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It's Monday.
So pal Harvey K, professor emeritus of democracy from the university of Wisconsin, Green Bay joining us for this hour.
Harvey, welcome back, man.
Good to see you.
Thank you.
it's
But unlike Jess, I'm down for the hot weather come July.
Hey, Harvey, it's getting hot in here.
This administration, man, I cannot, it is hard.
We talked about last hour.
We're going to continue to talk about it.
I want to get your impression.
Jeffrey Goldberg from the failing Atlantic.
I mean, if you're in Trump, Trump doesn't know.
I'm an old man.
I'm confused.
Even know what's going on.
I mean, he gets, he gets included on this and this signal invite and talking about military attacks on Yemen, man.
And it's like such bushly amateur hour.
It's hard to even believe it.
And then
I want to play the clip and I get it.
Let's talk about this and get your perspective Harvey Donald Trump asked about this today.
We play last hour Let's play it again.
If you would please Jess here is Donald Trump confronting the what presumably illegal sharing of national security information by the highest levels of his administration Pete Hegseth vice president Vance right not Vance
Uh, not Pence, Vance.
Uh, and, and, and what?
Everyone, everybody was involved.
Let's hear what Trump had to say.
I don't
What?
What
One of the, of course, the obvious ironies, let's call it hypocrisies, that if this were to be, I don't know, call it President Joe Biden, Fox don't call it news and the righties would be losing their fricking minds right now.
But Donald Trump, he knows nothing.
And I heard Fox News earlier today when they started out talking about the immigration lawsuits that are going on.
And finally, about 20 after the hour got to it.
And we're very, well, that's bad.
But, you know, I bet they wish he could take it back.
kind of attitude.
This, this is, this is devastating.
We're talking about JD Vance, we're talking about Tulsi Gabbard, Secretary of the Treasury, Scott Bassent, Dan Katz, Dan Caldwell, Department of Defense, Brian McCormick for the NSC, John Ratcliffe, the CIA, I mean,
It's not great, man.
Oh, and, oh yeah, let's not forget, of course, the most important one, Jeffrey Goldberg.
And for Donald Trump
Look, this is, you know, when I heard this, a young fellow out in California amongst many people were sending me this story.
And I read it and I thought, wait, this is a joke, isn't it?
This is this is a joke.
And then I try to figure out what is Hexeth, what he's the guy who sent it, right?
Hexeth.
I mean, this, I rarely use the word evil, but today I forwarded that piece of information and I, to a bunch of people and I said, evil and stupid.
Okay.
Evil and stupid.
Evil because they are.
stupid because they can't control their evil.
It's like they want to brag about it.
They want to brag about it to the point of jeopardizing national security.
What can we say?
That's Harvey K. Professor emeritus of democracy from the university of Wisconsin, Green Bay.
We're talking about this breaking news, this leak, a leak, an invite, an errant invite sent out to a journalist at the Atlantic.
And I think also Harvey, one of the things that bothered me besides all this, but if you get into like actually looking at some of the texts, J.D.
Vance says, Hey, Pete hates it.
If you think we should do it, let's go.
I just hate bailing Europe out again.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Then Vance goes on to say, let's just make sure our messaging is tight here and if things, uh, and if, and if there are things we can do upfront to minimize risk to Saudi oil facilities, we should do it.
Now, when, when does our national security concerns about the Houthis is all of a sudden an issue with Saudi?
oil facilities.
Is that part of our national interests, Harvey?
He got here be terrible.
Something happened to it.
Now here's Pete Hakes us.
Here's the secretary of defense, right?
I mean, this is, this is the guy, man.
This is the man.
VP, I fully share your loading of European free-loading.
It's all caps.
Pathetic.
There's Pete Hakeseth about our European allies.
But he goes on, but Mike is correct.
We're the only ones on the planet on our side of the ledger who can do this.
Nobody else, even close.
Question is timing.
I feel like now is a good time as any given POTUS directive to reopen shipping lanes.
I think we should go, but POTUS still remains retains 24 hours decision notice.
But he may know what's going on as far as the attack.
He didn't know how they were communicating.
Perhaps now there's an S M. He jumps in here.
Now the Atlantic assumes this is Stephen Miller.
As I heard it, the president was clear green light, but we, but we soon make clear to Egypt and Europe that we expect in return, what we expect in return.
We also need to figure out how to enforce such a requirement.
Ergo, if Europe doesn't renumer, we remove
Renumerate, then what?
If the US successfully restores freedom of navigation at grace costs, there needs to be some further economic gain extracted in return.
Now, what I'm reading there is that we want to get paid for this from what?
From Egypt and Europe.
Pay us.
Remunerate.
Correct.
Thank you.
Thank you, Harvey.
Hey, correct me all the, if I'm ever wrong, it's so rare.
Please, please correct me.
You might throw a pen at you though.
It's just a window.
I'm not actually threatening.
I'm just emphasizing.
Harvey, then one final thing, at least on this topic, and we could take your calls as well, eight, five, five, seven, five, two, four, eight, four, two.
Michael Walls, when this all goes down,
He puts out a couple of emojis in the signal.
Yeah.
Yeah.
One's a fist bump.
Then it's followed immediately by the American flag and then, and then a fire.
Like like this
It's it seems dangerous is exposing obviously exposing secrets and it could be could be could be detrimental now, thankfully this went over to Goldberg at the Atlantic who was it was skeptical as one would be when you're all of a sudden invited into these kinds of things and he didn't in his article put forth or
any of those kinds of details that he received.
And it's been confirmed.
And other folks are saying, Chris Coons, who's in the Senate Intelligence Committee.
And these folks are breaking the law in multiple ways.
But there we go.
That's this administration.
Okay.
So this is back leading up to the first Trump administration.
Steve Bannon basically wanted to emulate Lenin and his advice, I believe, to Trump and others is to smash the state, destroy the state.
And I keep thinking about that.
And when I heard that news today, I thought, you know, it's almost as if the insidiousness has gotten to the point of revealing
our international security secrets as a means by which you can destroy the American government.
I mean, that's how perverse things have gotten.
How he took everything with him down to Mar-a-Lago, man.
Who knows what happened to that stuff?
I have no faith in this president, in this administration.
And obviously, I mean, it's nefarious, certainly if it was purposeful, but even evil and stupid Harvey, I mean, not a great combination.
This is, how does this happen?
And how is not everybody can, you know what I'm saying?
And where, where, I'm, I cannot wait to listen to Fox news.
Don't call it news.
I cannot wait to hear the conservative talk radio folks.
I can't wait to hear the.
Conservative pundits.
Well, how are you gonna spin this?
What what is your what is your defense
Well consider this I during the break I googled Michael waltz Okay, if I've got the right guy.
Yeah, he was a former special he's a former special army special forces officer I Mean, what is that?
What what kind of people are we dealing with here?
I mean the army special forces and then he's sending out
and quote state secrets to uh to failing magazines like the atlantic
uh yeah michael michael walz and as he wrote i assume michael walz in question was president trump's national security advisor i mean this is this is the administration there is no getting around this this is everybody quote the national security leaders these are the leaders
And they were so critical with the Biden administration.
They were so critical, of course, going back to the black guy, of course, the Obama administration, very critical.
But what's the reaction now?
What is the righty reaction now?
Well, I wish I could take it back.
That's what Fox Don't Call It News says.
I wish I could take it back.
I'm with you, man.
If I was a betting man, they're not going to squat.
I mean, they're not going to open an investigation into their own.
I don't believe that for a minute.
But if they were righteous, they absolutely would, man.
You know what I'm saying?
If I believe in X, Y, and Z, and my party or any party or anybody goes against X, Y, and Z, and it can become, it's termed as illegal or unconstitutional or breaking the law because it's not an approved system, what are the cases?
Yeah, man, that's what you do.
That's that's called credibility.
Do you know what I mean?
It's not selling out that buy it in.
That's called following through on the principles by which you were elected on the on the Constitution by which you swore in oath.
Sworn out but doesn't mean anything Harvey.
It doesn't mean anything to these people.
Nothing.
You're right.
Absolutely nothing.
folks, you're listening to the Dom Salvi show.
That's Harvey K eight, five, five, seven, five, two, four, eight, four, two.
Okay.
Real quick before we get to the callers, a ABC news reporting.
And secondly to usha Vance will be part of a delegation traveling to Greenland this week after
Trump's repeated statements that
Cause I mean, Putin can do it.
What can I, I want one too.
The U.S.
has a vested national security interest in the Arctic region, and it should not be a surprise that national security advisor and secretary of energy are visiting a U.S.
space base to get firsthand briefings from our service members on the ground.
The National Security Council spokesperson, Brian Hughes, said in a statement.
Now Greenland's prime minister in a statement called the upcoming visit, quote, very aggressive American pressure against the Greenlandic community and called for an international community to step in to rebuke it.
Making friends everywhere influencing people and making friends.
How are we everywhere?
We go and the old man when presented with these questions doesn't know anything
But killer is email.
Right, man.
For the love of God.
I mean, nobody looked at the CC list of this thing.
And why is this going?
I just mentioned, you know, I talked to her, you can't, you have emojis on a phone call.
But I mean, this is the kind of thing you have a phone call on a secured line to do this stuff, rather than sending an email that you can go anywhere, anywhere, it gets forward to, I mean, I'm trying to keep my mouth, my jaw from dropping down to my chest because this is just such amateur hour stuff.
And nobody noticed this until the guy from the Atlantic actually
He was
Who's that guy?
Who's that guy that's not responding to any of our fun little jokes and are ripping on their European allies and and trying to shake down what Egypt and Europe?
Because if we do something, you know, you guys gotta always remove, remove.
What was the term again, Harvey?
Remunerate.
Remunerate.
Thank you.
We've got to get remunerated.
Back in my day, this is called extortion.
But, you know, it's really fancy when Stephen Miller says it.
Folks, come back with us.
Some good news.
Some great news.
We'll do good news.
Tell us something good at the end of the hour, which we'll always do.
But man, you see the crowds for Bernie and ALC over the weekend.
It is outrageous 15,000 in Phoenix, 30 plus thousand in Colorado.
We're going to go there next with Harvey K. Professor emeritus from the University of Wisconsin Green Bay.
Join us.
Bellas in the back, sweet singers in the front, cruising down the freeway in the hot, hot sun.
Suddenly, red, blue lights flash as from behind.
Loud voice, boom, please, step out onto the line.
Bellas pretty close to comfort, singers as high as their eyes.
Policeman taps the shades, a cellar shabby since denying how bizarre.
And welcome back to the Dom Salvis show eight five five seven five two four eight four two eight five five seven five Civic Harvey K professor emeritus of democracy from the University of Wisconsin Green Bay a friend of ours always love it when Harvey comes around And you know big big fans of FD yarn progressivism and I just noticed that what you you did unlike some Republicans you did a town hall
No.
Were you yelled at?
I mean, how did it go for you and what was that all about?
And these are Zoom town halls.
So I was here and everybody else was all around the world, I suppose.
Anyhow, and I was so thrilled.
I've had a very sizable audience in the past.
for these events.
I had 500 people.
Nice!
Zooming in.
500.
Why?
Because I was talking about how we got into this mess and what history tells us we need to do to get out of it.
And I can tell you, I was really, there's an English word.
Well, it's American, but they use it in English more than I was chuffed.
I mean, I was like, like a bird
And it was great.
And the questions were fabulous.
And people were over and over again wanting to know what we can do in offering their suggestions and wondering how they can get in touch with local labor councils.
I mean, there is something going on.
You and I know what went on over the weekend with Bernie Sanders and AOC.
You can give the numbers.
I mean, it was extraordinary.
One of the clips they had apparently got up to like 1.4 million views that she put out there.
Then as well,
what, another 34,000 in Colorado.
And I guess some folks are saying that could be even more than that.
And, you know, we've been, I've been lamenting over the last couple of weeks, I mean, really, since the Chuck Schumer call in the Senate to go along and get nothing and play ball like everything's normal.
What's going on?
And I think so in my, in this respect, Harvey,
It's not just me, man.
I mean, if you're getting that many people chiming in, if AOC and, and, and Bernie are getting folks showing up to that degree, it seems like there's something in the air.
Thank you.
I'll give you examples around the country.
Okay.
So as you know, I work with this, well, I have worked and I work a bit with this veterans group, progressive veterans group down in Sarasota.
And I had suggested to them.
that they may contact with even the conservative american legion because of what the trump administration is doing to the veterans affairs administration and they did follow through and they said that the response is remarkable and i bet all around the country veterans groups are wondering what can we do and they're making contact with each other that's one
yeah
it's also the case that there are labor councils yesterday one a guy who was calling in from for the zoomed in from from pennsylvania
Western Pennsylvania said that his local Democratic Party and the Labor Council are cooperating.
I mean, there's this kind of activity that's bubbling up.
Even in places where, you know, Trump may well have won the vote last time, things are happening.
I mean, they try to claim that their Trumpsters at some point have said, well, these are paid agents who are showing up at our town halls, you know, to have said things.
But, you know,
They're in trouble.
They're in trouble.
I hope.
I'm sorry.
From my mouth to God's
Well, it seems like it seems the case.
And again, you know, to have
that many people show up, you know, that, that not that long after, after a defeat.
And it wasn't a mandate that the Republicans won by, by any means.
So there's still passion and that's good to see, you know, the leadership, who is it?
Well, it's not Chuck, in my opinion, um, and AOC and Sanders.
And I saw Sanders, uh, Bernie Sanders was getting interviewed, I believe maybe by, by CNN, uh, and, and the interviewer, I forget the
person's name was asking about, Hey, what do you think about, you know, Schumer should Schumer continue on or, you know, something along those lines, Sanders wasn't having any, any, any of it.
Do you want to talk about it?
And he's like, that's inside the belt.
Why stuff?
That's not what this is about.
Basically I'm tired, you know, and that's not what we're doing.
And I still, that's what I'm saying.
And Bernie's out there like this, he's 80, some years old, man, out there.
It doesn't have to do this.
He doesn't have to and he's he's doing an AOC.
Thankfully, she's there too.
And I hope more folks get out there do it when you when you did your your zoom town hall Harvey What to paraphrase summarized for me?
What's the answer?
What does history teach us?
About how we can react in these moments.
Well history, you know, I when I was first becoming a historian and then a political scientist and a sociologist I thought History doesn't tell us exactly what to do, but I've come to the conclusion that there are
understandings of history that can tell us exactly what to do.
So here's the thing, back in 1935, Sinclair Lewis from Minnesota wrote a novel titled It Can't Happen Here, which by the way in the novel he showed that it could happen here.
Well the point is so I asked so I asked I said
Well, why did it not happen in the 1930s?
Because in 1930 to 32, there were quite a few people in this country of prominence who sort of talked about, well, we could really use a Mussolini here in the United States.
The editor-in-chief of Vanity Fair magazine, the American Social Sciences Association.
Yeah, right.
It was in the minds of the elite because they were seriously worried about the possibility of this uprising.
Keep in mind, the veterans of World War.
One, we're marching on Washington to demand an early payment of what was called their veterans bonus.
I mean, things were happening.
Workers were out on the streets in Detroit and in Flint, in places like that, demanding that Ford hire them, that they, you know, on and on, or in the case of Flint, there would have been General Motors.
But the point is, the point is that why did it not happen in the 30s?
Well, I'll tell you why it didn't happen in the 30s because FDR responded.
to working people's anger and anxiety.
And they responded to his promise of a new deal and they elected him president.
And in the early thirties right through the thirties, they radically transformed the United States.
In addition to all of the physical transformations from fighting the dust bowl.
Look, most people can find right in their own hometowns evidence of the new deal.
It might be the post office.
It might be the library, it might be the hospital, the nearby larger town or city.
The New Deal transformed the American landscape, improved the American infrastructure, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
Why did a million farms in the 1930s all of a sudden get electricity?
Because the FDR administration said we can't wait on private companies to provide power to rural areas because they're going to try to do it at a high price.
And they created cooperatives for farmers.
Okay.
Moreover,
They literally helped liberate workers.
Workers wanted power.
They wanted unions and FDR in 33.
But then again, especially in 35, took the advice of Robert Wagner and Bob LaFolla Jr.
here from Wisconsin, and he signed into law the National Labor Relations Act.
And that same year, they signed into law the Social Security Act.
Now, what's the lessons of all of this?
The lessons of all of this is,
To rescue to save the nation the democratic promise of this nation from the likes of Trump Authoritarians and fascists and other want to be billionaires.
Yep The trick is you've got to go Progressive if not radical you've got to enhance American democracy.
You can't wait around hoping that
Americans will say, oh, let's save democracy and vote for a Democrat.
No, the Democrats have to prove themselves.
They have to engage working people and say, engage their aspirations, their anxieties, they have to articulate it, and then they have to move on those things.
I mean, the trick is you mobilize people, not by just saying to them, they're threatening democracy, you mobilize people by showing them how you intend to work with them to enhance American democracy.
That could turn of the century.
There was a writer.
He was a progressive and a populist and a socialist worked for the, for the Tribune in Chicago, I think it was, and a host of progressive newspapers.
And he wrote, he said, the only way we can save the rights that our fathers afforded us is to afford new rights for our kids.
He said, children, but I'm saying kids.
That's the trick.
That's how you do it.
So right now.
If the Democrats can't get it together, let the labor movement step in in its place.
We are desperately in need of an organized progressive force to push the Democratic Party to become the party of Roosevelt.
The Republican Party of Lincoln even would be fabulous, my God.
That's what we need.
Both Lincoln and FDR appreciated if you're going to save the United States and American democratic life, you have to pursue a radical course of action.
In Lincoln's case, responding to working people's anger about the South and slaves' efforts to cross over to the union lines, he signed into law while he issued the Emancipation Proclamation and then supported immediately the idea of an amendment to bring an end to slavery.
FDR.
The National Labor Relations Act, Social Security, fought the dustball in the plain states.
I mean, you got to act.
And the Democrats have abandoned that understanding.
They turned their backs on the FDR tradition and the working class.
And it's got to be turned around again.
We've got to get the Democrats to go progressive.
As FDR said,
Back in 31 to a friend.
It's time.
We make this nation rat fairly radical for at least a generation
That's Harvey K professor emeritus of democracy from the University of Wisconsin at Green Bay before we get to the callers Harvey 8 5 5 7 5 2 4 8 4 2 What was what's it?
What was the engagement was you know voter participation back in the 30s and 40s?
I mean it was I feel like we're disengaged now compared to history, but I have no
Well,
Yeah
So that's first of all and he actually encouraged Americans to write to him and by the way 400,000 Responded it was the most incredible kind of thing.
That's first second Well, he told his cabinet officers to go to go out
and encourage not only workers to organize, but for women, housewives to organize to keep an eye on what business is doing in the midst of the depression.
And they organized from New York to California, including the Dakotas, the first, as the National Magazine called the back of the 30s, the first American housewives movement.
It started among Italian.
and Jewish and black housewives in Manhattan and Brooklyn and the Bronx, and it's spread across the country.
In other words, he was encouraging Americans to organize to not only support the New Deal campaign, the New Deal efforts, but actually to push him further than he would otherwise have gone.
So to engage meant that he literally invited their participation, not only in the laborers of the New Deal, like in the WPA and the, what do you call this?
The civil, what's it called?
Great.
The young people got into civil service.
It was the Civilian Conservation Corps, the Civilian Conservation Corps, which, by the way, transformed.
a lot of southwestern wisconsin fought soil erosion which was a major problem in the southwestern part of this the hilly part of the state of wisconsin but
well okay yes in many ways and and tragically of course in the south blacks and by the way people don't realize this
the poll taxes and the literacy requirements, that kept not only blacks from voting, but in pure numbers, it kept greater numbers of whites from voting.
White sharecroppers, white small farmers, white working class, they didn't get to vote.
But nevertheless, those who could voted for FDR.
They used to hang his picture on the wall in their kitchens.
I mean, it was great.
By the way, in the 30s, families started naming their kids Eleanor and Franklin.
hmm folks are listening to the Dom Salvis show that is Harvey K professor emeritus of democracy from the University of Wisconsin Green Bay are gonna come back and take your calls and we'll talk about whatever topics you have we'll take whatever comments you may want to give but it's the last segment of the day so you also have to offer something good 8 5 5 7 5 2 4 8 4 2 come back with
us
At first we were afraid, we were petrified Kept thinking we could never live without you by our side And we spent so many nights thinking how you did us wrong Now we've banded all together Your tariff made us strong and so you know You're not so great There's not a snowball's chance in hell We'll be your fifty-first
Thank you.
Harvey.
calling us
Yeah, I'm going to start with something good.
you.
I'm actually up to now walking two miles a day here on contest.
I'm up to walking two miles a day now.
About six months ago, it was really hard for me because of my health.
Just like take out the trash and like do basic.
man.
You know household chores.
fantastic.
Congratulations.
Thank you.
Thank you so much for the test and said hey, you need to start walking more.
you
go.
Excellent.
A mile a day and I'm up to two.
Well done.
That's fantastic.
Thank you.
I post a lot on Facebook about the political issues going on and
A lot of the mega supporters, of course, laugh, joke, think this is all just such a big joke, and they try to twist everything every way, you know, shape, form.
How would be the best other than just ignoring them, which I've been pretty much doing?
How would be the best way to talk to someone like that?
Because, I mean, at times, I do want to answer their questions, honestly, to educate someone when they ask a really stupid question.
But then there's other times where it's like, I might as well just be talking to a brick
But in the meantime, in the meantime, I would just come back with them and say, did your family and any of your members of your family serve in the Second World War and vote for not only FDR, but vote for...
Things like social security things like right to your organized unions.
I mean things like just ask them just say by the way Do that.
Oh, hi.
Well, my something good is, you know, I take my dog out on these nice sunny days and we go for a long walk.
So that really helps rejuvenate me.
Yeah.
And get me back.
But the question I really had was for Harvey.
I wanted to know Harvey.
My husband was a lifetime member of the VSW in Madison.
And, you know, a lot of the guys that are there are pretty strong supporters of the person that inhabit the White House right now.
So how can you get
what I like to do is kind of have a listening session with them to figure out how they can change their paradigm.
Well, first you might want to start by asking them how do they feel about the cuts to the Veterans Administration?
Right.
That's the first thing.
And if they say they don't care, then you can only imagine that they have very high priced
and can afford very high priced healthcare on their own, which I find hard to believe, but that would be the vehicle I would use.
That's the vehicle that my veteran comrades down in Sarasota, Florida are using.
Well, I have all good things
right.
One, I am a proud Franklin Delano Roosevelt Democrat.
Yes.
Um, second for that gentleman that called in, you might want to ask, can we agree at least on the fact that we need to get all money out of politics and all lobbyists out of politics?
That might be a good question that you could both agree upon.
Um, also, um, I am down to, uh, 13.9% body fat.
yeah.
And walking about 10 miles a day.
as well as going to the gym.
So I feel very, very good about that.
Also, you know, the goal of the Republican Party has been to really scrap the New Deal ever since it came about.
And we just really need to protect the New Deal.
And I also, good news is indivisible.org.
If people want to get involved doing from the smallest little thing to the biggest thing, whatever it is that you're skill,
required, or what you like to do, indivisible.org.
They're having these empty chair Congress Town Hall meetings when the Congressperson doesn't show up.
And they're pretty entertaining, actually.
And they're actually showing people like Derek Bann, the rude one, doesn't show up for any of his Town Hall meetings.
Thank you, Tom.
Always appreciate it.
Well done, man.
13 and a half for the body fat.
I mean, I guess I gotta go do some cardio.
No more cookies for you.
Harvey too late.
I've only got a couple of boxes left.
I'm working my way through them.
Harvey, the point is it always, you know, the man, he gets the money and then sometimes people feel like they got it to go to only got 60 seconds, but it seems like a recurring theme in humanity.
Well, it's clearly been a great theme in American history going all the way back to the very beginnings of the nation.
In every generation, there have been working people and middle-class people who have risen up to demand that the United States live up to the promise of the Declaration, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness as rights.
Going to miss you for the next couple of weeks, but I promise when you get back, we will hang out in Appleton, my old stomping grounds.
Thank you so much for what you do.
Harvey K. Professor emeritus of democracy at the University of Wisconsin, Green Bay, just PS on the board, on the horn, on the, on the cuts, spinning the tunes.
Thank you.
Just appreciate it as well.
And all our fair audience.
Thanks for tuning in and stick around.
Peach wabba.
The night light is coming up next.
We'll see on the radio tomorrow.
