't for Scott Walker.
Such a trigger. So I just wonder what your reaction to how would you cut through some of that red tape
to make it easier to build affordable housing? We're a local control state and I think each community
understands better than the state, you know, having a one size fit all what sort of housing that
their communities are demanding and need. And so again, ensuring that the state isn't acting as an
actor that's going to make it harder for new zoning where we have to invest in certain parts of
the community, allowing the local government to be able to make those decisions. But the other
piece of this is enforcement and, you know, I know that regulation can be a hard word for folks but
I think it's about accountability to the mega corporations and, you know, private equity that's
coming in and taking advantage of our communities. And when we put it in that frame of we want to
hold the folks who are responsible for bringing harm and making it harder for us to live a living,
for us to have a living and have the freedom to be able to live where we want it. That enforcement
piece is, you know, the responsibility of the state and one of the ways that we can make it,
harder for folks who are trying to build and make it more expensive for communities and let folks know
that it does not have to be this way. But it's going to be a challenge and it's going to be happy
happen multifaceted. But there's a diverse coalition who want more affordable housing from
the realtors to unions to everyday folks in Wisconsin. And so we have to come together to get it done.
An issue I worked a lot on the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign was gerrymandering.
How do we get a final solution to this? So no party whether it's Democrats or Republicans
can gerrymandor. I was against even California gerrymandering here. This last
time gerrymandering is wrong. I don't think anyone should do it.
Past legislation for permanent fair maps. The legislation is drafted. It's been
it's starting to get circulated. We need Republicans and Democrats to support this because
you're absolutely right that gerrymandering is harmful to democracy. And we can look at models
like Iowa where there is a commission that is nonpartisan. I don't think elected officials
should be on that commission to help draw maps. But the legislation is there and we need every
legislator to support it. And I'd be a governor to sign that into law. And then what about
another issue. I worked on money and politics. Walker totally destroyed our campaign finance law
and made the sky the limit on how much rich people can throw into our system as we saw with
the Elines and Dianne Hendricks and Elon Musk for that matter. No, forget Jon Minard.
Yeah, Minard and the folks at Quick Trip too. So I mean there's a lot of right wing money that
throws its weight around here in the state. Money in politics, corporate money in politics,
big money in politics is all disgusting. And also what it does, it makes it harder for working class
candidates to run for office because they're going to be competing in either party with you know
who can raise the most money. And so not only is it anti-democratic, but I think it makes it so that
we don't have the representation that a lot of communities would benefit from because we've got
folks who have those lived experiences and understand what it's like to be a working class person
and to struggle and to be, you know, I want more moms and educators and union workers to be
able to represent us in government. We absolutely need to re-instate in the state, you know,
ways for government to prevent big money for coming in. And I think there's also ways that we can
help people who are running for office and need additional support. You know, Congress and at
the federal level folks can have ways that they can use campaign money to help with cost of living,
but we can't do that here in Wisconsin. So that's another piece of legislation that I'd want to
explore. And so how are you funding your campaign? You know, you're a working class candidate.
I'm not taking any corporate money or APEC money. This is a grassroots people-powered campaign.
And I'm actually proud of the fact that we are keeping our donation average low, but we've got
the most donors of other campaigns of you know of my opponents right now. I think I can
confidently say that. And that's what's going to continue to do when you have more people
who want to give, regardless of what they can, because they want to be a part of your campaign,
believing you in a part of movement. Or maybe they're just curious. I think that's more democratic.
And this is, you know, we have to consider as well that even if, you know, the maximum amount
we may receive, it's going to be people right now, especially where there's so many other needs,
you know, whether it's giving to organizations that are committing food insecurity, whether it's
making sure that we're giving to, you know, there's so many nonprofits who do great work who
have had their funding decimated. We're also going to make sure that where we can, we can provide,
you know, those, you know, we can help the community by making donations ourselves as a campaign.
And that helps us build relationships, but it's also the right thing to do.
There's been a lot of analysis after the elections, not just with Mandami, but with Spanberger and
Virginia and Cheryl and New Jersey, you know, do you go left or do you go pragmatic in the middle?
And you know, the Washington Post and all these pundits are saying no, just go in the middle.
How do you assess that?
I think Spanberger came out right away and showed that she would be complicit.
And this, I understand this big tent notion, but we have to appeal to working class people right now.
And the, the dialogue and how folks talk about it might be different for different parts of the
country, but sticking to the issues, repelling elitism, making it so that, you know,
knowing that when we have legislation that benefits all working class people, all people benefit,
you know, rising tides, lifts all boats. So I, while I personally am very skeptical about
moving towards supporting moderate candidates, I think that, you know, we have to do everything right now
to ensure that we can fight fascism and defeat fascism. But I worry that if we go back to
campaigning the way that, you know, is out of fear, that we're going to continue to lose folks.
And right now, we've shown that Democrats can, they can be the party of unforced errors sometimes
with, so that we need candidates that are not going to capitulate to the status quo and
choose, you know, political courage over political expediency. And I'm not sure that's always
the moderate candidate. And so we have to be very careful about that.
You know, Wisconsin has this great progressive tradition going back to funding Bob LaFallet
and the progressive populace of the late 19th century. Social security was born here. So
our socialism was born here. Milwaukee has had a history of socialist mayors. So to some extent,
the terrain here is familiar to a lot of people in Wisconsin, not just those who identify as
democratic socialists. But it's not a scare thing when you see, you know, LaFallet schools,
LaFallet streets all over the state of Wisconsin. And if you're in Milwaukee where your socialism has
made, you know, the lakefront, you know, a public place rather than a privatized place, people
understand that sewer socialism can work. Are you getting people who, you know, have an identified
Democrat Republican left right, but are you resonating with that old progressive tradition
when you're traveling around the state? I get so excited when I meet folks at, you know,
the different community events that we're at, who are independent, who say their socialists,
who say they don't identify with any party right now. You know, folks who have been
diehard lifelong Democrats, volunteering for the Democrats. These are all folks that we've met
at individual events. And it's, that's really exciting. That means that,
regardless of where you are on the political spectrum, you're ready for change. And people are
pissed, people are stressed. They know that the system is working against them and that we have a
fascist regime, regime that continues to bring on harm and chaos. So one of the ways I, like,
I talked to folks about how important then it is to have a state government that is bold and
unafraid to not just fight the fascist regime, but make sure that communities have what they need
because Trump is going to continue to tank the economy and make it harder for folks to just
live and survive. He is, you know, this is a Republican party in a regime that doesn't care about
starving folks and are willing to starve children that doesn't care about reaping away people's
healthcare. I mean, millions are going to die if they don't have access to healthcare through
the Affordable Care Act. And so we have to look at ourselves at the state to meet the
urgency of the moment and make sure that we are acting as swiftly as possible to get healthcare
to folks, to get child care to folks, to get education to folks and living wages, which is why
we have to talk about universal policies and set that as the expectation for the legislature.
There is a level of satism in this Trump regime, both in policies domestically and then,
you know, cutting off a foreign aid that's killed, you know, 500,000, 600,000 people by some
tabulations already. And the man is just totally and his people are just totally lacking in basic
human empathy. So I do think you're striking up a contrast. It's really important there.
Is there anything I haven't asked you? We get that you want to mention?
I'm a community organizer. So I always have to leave folks with an action item. And I think that
while I would appreciate any support to our campaign, there is so many communities that are doing
hyper-local community organizing, people, folks showing up for, you know, providing meals for
their neighbors, food drives, making sure people are giving cash to food pantries. And I would
implore folks to know that that mutual aid that's happening in your individual community is another
form of resistance. So look at who's doing that work, where you can support in the organization and
whether it's your time, whether it's giving money, whether it's just making sure that more folks
that you're able to amplify the good work of organizations in your communities. It's still,
it's one of the ways that we can continue to fight together. And if people want to support your
campaign, represent of Hong, how do they do that? They can go to franchascohong.com. I'm on all
the social media sites I think at franchascohong.wi. Well, thanks so much for being my guest today
in the Wisconsin Ford podcast. It's great to see you. Good to see you too. Happy to be here.
Good luck on the trail. Thank you so much.
Well, that's going to have to be it for this episode of the Wisconsin Ford podcast on the Civic
Media Radio Network. I'm Matt Rothschild. I want to thank you for listening. I also want to thank
my engineer and producer, Dom Lee, who's always great to work with. And I want to thank Sage
Wilde of Civic Media for giving me this platform. I'll be back in just a day or two with another
Democratic candidate for governor. So stay tuned for that.
