Transcript
Joel Brennan on Running for Wisconsin Governor: Healthcare, Housing, and Why He Jumped In Late
The Dr. Kristin Lyerly Show · Sat Apr 18, 2026
it's about experience, it's about vision, it's about temperament, and it's about surrounding yourself with the right people.
And I, you know, again, people who are listening might get sick of it, but I have been about relationships more than I have been about accomplishment, or about ideology, or almost anything else in my life.
And I think in order to get things done, you need to be someone who cares about other people.
And I think even now, like,
If we can get away from demonizing each other and making politics blood sport, I will stand passionately on my issues, but I'm not going to take things personally.
And I would use the executive office and the authority of the office to have real relationships with people.
And I think that that's the only way you can do it.
And I go back to something I said, that's the antidote.
for what we have seen and the divisiveness is to really be human to each other and not make this about vengeance and
grievance.
Who are you?
I'm just somebody you're helping to know people all around the state.
But who I am, I'm the 10th of 11 kids.
I'm somebody whose family has been in Wisconsin for five generations.
My wife and I have two kids of our own.
We talked before we came on the air.
We're on April 13th here.
My son's birthday is tomorrow on 414.
So as of tomorrow, I'll have a 19 and a 20-year-old, both of whom are in college.
And I'm somebody who's been around, and my career has been about the last 25 years trying to be a problem solver.
I served, and we'll talk more about this probably, but I served as the top appointed official in Governor Evers' cabinet for three years.
I live in southeastern Wisconsin.
I've got connections.
all around the state.
And in the last week, I think I've been in 10 counties.
I've had meaningful stops in about 10 counties in Wisconsin.
So I'm somebody who I hope knows something about the state, but I'm getting to know something more about it with each and every passing week of this campaign.
We loved having you up here in Watoma, and I think you're in Washara and Brown and Dor.
I mean you have really been making the rounds, but I want to go back to something you said.
You just it just kind of rolled out of your mouth.
I am the 10th of 11 children.
That's unusual and unique.
You grew up in this pack.
How did that form the way that you lead, the way that you live your life?
I mean, that is a really unusual upbringing these days.
it is I mean it is less yeah it happens almost never now but in my parents generation my parents were born in 1927 in 1928 they were products of the depression and then you know my dad enlisted in the army went to school on the GI Bill and they kind of came of age in the 50s and the 60s where there were lots of families that had you know a whole bunch of kids in those days that like it never happens now but it wasn't that uncommon and and I'll tell you what the
thing that formed me the most about it and it probably is going to be till my dying breath is that relationships to me won't mean more than almost anything else I'm 55 years old still trying to figure out what I'm good at I'm looking for a new job here but but I do know that in my life the thing that has been the core of everything I've ever done is around relationships and I was the second youngest of all those kids and I've inherited relationships from others in my family some of the deepest richest things in
my life were because of people I got to know through my older brothers and sisters.
And there are nine of us left.
We've lost two, our parents passed away, my dad at an early age, my mom about 12 years ago.
And the bad thing for me running for office, there's only one of my siblings who lives in the state of Wisconsin.
And everybody else is everywhere around the country.
But every other Sunday, we meet via Zoom.
We started doing that during COVID, and we keep doing it.
And they are as invested in this as I am.
And luckily, there are nieces and nephews who are part of this and extended family.
But really, it is the biggest thing about it is that relationships.
mean everything to me and my life has been enriched by and I wouldn't have any clue about how I would go about doing this.
I may not be the best known candidate but I have a shot at doing this in some ways because of connections I have made starting with those in my family.
The last thing I'll say about that is I was the last candidate to join in with I think as a seven or eight person race for governor.
I know what it's like to be the last one to arrive at the table.
I'm the 10th of 11 so I kind of know what it's like to
to elbow my way, and usually it was to the dinner table, and know how to work my way around a crowd.
Yeah, it sounds like you do.
And you mentioned you are seeking a new job, but you had a really cool old job.
You were at Discovery World, both states' largest science museum for 11 years.
How did you end up there?
Well, there's a guy the the main person who was responsible for the original funding of discoverers a guy named Mike cut a hay who was an entrepreneur Mike passed away a few years ago, but he had created a company called market electronics He I think he bought parts of it from GE ended up many years later selling it back to GE for a lot more and made a whole bunch of money and then was a philanthropist who was Spent the rest of his life just doing good things
around Wisconsin like giving it away and and he had been when I was I was working for the city of Milwaukee doing real estate development for Tom Barrett who was the mayor at the time and my connections to Tom go back a long way he dated one of my older sisters when when they were in school so like you want to talk about relationships there's one but but I like I didn't know Mike Cudahay who was starting this new project I knew that I had an interest in going out and running something and I interviewed with Mike four or five
and he had me go talk to a few other people.
I think to be honest, he offered the job to somebody else who didn't take it.
And then he offered it to me and I was there for a decade.
And it was one of the great experiences of my life, getting young people engaged in STEM education, creating summer camps, trying to expand opportunities for learning, for people in those science disciplines, but also just kind of creating problem solvers and taking an organization.
Like I took over that.
In 2007, if you remember, 2008, the bottom fell out and the economy.
And we had to, on my one year anniversary, I think we had to, everybody had to take a pay cut.
We had to lay off some people.
Like this is what we all lived in, lived through during that time.
But by the time I left, we had created about a $15 million expansion, kind of re-imagined some of the spaces.
And it's doing better now than it ever has.
It may have better leadership now than it did then, but it certainly is doing better.
financially than it ever has and in the post COVID world.
Every museum, you know every cultural center went through all of those challenges has come out the other end and they're really doing well And so it's part of my career that I'm really proud of and the people who I worked with there and people who I had the opportunity to work with on the board and in the community like again It does ultimately it comes back to those relationships that have enriched me and enriched my the community and that's part of what Discovery World's about
It sure does come back to those relationships.
And can I just as the mom of four boys say thank you for Discovery World?
Because that it was a place where we could go and the kids could just do their thing and we could take a little bit of a break.
that I had growing up at that time like that was the place we do birthday parties and you know there were concerts during the summer it was a great place to hang up now my son at some point when he was not that old said you know this is kind of cool but can you get a job running the zoo because he wanted to like go see all the animals and stuff so I couldn't do both I had there were business responsibilities that were part of this as well
You had to choose.
And after you were at Discovery World, you chose.
You got tapped on the shoulder and Governor Evers said, come and join my cabinet.
Be my top cabinet official.
Be the secretary of the Department of Administration.
Most people are not very familiar with that office, but it is a really big deal.
It's a lot.
It's busy.
Why does running that office?
Prepare you to be the governor in a way that maybe a legislator or somebody else in the executive range doesn't really get.
Yeah, well and and you know everybody brings a different lived experience and career experience to what they're doing here and there are people who have been in the legislature There are people who have had you know lieutenant governor experience that the job that I had as the secretary of administration really is an extension of the governor's office You have the responsibility over the state budget over procurement over human resources for 35,000 people around the state information technology all the buildings and grounds and real estate the relationship
with the Native American tribe because we regulate all the Native American gaming so you know relationships with local units of government like all of that I'd like to think you know none of us know how we're going to act once we sit in that chair no nobody can say this is the kind of governor I will be until you're sitting there and you're making those decisions but but I do feel like I have been in a role that gave me access to all the breadth of information and the breadth of issues that you have to deal with
governor and and that's a good proving ground and I think we had some success there that when when we were there we created to that point the largest surplus in state history we grew a rainy day fund by about 10x and got to the point about where it is now and then we had to lead through COVID and I'll tell you you know I was never prouder of being a public employee and working alongside people who were doing their work as public employees than during COVID because there were farmers who needed our help
There were small businesses, some small businesses, like I said, like Discovery World, the cultural institutions, restaurants, movie theaters, all of those places that relied on people coming to them, they were all closed and they were in danger of closing themselves and not being able to open their doors.
People who couldn't keep a roof over their heads because they couldn't make rental payments.
And we use...
the resources that we got from the federal government, we had, you know, there was a time where there was connection between federal and state that's frankly better than what it is now.
And we were able to demonstrate that government actually can be a tool to help people.
And we didn't do everything right by any means, but we were able to deliver those services.
And I'll tell you, in the time of Trump and in the time of the...
dysfunction and division and chaos.
If there's an antidote, I knew it then and I see it now.
If there's an antidote to the Trump era, it's make government work for people.
Demonstrate that when you, when it is needed, when there's absolutely no other, you know, when it's the last resort, you can deliver for people and people can believe in that.
And I think that's one of the things, again, you want to know why I want to do this job or why I think I can do this job.
I have seen that work and that's important.
to people.
And while, you know, there's a hundred other issues that I'm going to have to deal with if I end up being governor, I hope that for all of our sakes, we have another 100 years or 95 years to wait for another experience like COVID.
But we will at least have learned those lessons.
There was no playbook for how we were going to deal with it then.
And I think we learned a lot of lessons that are still useful.
They're useful to deploy during time of crisis.
But it's also how you should operate during regular times, although I shouldn't say regular time.
I don't think we live in regular or normal times now.
We do not.
We do not.
You were there for three years and you saw a lot of things.
You know, like you said, it was it was COVID.
It was there was no playbook.
You had to figure it out as you went.
What kind of unfinished business did you leave behind?
And with the experience that you have gained from having been in that role, where do you go from here?
Like, what's your vision?
Well, I'll tell you that the thing that is Incredibly different than what I did there is the context that we're in now You know the legislature I helped the governor put together two budgets the first two budgets that he introduced when he was in his first term and I can tell you there's quite literally like a couple thousand decisions you make in order to put together that and it's it's not only
a document that's about financial resources.
It's about vision.
It's about values.
And we did all that.
The governor would make his speech to the legislature, and the legislature would take that very politely, go and throw it in the garbage can because they had such a big majority that they really didn't need the executive branch to be part of those conversations until the governor came at the end with a powerful line item veto and could make whatever changes he could.
tell you my vision or at least what's different about the time of Tony Evers in the last eight years and really his gift to Wisconsin is leaving us with a legislature and an executive branch that are required to work together.
That there is going to be the opportunity, the necessity for us to do things together in order to get something done and I think that he couldn't leave a better gift to us and that's in some ways because relationships have been important in every job I've ever
done because I've been a decision maker and because it's been about how do I roll up my sleeves and work with others and sometimes leave ego at the door and sometimes put aside you know while I'm a proud progressive where we need to can you know where do we all give a little bit in order to get to a better place you know if
People are angry out in the world right now for lots of different reasons.
But again, maybe this is because I was in enough fights with brothers and sisters where I was on the receiving end.
Being angry has never been about trying to get even.
It's about how do we get something done?
How do we go forward?
How do we get to a place that's better than we have now?
And I think that's what we...
deserve what people in Wisconsin deserve, what they're waiting for a delivery on from government.
And the fair maps that we have and the opportunities that are available to actually make changes in people's lives, those are real, more real than they have been in the last 15 years.
You know, elections always have consequence.
We are still in Wisconsin.
paying for, in my view, paying the consequence of the 2010 elections, where Scott Walker was elected, the right-wing legislature, Act 10, the gerrymandered maps.
We are still just coming out of that.
And if you ask me what my vision is, I'd like to have somebody look back in 2040 and say, in 2026, we finally turned the page from what had happened in the generation before, and we led Wisconsin towards better health care, better housing opportunities, more investment in public
public education and a different way of doing things where people could respect each other again, where there could be conversation, where it's not just about blood sport when it comes to politics.
And I'm not naive.
I've spent a career around a lot of these things.
But if it's just about, if we're trying to use government as vengeance and grievance, we have a terrible example of that.
at the federal level and what we have seen in now almost one and a half Trump terms.
And now we can move on.
Wisconsin can be a leader and show that there are different ways of doing this.
There still is the way that we can be a leader in the way that Wisconsin has been on so many things during the course of our history.
A couple times there, I heard you dip back into relationships and really that is where it is.
You know, we're so polarized right now and we need to bring it back to working together for the good of the people.
So I have a spicy question for you.
I asked you this the other day when we were chatting on the phone.
Wisconsin has never not elected a white guy to serve as governor.
And you are the only white guy in this democratic primary field.
Do you think that's an asset, a liability, or something that we're just not supposed to talk about?
No, I don't think that it's something we're not supposed to talk about because I think everybody brings a different lived experience to this and everybody brings different qualifications.
I am somebody, I hope we get to a point in Wisconsin, in America, and maybe this is a step towards it where we actually can just choose and it could be based on vision, it's based on how hard you work, based on qualifications.
I don't think we're there yet.
And I think we need advocates who look like every part of what makes Wisconsin rich.
You know, we need demographic.
We need there to be a whole bunch of diversity demographically.
We need to do it regionally.
We need to do it by gender, like all of those things.
And I have in the course of my life been able to do work that provides opportunity for a whole host of people.
And like that is what I
bring to us there will be people who choose and they're all there always are in elections where they choose because of one issue and that issue might be gender it might be you know ethnicity it might be an issue like you have all of those things I'd like to get to a point and I think Wisconsin has a sophisticated electorate where it's about all of those things and I think this is a proving ground for that but you know I hope I told you this the other day and I would say that's not
My reason for running my reason for running is around qualification.
It's around vision.
It's around the ability to do the job on day one.
I think I can win the job.
I think I can expand the electorate because of some of the work I've done in working with business and government and the nonprofit sector.
You know, I think that provides a good foil when you get to a general election.
And if we're going to really change in Wisconsin, we need not only to carry the at the top of the ticket with the governor, but we need to make sure that we
we win those three or four seats in the state Senate that we have the opportunity to and a handful in the state assembly where we can truly make change.
But it is absolutely an issue that I should be addressing because I grew up with seven sisters.
If I haven't been affected by females in my life, my wife and my daughter are right there alongside me every day, I'd like to think that the work that I have done has been about expanding,
you know, one of the things where we did at Discovery World is, you know, and you're probably going to know this from your own STEM background, we would do summer camps on robotics and engineering.
And if we let the market decide on our own, it would be 18 girls or 18 boys and two girls probably.
Like that's what we would do back in the, you know, 2010, 2011.
So we created all girls robotics and electronics camps and there we would fill up.
And so, you know,
We even there could recognize that when given an opportunity, the young women wanted that access to STEM, wanted the ability to do that, and we were able to provide that.
That's part of who my DNA is.
I don't look like that.
I don't look like everybody else.
I don't look like everybody else in this race.
I think that's a richness that Wisconsin has to provide.
And I'd like to think that's what I would be and that's what I would demonstrate as governor.
I love that answer, the richness, because when I look at the field, I'm like, is this really Wisconsin?
This is so exciting.
I can't wait to see how this field coalesces.
And I feel really privileged to be having conversations with you and all of the other candidates.
So people can make that decision based on the issues, the things that they care about, not just one person.
you know white guy white girl whatever it's it's got to be about the issues and i think the biggest issue in this cycle is going to be health care everybody is struggling to access health care whether it's the cost or getting your drugs or even just getting to the doctor because we just don't have enough providers
One of the things that you've mentioned as part of your priorities is Medicaid expansion.
Governor Evers tried to expand Medicaid for eight years, couldn't get it through with the Republican legislature.
What makes you think that this can happen?
What's your strategy?
Well, I mean it's really as I said the gift that Governor Evers is leaving to us of a legislature that doesn't isn't dominated by Republicans Robin Voss single-handedly in some ways stood against this It's something that has been broadly popular now that the qualification I put on that is so if we have a few more allies in the legislature I think we can get that done You know, it's not as attractive as it would have been just a few years ago You know Donald Trump has made it much more challenging if Scott Walker had
done this in 2014 when we had the opportunity, that's two and a half billion dollars that we have spent of state money to cover our own people and to expand access.
At the same time as federal taxpayers, we have been paying to cover people in Minnesota, in Iowa, in Alabama, and every other state, up to 40 more states.
And so the one challenge is that I think things are fraught in Medicaid much more than they have been, taking 800
million dollars out of it for the next decade to pay for tax cuts for the rich.
The fact that last week, the president said he's introducing a budget that increases military spending by $1.4 trillion by 40%.
And that means because we're waging war, we can't afford to pay for childcare or Medicaid or Medicare.
Like, that's not Wisconsin or even American values.
I know I'm making you mad just by saying these things.
Like, that means we better be able to control what we can control.
Like, there are things that could be done at the federal level.
You could put a cap on the cost of insulin at the federal level.
If we can't do that at the federal level, you know, there's been legislation that's been proposed to cap it at 30 or $35 a month in Wisconsin.
Those are things we can start to do.
I learned last week about a pharmacy, a private pharmacy, a small pharmacy closing in Vilas County, where, you know, for 100
100 years it had been open the same family.
I think they're the Thompson family.
I remember the name because it's, you know, Governor Thompson, no relation, but but the same name.
They wanted to get to operating this for 40 years and they're just a couple of years away, but they closed because they were as busy as they ever have been.
But filling prescriptions because of like pharmacy benefit managers and the hidden costs of that like they were.
It was costing them every time that they filled a prescription.
Are we better off in Wisconsin because that family that had.
seen generation after generation after generation come and fill their prescriptions in Eagle River and Land O'Lakes.
Are we better off because they're gone now?
Hell no.
This is what we are doing all over the state and I think we have to make sure that we're increasing access, we're lowering costs, we're increasing the pipeline because part of the challenge you know is we're getting older as a state, there are demographic changes and we're going to need 4,000 nurses a year and 3,000 primary care docs in the next decade.
Those are things that we better be able to do and so there's pillars of a plan that I have put together
In addition to that, the last thing being because all of us, no one has been unchanged by what the last decade has meant in America and certainly what the last six years after COVID.
So making mental health part of the basic health care for everybody in our state, both in how it's treated, but then how it's delivered.
We're one of the last states that still does that, mainly on a.
county by county basis, and there's inefficiency there.
So there's lots of challenges for us to face, but I agree with you that health care is absolutely where it's at.
I made a few calls in the last few days to successful candidates who ran last week, who were endorsed by the Democratic Party, and some of them, frankly, who lost, too.
So those who stick their neck out ought to be thanked by us.
I don't know lots of these people, but I'm just gonna say, hey, this is who we should be, and I appreciate you doing it.
I talked to a guy today in Barron County.
He found out today he won because they had tied, and there was a coin flip.
And the person got to use the coin flip, and she chose the wrong way, and so he gets the job.
But he was telling me about a clinic that's his closing and losing providers in Rice Lake.
No matter where you're going around the state, this is an issue that we're going to have to deal with.
Rice Lake, Wapaka, where you just heard Manitowoc.
where your
from, all of these places have lost their obstetrical coverage.
We've lost over half of our rural obstetrical units in the last 20 years, which takes me to my next question, and you knew this was coming.
You have said abortion is healthcare.
Here in Wisconsin, we still have a law from 1849 that's one year younger than the state itself that is on the books that could rear its ugly head again.
Do you support full repeal of this 1849 criminal abortion ban?
And if so, what's the legislative strategy to get there?
Because of the gains we have made in the state supreme court, we've been able to give some clarity to something.
The worst thing isn't that there is terrible stuff out there.
The worst thing is when things are unclear and there is so much around.
health care and around women's health and maternal health that has been unclear for so long.
So absolutely, we should take that off the books and not rely on just the judiciary.
We need to do things legislatively as well.
And the best strategy for that is a few more allies in the legislature who can support a Democratic governor on this issue.
But there are other things too.
We still have a whole host of issues around telemedicine related to women.
health and abortion.
There are waiting periods.
There's mandatory ultrasounds and other things like we can start to make some of those strides but you also just said for yourself like the overall focus on maternal health and women's health.
I told you I think when we chatted I have a sister who's an OBGYN who practices in northern Illinois.
She came up to Green Bay with me a month ago.
She took a couple days off to drive me.
I hope the Packer fans will
you know, we'll excuse the fact that most of the 12,000 babies she's delivered over 30 years are probably bear fans, but, you know, I can't be perfect.
But as she drove me to Green Bay and then we drove across the state to La Crosse for another event, we were talking like when I started in state government, there were 20 counties that didn't have a practicing OBGYN.
I think it's like 26 now.
You know, we're headed in the wrong direction and that's not just around, you know, providers and care
abortion or you know I mean it is the whole gamut of women's health from prenatal to having a baby to post to maternal care and and what that means for family planning and contraception like all of those things that are basic health rights are put at risk and put in danger by the structure and the infrastructure the lack of it that we have in Wisconsin and we need to make sure there's certainty around those things we need to make sure that there are resources committed to those things and
And like that to me is just, you started by saying it's basic health care.
And that's what we need to deliver as Wisconsin.
I keep thinking about the postpartum Medicaid extension and how we were the 49th state to make sure that new moms would have access to health care.
And that is not Wisconsin.
And the fact that we've got this legislature right now that allowed this to happen and said, you know, we want you to have babies, no abortions, but we're not going to make sure that you can be well taken care of.
It's just, it's heartbreaking.
But when we have statistics around, you know, maternal health, birth maternal health that are worse than some third-world nations, you know, in some places around Wisconsin.
It's like in my home community of Milwaukee and, you know, young women of color have, you know, much worse outcomes than lots of others.
And, you know, like, that's an area where we need focus.
We need, you know, to be compassionate in the way that we provide that care.
But also, it comes
down to resources, and it comes down to making sure that the infrastructure is in place for us to be the Wisconsin that we want to be.
You just tapped into the fact that it is Black Maternal Health Week, and we are spending time this week acknowledging that black women are three times more likely to die as a result of their pregnancy than white women.
And in Wisconsin, it actually could be significantly worse.
So we've got work to do there.
But we also have work to do when it comes to
housing.
And I heard you say that the average age of a first-time home buyer in Wisconsin has gone from 33 to 40 in just five years.
Is that true?
It is, and I'll tell you, going back even three decades before that, in 1990, I was a sophomore in college, so I wasn't yet thinking about buying a home, but in 1990, it was 28.
So between 1990 and 2020, that three decade period, it went up five years.
In the last five years, it went up by another seven years.
We're taking that...
aspect of the American dream, what makes community strong, what makes, you know, schools stronger, gives employers an opportunity to build their company.
We're taking it and putting it out of reach for a whole generation.
And so, you know, there are a number of things we can do in and around the Greenberry, and it's not just home ownership either.
It's renters who are spending a much more significant portion of their rent, you know, of their income on their rent.
Like, it doesn't allow you or afford you the
chance to grow in your community as the way you want.
And so there are a couple things I have proposed.
One, we should build more entry-level housing all around the state.
But we're about 70,000 entry-level homes short of where we should be.
Over the next four years, which would be an acceleration of what's happened over the last four, almost a doubling, we should try to put out 100,000 new entry-level homes.
A lot of that is controlled at the local level because there needs
to be builders who are doing it.
But we are still, in addition to having been a leader, we used to be a place or we're still a place that builds stuff.
We make things.
And so having and putting down a flag and saying, we're going to do this is something we should do.
There's one other thing about the.
where the marketplace is now, in that young families who are trying to get in and buy homes, they are stuck because there isn't a lot of supply for them.
At the other end, you have older adults who have been in their homes for a long time who are not getting out.
They're probably living with three or four bedrooms when they don't need that anymore.
But if you think about it, they probably have a 3% mortgage, like I do, like my wife and I do.
if they moved out and moved into a smaller place it'd be a six and a half for a seven percent mortgage because that's what we're getting now and so what I have said is that again I'm into simple solutions if we can for some of these complex problems.
WEDA, the Wisconsin Housing and Economic Development Authority, they can issue their own mortgages and what I have suggested is that if you qualify as a first-time home buyer, meet a certain level of criteria, you can qualify for a three percent mortgage at that end.
On the other end, if you're trying to get out of your
home and you've been there for a long time, you can qualify for a 3% mortgage as well.
And so, you know, you're opening up some of that supply for young families.
And the benefits of that to communities over the course of the next generation are obvious because those are kids who are going to be going to those schools.
Those are employers who can stay here instead of having to employees instead of having to move elsewhere around the state.
So like, again, and that's one of many solutions.
We can provide more for down payment assistance.
You know, there are great or
organizations around the state that pre-qualify or get people ready to own homes.
We should be doing all those things, but there are resources.
that the state has its disposal and we should make sure that we're pushing those levers.
And if there's one thing that I think I can offer, having been in the executive branch and having had exposure to most of these issues, I'd like to think I know where some of those things are.
Where are some of those levers that we can pull and things that we can push to do things differently than the way they have been done in the past?
That's sometimes the hardest thing is making those connections.
The resources are there.
The need is there.
It's just making the connections and ensuring that the people who need the resources can get them.
them, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay, you mentioned education.
We all know that Wisconsin's school funding formula is broken.
It's old school, it is not working for us right now, but it's also a tough fight.
You know, this is where school vouchers really got a toehold and we have a very complicated school funding situation right now.
Is that a fight you're gonna take on?
So, you know, you mentioned that school funding formula.
I was in Eau Claire last week, and about six weeks ago, there was a suit filed by parents, by administrators, by school districts to try to get that funding formula declared unconstitutional.
It's been around since 1993.
It wasn't set up for the long term, wasn't even set up for more than a couple years, and it has never worked well for us.
It was a snapshot in time that was not made.
made for that era, and it sure doesn't work now.
And so if that is successful, it'll work its way through the courts.
And ultimately, two or three years from now, potentially, the state Supreme Court would rule on that.
And if they did, and I think, again, I'm not a lawyer, so that's for somebody else in the judiciary to decide.
But if they did, they would say, hey, here's the remedies.
We can appoint a special master who will then develop a formula that passes constitutional muster or governor.
and legislature, you go and fix this.
You go and do what you're supposed to do.
And to my way of thinking, why wait three years?
What part of the state can wait another three years?
We just had 60 operational referenda.
I was in Hustisford.
several weeks ago, they're looking to be the first school district to dissolve now because they had another failed referendum.
And things are changing at the local level, but kids don't have the time to wait.
And I think we can, with a couple more allies in the legislature, it's not going to be easy because Wisconsin's formula is one of one in the country.
But there are other states, Colorado, being an example where a few years ago, they said, every kid who's in a public school is worth this.
If you're an English-language
learner, you get this.
If you have ESL, if you have IEP, if you're in a place with rural poverty, you can do that.
You can build formulas that are made around the kid as opposed to what a district was spending in 1993.
And this is something I think we have an obligation.
It won't be easy.
And I don't know that that's the first thing you can do right out of the gate, because I think we have a limited level of even expertise.
The people who are experts on this formula said they were experts 20 years ago.
Some of them are gone now, and we need to make sure that we get the right people around the table.
I'm not one for putting a blue ribbon commission on every issue, but there was one, I had a report that was one of the few things I got on my desk when I took over as secretary of administration.
It was a blue ribbon bipartisan commission about what we should do around education funding.
That was in 2018.
It's probably time to
update that look at that and then let's get to execution around those things so that we can we stop forcing school districts to keep going to referendum just to keep the lights on like that that is a condemnation of and a failure of Madison when we're doing that we are pushing all those responsibilities and those costs down to the local level and we that that's not worthy of who we are it's not doing right by kids or teachers or parents or families or communities like that's who we've got to
So yes, I will be eagerly take that on.
I will take on assistance from others to do that because it will be one of the most challenging things we can do.
But it is like that is kind of the launching pad for who I think we can be for the next generation.
Well, I can say that my producer and oldest son Abraham, who is a middle school music teacher, is snapping in the background right now because he loves to hear it because it is broken.
And I think regular people do get it.
They see those referendum questions, even if they're not political people who are paying attention.
They see it on the ballot.
They certainly see it in their property tax bills.
They hear people around town talking about it.
It's crazy that we have to go to referendum in so many municipalities, like you said, just to keep the lights on.
But can we talk about something kind of fun?
I have a really important question for you, because you're a fifth generation Wisconsinite.
I'm a sixth generation Wisconsinite, so I've got you beat by one.
great.
OK, here's the question.
The Bucks, the Brewers, and the Packers are all playing on the same day, and they are all killing it.
They're headed to the ultimate everything.
Which game are you going to go to?
Okay, for me, and it's not just because I'm talking to you and you're in Green Bay and the Fox Valley, but the Packers have eight or nine home games a year.
The Bucks have...
41 the brewers have 81 like sorry I got I get I don't get to every game at Lambo but every game I get to Lambo is special so I got opportunities to go to those other places I'm gonna tailgate and and I think I told you this when we were talking the other day I've got a group that I go to at least one a couple you know oftentimes a couple of games a year at Lambo we meet at the same time there are places like in the car where you're supposed to sit everybody's got a job to bring like this is what
tailgating at Lambo Field has been like for generations.
I have my role to play in that and I'm not skipping one of those.
Like just in the car ride up and back for us, you know, my friend has a certain way that he gets himself in, you know, probably makes some other people unhappy when he just gets himself on the exit to get us to where we're going.
We park in the same parking lot near Anduzzi's for the last 20 or 25 years.
Like this is an event and while I will go to
any of those places and I am a sports fan before anything else and I'd love to go to any of those if I could do all three in a day I would but it has to be Lambo.
It has to be Lambo.
I have done a Brewer's and a Bucks game in a day which is easy because you're in Milwaukee but I could not have cited the statistics that you cited the 41 games and the 81 games so kudos that was that was a beautiful answer.
Well, there was a time in college when the NCAA final four game that the final game was being played.
I think I was a senior in college.
So like I was, I kind of was done with college at that point if you get my drift.
But you went to opening day during the day and went to see the NCAA final at night.
Like those kind of tufers are doable and maybe they get less memorable as the day goes on if you get my drift, especially if you're 22.
Less
memorable.
Okay, one more fun question for you.
Again, you are a Wisconsinite and you love Wisconsin, so you're trying to bring somebody into Wisconsin, but all you have to do it, you have three things.
You've got a place, you've got an activity, and you've got a food.
You can use those three things to entice this person to come to Wisconsin.
Which three things are they?
Your place, your activity, and your food.
I
mean, it would be because Wisconsin, you know, Minnesota may have their 10,000 lakes, but I know from my time working with the secretaries of tourism that I did that we've got more.
We've got more!
it would be a waterside location anywhere and the food would have to be Wisconsin fish and and I'll tell you you know again maybe this is my uh my own upbringing but it would be a family reunion or a family wedding or so like there is something I'm sorry to bring it back to relationship but Wisconsin is a relationship based place and and having somebody from the outside come in and see what you do or how you do things in your own family my wife
is one of two kids in her family.
She was overwhelmed to move in and marry into a family that's as large as mine, but like that is also a special thing.
Anybody who gets an entree into that is getting a true Wisconsin experience.
Now, in my family would only be five generations, you know, for you.
I don't think either one of us have those, you know, many people from those really generations long past who are still around, but they all live through it.
I'm a cribbage player.
A cribbage game would break out on that water side because I've been playing it for 50 years.
I learned from my dad.
I passed it along to my son.
Our family plays.
Everybody plays.
These are the types of things you get to see when you step in and you have that kind of an experience with a family.
Cribbage, Uker, you name it.
My sister brought, I have one sister and she brought the cherry tort that my mom used to always make back in the 70s with the graham crackers on the bottom and then the cool whip and then the cherry that comes out of a can on top and we were just gathered around it like so excited because it brings back all those memories of the time we spent with our family and you know it was always a potluck and your cousins were always there and yeah you're right, those are fond memories.
My late grandmother's apple pie is something that all of my sisters at some point have tried to replicate.
She also had a cookie jar in her kitchen that was shaped like a strawberry.
There was the green thing on top, which is like the stem to take it off.
And somebody got that.
I think my sister got that when my grandmother passed.
Those types of things, the recipes that you get, the things that we remember when we were five or six, that now when we have kids and grandkids,
who have that age, like those are things to pass along and to cherish.
Thanks for stoking some of those memories for me even on the
call.
I'm going to go make some of Grandma Savile's monster cookies in just a couple minutes here, but first I have one more question for you.
So when you look at Wisconsin in these interesting times in this state, which is always one of the most politically interesting swing states, what is it about
You, not your policies, not your experience, but you as a person that makes you the right person for this moment.
Well, I hope that I meet the moment, but to be honest, there's six million people in the state and they determine that more than I do.
So you have you and Abe and the people you know have as much power to determine that as I do.
But I do think like being governor is about
it's about experience, it's about vision, it's about temperament, and it's about surrounding yourself with the right people.
And I, again, people who are listening might get sick of it, but I have been about relationships more than I have been about accomplishment, or about ideology, or almost anything else in my life.
And I think in order to get things done, you need to be someone who cares about other people.
And I think even now,
if we can get away from demonizing each other and making politics blood sport.
I will stand passionately on my issues, but I'm not going to take things personally.
And I would use the executive office and the authority of the office to have real relationships with people.
And I think that that's the only way you can do it.
And I go back to something I said, that's the antidote for what we have seen and the divisiveness is to really be human to each other and not make this about vengeance.
and grievance.
If we're doing this to get even, we lose.
If we're doing it to get ahead, to go forward, which is, I think, still our motto, we haven't changed that, then we can win.
And that's better than where we are now.
It sure is.
And once again, you brought it back to relationships, which is beautiful, and a perfect place to end it.
Joel Brennan, candidate for governor in Wisconsin.
Thanks for taking the time to hang out tonight.
This was a blast.
I'm getting close to the end of the line.
Then we can come back and start talking about issues, because we should probably do just a shorty about.
health care at some
My guess is you will have some probing questions.
And I get before we end and whether this makes it into the thing or not, I appreciate what you have done as a candidate.
I appreciate the organizing you do.
You're a leader nationally when it comes to women's health and health care in general.
And we owe you a debt of gratitude for that.
So thank you.
Well, thank you for saying that, you know, it's teamwork and we love Wisconsinites.
So that's why we do what we do.
all right my friend.
Have a good night.
Thank you All