Welcome, everyone, to Midday Magazine for this November 29th, 2023.
Have your host November 30th, it is.
I don't know why I was looking at my notes there, Jackie, and it says November 29th,
so I completely did our draw in burgundy on that one.
Just read what was in front of me.
It's November 30th, and we're joined by our great friend Jackie Carentini,
our last guest of November. Jackie joins us as a human development and
a relationships educator with UW-Madison Extension Wood County.
Jackie, good afternoon.
Good afternoon.
How have you been?
Good.
Good, thanks for being here, Jackie.
We appreciate the time.
Our topics today are going to range a bit, but we're going into advanced directives
and the power of attorney during family gatherings.
These are the main headlines for us today, correct?
Yeah, a kind of end-of-life planning.
I've been a fan for quite a few years of telling folks,
when you head into the holiday season and your families are gathering,
I think it's a good time to talk about some of the difficult topics,
and that's not usually a popular thing, and people don't go,
oh, yeah, that's great. I'm so excited.
But it is good, because your families are together.
It's hard for people to walk away, you know, during,
you know, and so they're there, and it's good to have some of those discussions.
An end-of-life planning is one of those things that I encourage everyone,
especially when you're talking about advanced directives,
over the age of 18, we need to have those.
You know, and we need to have conversations.
And I think because no one, no one wants to talk about,
you know, you're inevitable, your own death, we don't.
But when you hear of someone who I just had a colleague,
whose father-in-law passed away last week,
and it was not ha-ha funny, but interesting, because she's been working on this with me,
so she knows, you know, she thought she was doing really well
with having things done, but he died in a car accident.
And so she sent me this very lengthy email yesterday, like,
okay, we didn't think about insurance, and we didn't think about this,
and we didn't think about this, although we had all this other stuff planned out
for a natural death, we didn't think about all these other things.
And she's like, and that can happen to anybody at any time, right?
That's not just if you're in your late 80s.
And I think one of the things I just, so I'm going to back up a little bit and talk about
something we don't talk a lot about in the extension.
But one of the things that we do as educators in extension
is we respond to needs in the community.
So that is where this actual curriculum came from,
this curriculum called Planning ahead,
is I'm one of the authors, we wrote it about three years ago,
we got a grant and wrote the curriculum, because we found out that no one in the country
in the inter-nation had a really executed curriculum on this variety of topics.
So yeah, you'll find stuff. There's many community partners that talk about,
you know, advanced planning, and we have funeral homes that we'll talk about,
planning a funeral, and we have, you know, maybe hospice, we'll talk about grief,
but not all of it together, and really giving you checklist to think it through,
and to pace yourself, and to really give yourself self-care as you're going through,
and making your way through this process.
So that is one of the things. So we actually wrote this curriculum, we piloted the curriculum,
we launched it, then we've now evaluated. So if you took, if you were one of my early adapters,
and you came a couple years ago, we just launched a whole new workbook this summer
that's been revamped and edited, although it's only three years old.
But because we responded to what the community said, and then one of the cool things that I don't
think I talk about with you very much is that in our first pilot, we had some among community
partners that gave feedback. Then we ended up getting another grant with UW-Madison School of
Nursing. We did a year of interviews within the among community throughout the state of Wisconsin,
and we just launched in September a mung version of this workbook. Yeah, that takes into cultural
aspects. So around death very different, I always say it's interesting because I can say the word
advanced directives to you, and if I was working with a mung partner, or even Hispanic,
to try to translate that, it would take about a five minute conversation to do the words advanced
directive, because there is no word for that. That does that word doesn't exist in that language.
So when we're trying to have these conversations about it, and then not knowing what their cultural
beliefs are, what their faith is, what all these other things, it's hard to explain. It's really,
really difficult. Yeah, so very excited that we just launched that in the fall two.
One of the things that we have with something like that that I have found, Jackie, is there
here's an opportunity also to not only educate people of other cultures, but creating empathy,
and that there are certain things that cross over, no matter what race, creed, religion you are,
or any of that. I think of food first and foremost with that, but grief and suffering is another one
of those things. It's across the aisle. It's the same. In my family, we have Jewish and Catholics,
and on the Jewish side of things, when we have a lot like my grandmother or my grandfather,
they have to be buried before sundown. It's go time. There's no, I got to call this
person, this person, it's a very important thing to have that person set before sundown.
Cultural things that exist. Cathalism, not as much with some of those things, but it's important
to know some of that stuff. Just for the sense of understanding, I think, in day-to-day life,
I think it's interesting as well. I appreciate you bringing up your colleague, my heart goes to them.
Last week, we lost my papa, my grandfather. The arguably the greatest influence I'll ever have,
man who meant the world to me. He was 97, though, and lived a long life and lived a good life,
and we had plenty of time to plan things out and have things set in motion for when he did pass.
We were still scrambling. My papa was good at this. My papa did a great job of this and had
things set up and had a will in all of this, and at the same time, we still, the last week or so,
and I'm only sharing this because I'm hoping it helps with somebody else.
We spent the fighting and working. We want this, we want that, and they want this,
they want that, these different things and stuff. Even with all the planning to papa dead,
there were still some outliers, and when you're grieving in a family, you've got enough on your
plate. You don't need to add things to that plate. I already lost my papa. I don't want to lose
my aunt or my uncle. I want to lose another family member over some drama or something like that,
and it's being created for nobody's to blame here with this. Everybody's coming at this from
love and caring and hurt and healing. That being said, when it comes to this topic, the more that
you can cover, the more things that you can check off, the more less things that your family
like mine, to have the bicker about and everything. You can just focus on grieving and celebrating
the life. Thank you so much for saying that because that is everyone. That is the reason that we do
this. I always, when I start off in our first session of the class, I'll say, what is the gift
that you want to leave to your family? That is the response. We don't want them to fight. We want
them to be able to grieve peacefully. We want them to be able to move on. The more that you can
have done, and there aren't, like you said, you can think you have it, and I love that you said
will, because most people go, well, I have a will. That's great. What about the other 30 things?
You mentioned early on, advanced directives, and even when we talk about advanced directives,
I like to put it at this great graphic of a house. I said, there's two pieces within this. There's
the piece that's the actual legal paperwork that you have to have filed. Wisconsin has laws that
you have to have that file. Then there's the whole personal drama piece of what do you want?
What are your wishes? No one can tell you that. I can't tell you, James, if you want to be too
fed, if you can no longer eat, I can tell you if you want to be kept alive, if your heart
or lungs no longer beat on their own. That is you, that you have to do that. That's a part of it,
too. Then there's all the piece of what's the same colleague that lost her father in law,
I always say, what about the rest of the junk in your house? You have a will for the big stuff,
and then what about the rest of it? That is usually what families fight over. She said,
well, no, I call it heirlooms, and I'm like, well, that's a nice way of putting it. Maybe in your family,
you have heirlooms. My family looks more like a hoarder, and it might be junk, great, like
I don't know how you want to say it. There's that. Then there's the other stuff. Then there's
your actual funeral, and what are your wishes? Some folks have it right down to the music they
want played, who they want, what if they're having an actual funeral, if they're having a casket
viewing, what they want to be wearing, who it comes, all of this stuff, or if they want to be
cremated, what they want to happen, everything out. Then, so again, there's this series in seven
sessions. It's seven sessions for a reason, and I could probably do seven sessions on each one
of these topics, because there is just so much. The cool thing about this is we have checklists
for each one of these, and I think that's one of the things that we've heard just astoundingly is
that I can work at this in my own pace and know that there's no timeline on this, but I can actually
give myself credit for the things that I have done, and the checklists are great, because it lets
me know what I need to do yet. I want to get into the sessions with you in a second. Before we go
too far down the line, Jackie, I hate to treat you like a dictionary, but I do know that there are
some people out there that may not be as familiar with some of these terms that we are like advanced
directives. What is advanced directive specifically? Yeah, so I kind of like to say the advanced
directives is almost like an umbrella term, but hopefully, if you've been to the doctor,
they will ask you when you check in if you've filled out your advanced directive forms.
So it usually is the living well or directive to medical professionals, and then also you can
do medical power return. And so the idea is that in Wisconsin, there is a law that says we are not
a next of kin state. I'm going to say that one more time. Wisconsin is not a next of kin state,
and what that means is if you were in an accident today and you were taken to the hospital and
you, you know, you're unconscious, you're not able to make, you know, choices for yourself at
the time. They're not automatically going to call your daughter. They're not going to automatically
call her or they may, if she's there, they may consult with her, but if you do not have those
advanced directive forms filled out, then it goes to the medical team. And the medical team
primarily gets to make decisions. Now, before someone, you know, tries to call in and argue with us,
many of our health systems say they will consult with the family, and it's their policy to
consult with the family, which is great. But by law, it's not required. And this came, you know,
maybe you've heard of this or had of someone a friend or family say this during COVID,
we did hear this quite a bit where folks, you know, a decision was made and the family, it was
against the family's wishes or they didn't consult with the spouse, and they were all up in arms,
and it was like, hmm, did you have your answer to fill them? If not, yeah. And then it also is
those, some of those questions I said, if you are unconscious and unable, what life sustaining
treatments do you want? So do you want to be tube fed? Do you want to be put on a respirator?
Do you want, you know, there's all these, you know, any kind of artificial, you know,
CPR, if your heart stops, all that kind of stuff. So it asks you, Wisconsin is fantastic. I have
looked at many states. I love Wisconsin, ours is a checklist. So it literally is a yes or no. Do
you want, you know, if you're lung stuff, do you want to be, you know, if you're unable to be fed,
do you want to be too fed? It's a yes and a no. It's great. It's fantastic. So although the decision
making process for you may take a long time, that is not, I'm not making a light of that, that's
not an easy decision, and that may take a long time and some soul searching, but feeling out the
yes or no is super, you know, that's a quick process. So that's pretty cool. So yeah, so that's
generally when we say advanced directives, it does those things. And then also that ability,
the power of attorney for healthcare comes in there too. So that is to name someone again,
if you are unable or unconscious, I'm able to make decisions, someone, you name someone
to be able to make those decisions for you. We're speaking with Jackie Carantini from UW
Madison Extension Wood County. And Jackie, do we, do we have some tips to kind of help people
to get the ball rolling here with this? Certainly the sessions we want to encourage people to attend.
Yeah. So that, this will be coming in January. So I try to rotate between in-person and virtual
we did a summer and a fall in person at McMillan and they were very well attended.
We are going virtual for the winter just because a lot of adults choose not to drive.
And so we will be doing it. If you haven't attended in a Zoom, it is super, super easy.
I hope if you're technology challenged or you think you can't do it, I will challenge you to say
that I'm pretty sure you can. So all you need is you can do it on a smartphone, you can do it
on a laptop, a tablet, any kind of PC or Chromebook, all of that works. And we do do some practice
sessions with you. We have step-by-step instructions to get you on board, all of that. And then when we
do run these, we also have, so we have three people. So I will, I primarily teach then we have
someone just watching the chat. And then we have someone that is just there for technology
to help people if you get hopped on and off, and so you don't panic. So we take care of it that
way. And they will also be in the afternoons this time. So last time we did it in the morning,
and so we want to give folks that have things going on in the morning and opportunity. So
there'll be on Mondays starting in the middle of January and 1 to 2 p.m. in the afternoons. So
it is free of charge. You do get a workbook. The workbook is available now. So if you want to,
you're thinking, oh, I want, this sounds interesting. I want to see what this baby looks like.
You can actually just Google planning ahead, comma extension, and it comes up, like I told you,
we're the only ones that have this. And there is a free, fillable workbook there. So you can actually
fill it out just on your computer if you want. If you don't want to print it out,
because again, it's a living, breathing document. You're not going to do it all at one time.
And so this allows you to go step by step and just kind of keep track. And I, I say this with a
lot of things you and I have talked about this, whether we're talking about finances, whether
we're talking about your own physical health, whether it be, you know, de-stressing or trying to
drink more water or, or any of those things, when you check something off, it's motivating,
right? Like it gives you the sense of, oh, I can do this. So I am the first to say this topic,
end of life planning is daunting. It is daunting. It is the number one reason that folks don't do it.
So latest surveys said, if I asked people, if they think it's important, 93% of people say
it's absolutely important to take a stab at how many people have actually started.
I'm hoping maybe 50% maybe less than 30. Yeah, it's like 20, 29% because. And then if the third
question is why it's daunting, it's overwhelming, I don't know where to start. So and like I said,
many more than 50% have done a will. So that's that. But beyond that, it's pretty slim pickings.
Because they don't know where to start. So that's the first thing is the workbook is there.
It's if you're a checklist person, that makes you feel good, that's available.
And then like I said, it's the holidays. Just start having conversations, right? And you can do
something as simple as, you know, oh, I've really been thinking there's been a lot of car acts
in their hands, but a lot of car accidents lately of young people. And I've never asked you,
what, what are your wishes? You know, if something happened to you tonight,
on your way home, and you know, you were in a car accident, what would you want to be, you know,
this? What, what, what does that look like for you? What are you thinking? And so it doesn't have
to be about you. It can be this open conversation. And then you have this way to then respond. Well,
you know, I've thought about it too. I'm at a different stage in my life. This is, this is where I
think I would like this, but I really wouldn't like this, right? I think that if you're looking for
segues, how to get this ball rolling, how to get this conversation started, whether you are the
person that needs to do this or you're loved one of somebody that you think needs to address this
and hasn't or something, you have a couple of things built, a couple built in segues. I think
the holidays are one of those. Yeah. And I think if you are somebody who has lost somebody recently,
I have used my Papa's passing for a segway to talk to my mom and dad about a lot of these things,
because they like my grandparents got everything, everything checked off. But if I've learned anything
from talking to you, Jackie, it is, there is this stuff we think of and the things that we don't
cover, the thing, the gray area that we don't always get a chance to think about. So while it's,
you know, it's a hard time. And we're reminiscing, we're sharing, we're healing together.
It's also an opportunity for you to maybe bring these things up and kind of check in with the
people that you love and make sure that they've got this checklist done. Yeah, absolutely.
It's funny. I smiled when you said that because we actually have a handout that's called
Death Bed Secrets, you should not keep. That's a good title. That's a good title, too. That's a good title.
I get a checklist because we love checklist. But anything from your financial information,
your property, where are all of your important documents located, anything to your computer,
anything, you know, passwords, things like that. There's worksheets on all of that. And then
what do you do in the community? So, you know, do you volunteer, you know, who should we contact?
Do you have any, you know, are you the treasurer of the Kiwanis Club? Where are those documents?
How do I get into those documents, right? If you're the keeper of the knowledge and many folks are
fantastic volunteers in our community, but something happens to them, we have no idea where to get
that stuff, right? So, yeah, so lots, there's lots of aspects of this. Like I said, there's, you know,
many, many things. But yeah, it's one of those. Just kind of start. So, you don't even have to start
with, you know, well, this is what I want in my funeral. No, no, I mean, you might eventually get
to that. But there's so many other pieces, right? Like, again, starting with the advanced directives,
hey, you know, when I went to the doctor the last time they asked me, do you have yours filled out,
you know, do you have a part of attorney? You know, who is it? The other cool thing about those
part of attorneys in the state of Wisconsin for both healthcare and finance, they have to be
signed to witness. It does not have to be notarized. It should not be notarized. But it can't be
anybody related to you. So, that's another thing about, you know, doing it during the holidays
is everybody can fill it out together, your family. And then you can have the neighbor come over
and witness it for everybody all at one time because it is hard to find someone that's not related
to you. But it does need to be someone that related to you to be legal. So, Jackie, is this a class
that people need to register for? Yeah, absolutely. So, call the extension office. Our number is
715-421-8437. Again, 715-421-8437. Again, it is in January. This one because it is, excuse me,
virtual, you do need to have an email so we can communicate with you. I will say we are also
planning, I will bring it back in person again. I'm doing Marshfield in, so this one's January
February. March, April is in Marshfield and so then May, June will be back at McMillan in the
summer. So, if you prefer to do in person, you can also call and let us know and we'll get you
on the waiting list. So, when that registration does come out, we can get you that too. But no cost,
again, we can also immediately get you the links to the materials. Or if you just want to go
online, again, it's planning ahead, comma extension. It's so super easy to find. It's the first
thing that pops up and it'll take you right to that workbook. Jackie, if people sign up and maybe
things come up and they're not able to attend every single session, is that okay? Are you going to
be all right there? Yeah, absolutely. So, that's a great point. Because I do know that, you know,
it's a long time, right? It's a couple of months. It's a big commitment. But yeah, they build off
of each other. I do give out the handouts if someone can to attend. I have been also the last
couple of sessions because we're trying to be more flexible with folks. So, if you have a hard time
hearing, I have been getting giving out actual written notes of my notes so people can actually
follow along by reading. So, then if you do miss one, you have copies of that so you can go back
and just read it. So, those are there as well. So, yeah, absolutely. Most folks can't make it the
whole time whether it's therapy or a doctor appointment or a trip or whatever. Yeah, absolutely.
And Jackie, if people have followed questions, want to know more, reach you. How can they do that?
Yeah, again, contact the extension office, 715-421-8437. And I am more than willing to help. And we
also have paper copies of the book. So, if you don't want, you're thinking about attending the
class or not even sure, but you just want to start now. You can also contact the extension office
and we can get you a paper copy of the manual too. It's too important of a topic to ignore or to try
to hide or stuff under the bed, not look at anymore. One of the best ways to honor your loved ones,
do right by your loved ones is to take care of these things. And if you need a hand doing this,
you've got a great couple of sessions coming up that can help you out with that Jackie in the 10.
Absolutely. And again, it's a gift, right? If you think about it that way, it might be a hard topic
to talk about or to start, but it is a gift that you give your loved ones. Well said, always
good talking to you, Jackie. Love it and appreciate the time from you and what you do for our community.
I don't think we'll see each other until next year. So, have a great set of holidays, okay?
Thank you too. Thank you. We'll be back with more Midday Magazine tomorrow right here on WFHR,
locally grown radio.
