Cheap Trick: Bars to Budokan author Ross Warner on Max Ink Radio

That is Clark strikes 10. That is cheap trick from their 1977 album in color. I'm rock

there. Here we use tonight along with Sam Davis. You are listening to Maxing radio on the

Civic Media Radio Network. Sam, you know, cheap trick. They were a local band in a way.

They were from Rockford and back in the 70s and 80s. And even today, there is a connection

between the music scenes of Milwaukee, Madison, and Rockford. And it's where cheap trick got

their start. And there's a new book coming out on September 3rd called American Standard

cheap trick from the bars to the Budacan and beyond. And right now, we have author Ross Warner

on the phone with us from New York. Ross, welcome to Maxing Radio.

How you guys doing? Awesome. Awesome. How's New York out there right now?

It's good. It's a Labor Day weekend. It's Long Island. It's actually nice weather. It's great

but not to be a work. Not too human. No, actually, it's not. It's starting to get a little bit

cool. But yeah, I mean, like everybody else in the beginning of the summer was pretty bad.

So Ross, you are a professional writer and you specialize in music. Tell us a little about

yourself. And what's your backstory? How did you become an author?

Well, I mean, I don't know that I'm a professional. I've had Britain for a long time. I do actually also

teach full-time in social studies, actually, for 28 years now. But I got slightly by choice because

I wrote a book called Drunk on Sunday, which is a fictionalized count of

growing up in the suburbs, being obsessive San Diego now, Los Angeles Chargers fan, going

to 138 dead shows and the kind of fighting post, the fighting responsibility every step of the

way. And I guess movies, music, television, I've always obviously loved. So I've always tried

to write about it. And even in the mid-90s, when I started writing, I mean, it's before you've

blogging, you know, I used to write like a newsletter from the Chargers now. Of course, you know,

there's a blog or a podcast or everything. Everybody's got, you know, a microphone and a

stack of very impressive books for albums on them to show off. But that's really kind of my backstory.

It's writing in general. It's always been a ash of mine. And all of this is obviously a biography.

So it's slightly different. And, you know, it required a lot more research. I always enjoyed,

honestly, you know, expressing myself that way through writing.

Well, now, tell us about your new book, about Cheap Trick. What does your book focus on early

Cheap Trick history? Sure. Yeah. Well, I mean, Brian Kramp, why did you guys all

so if you did a book that wasn't even aware of when I started called Span Has No Pass,

which I think I'm glad actually looking back to his came out because I couldn't do what Brian does.

And I wouldn't even have tried, which that obviously was a very forensic, almost a podcast,

like look at all the early permutations of the band. Obviously, yes, they're roots, you know,

in Rockford. But as I heard you mentioned, I mean, you know, there's much a, I was constant band,

as they are in Illinois band. And my book, I think, really focuses on more what everybody kind of

remembers about Cheap Trick, which is, you know, Budacan Dream Police, kind of the improbability of

that story happening. And then really a lot of the misconceptions that I mean, certainly the band,

you know, went along with for a while, not just the fake bio, but about Budacan, you know, about

obviously being, well, Jack Douglas, you know, kind of more perpetuated. But the idea of being

just discovered at the sunset ball is if they were just kind of playing and he can happen to be

there, which was with the case. And then, of course, the album, you know, again, you know, everybody

has that image of them, you know, in that very moment. But obviously, the album itself,

you know, really worked for and against them, because when it came out, obviously, it wasn't

originally intended to be, you know, domestic religious, it wasn't import. You know, I'd be

talked to Marty Scott of Jim Records, which is a huge importer at the time that had a huge role

in that part of the story that I don't think they ever really get to talk about. And, you know, by the

time, you know, Budacan finally hit, they were really forced to sort of kind of stand in motion,

and then not the understatement couldn't change. And obviously, Dream Police had already been,

you know, for the most part recorded. So they spent the better part of, you know, a year sort of

supporting an album that they never really intended, you know, to be the thing. And, you know,

certainly by the time they broke in 1979, and then the album comes out in September, you know,

I think it definitely, like I said, worked for and against them. And as you know, obviously,

they've had several more rises and falls, you know, since then, and originally I'd attempted

to do an entire band biography, you know, for all of the years, but, you know, they're approaching

a 50th year, this year, three or four, but the publisher really wanted me to, you know, focus on

the certain number of pages. So that's like, I'm excited to really get into the, you know, the

era, like I said, that everybody really knows them from, you know, where some people they are,

literally that band froze at the time, you know, on that stage, screaming Japanese girls, you know,

stage plotter, which is iconic as the performances, obviously, there's a generation of people that

only know, you know, that's the first song off our new album, because it's on the beefy boys

check your head. I mean, yeah, right. But, well, you know, can you tell us about the unique

relationship, the cheap track, the cheap trick, has had with the tri-city music scenes of

Rockford Milwaukee and Madison. You mentioned Sunset Bulls, is that the one in Waukeshau?

Yeah, yeah, that is, I mean, they are, you know, there is midwestern as they come, and I think,

you know, in reality, you know, they are four, you know, including Bun, they are four Swedish

guys, you know, from Rockford, obviously, and there is, you know, that's seemingly about

as ordinary as it can be. And then, of course, you know, the biography of the stand, you know,

has a pass that Eric Bonlass-Vader, you know, was asked to craft for them that made it see

much more exotic, you know, like, just like Bluticon itself kind of worked for and against them,

because for a long time, you know, they had to answer questions about it, and it became,

not just the talking point, but some that kind of dogged them. And more, I mean, then, you know,

even though I think I mentioned, I mean, Kiss Obviously paints their faces, but in many ways,

especially Rick, I mean, I know Bonlass said that, you know, Rick Nielsen has been, you know,

bidding characters since, you know, basically in 1975, he's always Rick Nielsen, and I'll be just,

you know, we're basically involved with the opening of the Hard Rock in Rockford.

Yeah. But I mean, they obviously came not only out of the sunset bowl, which, like I said,

Brian certainly talked about, I think, he grew up in Wakashab, but, you know, that show itself,

you know, they had Jack Douglas come in. I can't add him any, you had mentioned,

was very nice to show him to me. I mean, I saw, like, the letters, you know, on the call,

the call logs, Jack Douglas. I mean, it was a much more deliberate thing to have Jack come here

than there. And then, really, I mean, with the Midwest, it's something that I was, I mean,

I sort of aware of, it's just the craziness of all those just bars that they had, that they played

in, you know, everything, you know, so 70s, you know, the wet t-shirt contest, the promotions,

you know, these small places where, you know, they were out there, and obviously better look

the one that everybody knows them for, you know, took a little bit to kind of solidify,

so there were different permutations of that. But, I mean, they really were, you know,

they were out there every night, really, you know, working their ass off to be successful.

And I think that's another thing of the Cheat Trick image, you know, again, personified by Rick,

kind of, you know, the goofiness and not really trying, but they were super trying. They very much

cared about being successful. And I guess the story about them being, you know, discovered by

happenstance, by Jack, and a bowling alley, kind of detracts from that, you know, it makes for a great

story. I do put in the book, you know, it's like the old, you know, John Ford western liberty

balance, you know, print the legend, but it also detracts. In fact, they really were deserving of it,

and I think when they broke, it really appeared to a lot of people like they were like a flu,

you know, that they were kind of a gimmick, that, you know, that the term Cheat Trick, you know,

they thought, well, that's actually what they are. They're just trying to kind of,

they're kind of like Cheeva said, and the reality was that, you know, the real story was much more,

I guess, deliberate and, you know, much more deserving, but I guess it wasn't nearly as fascinating,

as I'm kind of just, you know, appearing. But they are, you know, they are as midwestern as they come.

I mean, they, like I said, and, you know, obviously, I live in New York, but I know, you know,

where Rockford is on the border. I mean, they were, their office were centered in Madison,

you know, Canada, Canada, you know, was obviously in Madison. You know, they played, you know,

as many places in Wisconsin as they did in Illinois. So, you know, while they're now, you know,

obviously, the thing that's anonymous with Rockford, they certainly were just usually, you know,

could be the Wisconsin band. And then I think that also at the time, that don't but I said it,

that they were accused of kind of not claiming Rockford, you know, but Rockford obviously wasn't,

you know, the greatest place to a lot of people, so that may have also been something that, you know,

that, you know, worked for against them. Well, I'll tell you Rockford has always produced many bands

that we actually play right here on Maxing Radio. They've always been kind of a hotbed

of local music down there to me. So, you know, Rockford, Madison, Milwaukee, that's a great area.

Yeah, I mean, there was obviously an entire culture, you know, band, like an off-roadway. And,

you know, they, I mean, absolutely, I mean, it was, it was funny, like I said, you know, I mentioned them,

obviously being at Deadhead, along as well as the Cheap Trick fan that, yeah, I kind of think of

all those bars very much kind of like, you know, at the ballrooms of 60s in San Francisco, you know,

to take replace, you know, acid, you know, and electrocullid with, you know, just like, you know,

the, you know, the five cent piers and just kind of the, you know, the Rockford Rock fans of the Midwest.

But yeah, they, I mean, yeah, they were, they were the ones that made it, you know,

kind of the same way that you know, Springsteen was the one that made it at the Jersey. But yeah,

there's definitely an entire kind of scene that, you know, just there.

Where can we find your new book, American Standard Cheap Trick from the bars to the Budacan

and beyond? You could find it actually everywhere. It'll be, um, on, uh, it will be in bookstores,

it'll be on, um, uh, it's on Amazon, it's on every retailer, uh, it will be anywhere where books

are sold. Um, that's awesome. So, uh, paperback or hardback. Yeah, it's always on Tuesday,

which ironically, um, is when Pearl Jam will be at Madison Square Garden. And, uh,

I'm actually going to go to the show. But yeah, Mike McCreedy wrote the forward, which I would

love to tell you is because, uh, you know, I have a close relationship with Mike McCreedy or

remembers Pearl Jam. But really was because, you know, much like Jeff A. Man who wrote the, um,

forward to Brian's book or, you know, Billy Jerome Strong or there's so many people that, you

know, love, love Cheap Trick. But I mean, Mike McCreedy is a, he achieved Rick's Superfan. So,

that I think was really, obviously, but it's for him to, uh, do this contribution.

Well, that's awesome. Well, you've done Grateful Dead, now Cheap Trick. What's next for Ross Warner,

Ruby Star? Yeah, I don't know, um, like I said, there, I mean, there is definitely, I did enough

research for, certainly a second Cheap Trick book. I mean, it's like the progressive ads,

Dr. Rick, where, you know, he tells people that they want to become their parents. You don't

have to print the internet. I definitely print the internet. I have folders and folders of all

sorts of, uh, materials. So I mean, I certainly could do a second book on Cheap Trick and I,

depending on how this, you know, is received, I know, you know, they're obviously, say,

you have a fanatic fan base, but I guess, obviously, really depend on whether the, you know,

the, uh, the average fan, you know, picks it up, um, or I may consider doing a follow up to my

first book, Drunk on Sunday, uh, which like I said, it's fictionalized, but it is pretty much

me and, uh, do like sequel to that, which would be a home over on Monday, which would be more about

having, you know, a second side of the conversation to, um, yes, it was actually because you guys are

with content. It's actually a takeoff on great dish, beef book, mean on Sunday. That's where I

got the idea for the test. Oh, wow. Um, so it would be possibly a home over on Monday at some

point. So what, you know, we'll see, I mean, obviously with the dead, there's so many great writers

that cover that. I mean, my thinking at the time that Cheap Trick was they were a band that,

you know, uh, this is the four-borrowing's book. Um, I don't even remember if I knew about Doug

Brood, uh, they seemed just a little weird. So Robert Lawson's book, still competition, and then

even now out of print, uh, book, reputation as a fragile thing, we're the only two that have been

written. So that, I, that's what I thought, no, we'll make this band. You know, there's like a

biography, which is getting into it, uh, obviously realizing how much there was a difference between

the perception of them versus, um, the reality. And, and again, I mean, a lot of the stuff that they

continue to say, which I certainly get into the book, especially about Bluticon, and about,

you know, I want you to want me to play it, or the very last second, uh, kind of in a

lark. I mean, that, that lately isn't true. They played it the show before and went around

house, and, you know, they had intended to play it. I mean, can Adam Annie, you know, shouldn't

we, um, you know, the letter they wrote to the promoter that I talk about in the book that you

know, talked about, you know, these are the songs we're gonna play. So I get why the story, um,

you know, is needed because it was such a, a random thing for them, um, especially, you know,

when the studio version they did with Tom Wormman was so kind of docile about comparison. But,

of course, in another weird cheap trick, uh, you know, irony, you know, if there hadn't been that

cheesy, you know, crying, crying, crying, crying on the studio album, Japanese girls wouldn't

have picked it up and sent it back to them. And, you know, for a lot of people, that is

still what cheap trick. Yeah. Uh, popters up. Well, Ross, thank you so much for coming on

Mexican radio to tell us all about your new book. We really appreciate it.

Go ahead. No, I'm saying that's been, you didn't you've been that, you know, I mean,

I'm very driven by my head too. If what you call it off the space, you know, all the, all the

pleasures on the side of the table. All right. Thanks, Ross. Well, let's get back to 1979 from

cheap tricks hit album Dream Police. This is the house is rocking. This is Mexican radio. We are local music.