However, for today, you're stuck with me, his producer, Jess P.S.
And I am jazzed as hell to introduce my co-host for the day, Harvey K, Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
Harvey, how are you doing?
Well, welcome today to the Dom Selvia show.
Normally, our Monday guest today joining me for the entire two hours.
You too can join us, our fair audience, by calling or texting at 855-752-4842.
We welcome your participation today as every day.
Things will just be run slightly different today as I am also producing this show, so...
That means screening calls is going to be slightly more difficult, but it will still happen.
You will still join us on the show.
We welcome your participation today.
Man, Harvey, there've been just a couple of things going on in the world.
Just a couple.
Just a couple.
So for today, we're going to take a look.
Especially, this is an article that you had sent to me that was really, really fantastic, that we're gonna do a deep dive into truth in a time of lies.
Absolutely important at any time that we value truth, that we seek truth, and especially so when truth is under attack.
So we're gonna spend a good bit of time going through this, talking about the importance of truth.
And frankly, where we can find it, where we can engage in it.
And then we've also got a couple other topics of conversation for today about what this real conflict is in the world.
Is it between Democrats and Republicans, or is it something else?
We'll get there.
As well as in a time when many of us are feeling powerless, what can we do?
And where can we look to for guidance and history?
Something that Harvey Kay, I know you can help us with.
But before we get into that, Harvey Kay, I know who you are, but can you reintroduce yourself just a little bit to the audience as you are going to be going with us throughout the entire day today?
Who are you?
Okay, for start, I'll say right up front, I'm Harvey Kay and I've been here in Wisconsin for, let's be 45 years now.
I grew up in the New York City area, mostly on the Jersey side of the Hudson River.
I studied.
history, politics, and sociology in the course of my BAMA and PhD.
And I came out of graduate school in the mid-70s.
So I am now 75 years old.
So I have not only history on my side, I have experience on my side, you might say.
Of all state systems.
Now, they had just, just before I arrived in the state, they had merged the Wisconsin State University and the University of Wisconsin into one system.
And for those of you who don't know, it was Madison, Milwaukee, Green Bay and Parkside.
That was the UW.
And W, Wisconsin.
state university system where the other campuses from superior to lacrosse and Platteville and Oshkosh, well, you have the idea.
The schools basically that had come out of the teacher training college background, the normal schools they were once called, anyhow, they became one system.
And this was the best.
And I say that knowing that when I applied,
to come to Wisconsin and I specifically wanted to come to Green Bay because this was the once upon a time the experimental campus of the UW system.
What was experimental
So in the humanities, things like philosophy and literature in the social sciences, political science, economic sociology and in
the sciences, biology, chemistry, geology, and so on.
UW Green Bay was set up in a sort of inside out fashion, or another way of putting it is there were no traditional discipline departments.
The departments were interdisciplinary problem focused.
So when I came to UW Green Bay, the program I came to was social change and development, which was my major field at the time.
Eventually, probably 30 years into my career here,
our department had changed, the personnel had changed, our interests had changed, and we became the program titled Democracy and Justice.
So we did the pre-law program, we did international studies, we did American studies, we did women's studies, that kind of thing, within the context of American democratic questions.
So I was having to be at UW-Green Bay all of those years, because I never really wanted to identify with one discipline, though I will say
and this will be the modest part of what I'm about to say, is that I've authored and edited 18 books, and my work has almost always been grounded in historical studies.
So even when there were works of politics, they were historically grounded, or if they were works of cultural studies, they were historically grounded.
So my reputation, people know me as a historian, but
It's also the case that I did get degrees in political science and sociology in preparation for this.
And I loved it at the university.
The only reason I retired was the pandemic.
I love doing things online.
I love doing shows online, the whole panoply of things online.
I did not want to teach masses of students online.
That was hard.
And now granted, I only had 11 students my first year teaching, but it was completely virtual.
And it was incredibly, incredibly difficult.
So I, goodness, I, I, I respect that Harvey K. Professor Emeritus of democracy and justice studies.
My family was historically associated as fans and in other ways with the Brooklyn Dodgers.
who had left Brooklyn for Los Angeles by the time of the story in 1960.
But I hated any team that played in Yankee Stadium.
So when the Giants played, it didn't matter they were playing football, I didn't like them.
So
Harvey K. Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay, joining me, Jess P.S., producer of the Dom Selvia show, as we cover one last day without Dom, who is making his way back to Wisconsin as we record this episode.
He will be joining us back live in the studio tomorrow.
Goodness, that man.
Leaving for a
Yep.
Very good.
Very good.
Well today, we've got a full show stocked for you all and if you want to get in on the action, join us in this conversation.
Please do call or text 855-752-4842.
That's 855-75 Civic.
We're going to be talking about truth.
Truth in a time of lies, as well as what we can do.
Now tonight, there is a scheduled speaking event.
It's not quite a state of the union, though it's being billed as similar to a state of the union where the 47th president of these United States will deliver an address to a joint session of Congress.
There will be coverage of that on civic media as there frequently is for these such events.
However, if you're not quite feeling it, there will be an alternative event hosted by the 5051 movement, which we'll be discussing later in the show as well as giving you a place where you can watch this alternative.
We, the people's state of the union, later in the show as well today, we will be discussing a historical set of states of the union.
Join us today as we talk about truth.
Talk with you, talk with each other, because it does matter.
As we are inundated with lies from the people who should be leading this country, truth matters.
So join us, Harvey Kay, Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
He knows a thing or two.
about this crazy experiment that we call democracy.
And I am Jess P.S., producer of this Dom Selvia show.
We will be back in just a
If you are interested in being part of this production, give us a call.
Send us the text 855-752-4842.
That's 855-75CIVIC, jazzed as hell to reintroduce my...
guest host, my co-host for the entire show today, Harvey K, Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
Before we get back into our discussion, we did get a couple texts in Kurt from Madison saying, dumb, what a slacker!
Tell him to get his butt back in the chair.
Kurt, dumb, is well aware that he needs to get his butt back in the chair.
And he was also in need of a little bit of sunshine and key lime pie, aren't we all?
We also heard from Brian from Milwaukee just you got this you're going to smash it.
Thank you, Brian Thanks for all you do along with everyone else at Civic Media as far as what we can do reach out to your reps protest boycott and vote Absolutely Brian from Milwaukee.
In fact, we'll be getting to some nationwide protests on today March 4th So Harvey K You sent me an article was that yesterday
Was that two days ago?
Coming from the New York Times, this is an opinion piece, Truths to Remember in a Time of Lies from Margaret Renkel.
And this is...
one of those really astounding, I think, opinion pieces that not only brings together just an absolute overwhelming amount of information, synthesizing all of it and providing it in forms where you can actually check the work.
You can see where these opinions are based off of.
It's also just well written.
So I do thank you for bringing that to my attention and I wanted to take some time, the bulk of this hour, to actually comb through it.
because truth matters.
And as a professor-
And as a historian, it matters a great deal to me.
And I've been amazed that the degree to which politicians on the right, going back to Ronald Reagan, have been very effective in hijacking history and-
not necessarily lying about the past, that's part of ruling class activity, but actually bending and obscuring the kinds of truths that would really empower Americans to pursue the promise of this nation more effectively.
And what I mean by that is when Ronald Reagan, for example, was president, he spoke of the wondrousness of America, but he never gave
any kind of credit to the fact that what made America great and by the way he was the first president said let's make America great again was the fact that in generation upon generation there were liberals progressives and radicals who were willing to stand up recall the founding promise and fight and mobilize people in pursuit of that promise and the conservatives always go out of their way to suppress that kind of reality that it's not
It's not the corporate order that makes America great.
It's the progressive movements from below that have made America great in terms of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
So let's keep in mind the imperative of truth, even the truth that even liberals have on occasion obscured from us.
And there's something to be said for the fact that history, as you know, and I also have a degree in history and classical studies going back a couple millennia rather than centuries.
But truth is written by the victors.
History is written by the victors.
So there's always an element of obfuscation when we look back at what has happened.
And as we present to the next generations, this is what has happened.
Would you say it's a different thing to be looking at our present and having the lies about our present?
In fact, I'm going to tell you something because you did do classical studies at UWM, I believe.
Yes, indeed.
Because I'm not well-versed in the classics.
But I can tell you that Plato in the Republic warned who the most dangerous people in the Republic were, and they were the poets.
And by the way, in classical and ancient Greece, the poets were the historians of the day.
Indeed.
He said these are the dangerous people.
They are the most threatening.
Well, it's always the case that a really good historian, and her or his best, should always have that dangerousness about them.
There's good danger, and there's danger that seeks to tear down.
Tear down systems of power, or tear down the people.
Let's focus on tearing down systems of power that obfuscate.
what we the people need.
So we're gonna do a little bit of reading alouding, as Dom calls it, from this opinion piece, Truths to Remember in the Time of Lives, and I'll link this into the show notes, which you can always find at civicmedia.us slash shows, or on Spotify or Apple podcasts.
This is an opinion piece from Margaret Renkel.
She begins, the brickbats are meant to knock us senseless.
Blow after blow, they bludgeon us.
What could possibly keep them straight?
Which dangerous changes have already taken place?
Which are the autocrats working openly around the clock to enact?
Which are still just talk, things that might happen someday after the world order has been upended?
And which are intended to be merely distractions, like yelling squirrel in the presence of a rat terrier?
They urge us to pay no attention to the charlatans behind the curtain, who are yanking the safety net from beneath our feet, ignoring the rule of law,
dismantling American democracy brick by brick, lining their pockets by driving the planet into ruin.
We need not know what's happening behind the curtain they assure us.
The wizard will tell us all we need to know.
Truths to remember in a time of lies.
Please feel free to join us on the lines.
Send us a text.
Call us at 855-752-4842.
My name is Jess P.S.
Normally I am.
the humble producer of this show today.
I am co-hosting with Harvey K., Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
I see you lining up on the phones.
I'm going to screen you now so that we can get to you in the next segment.
Come back with us on the Dom Selvia Show.
Back to the Dom Salvia Show.
I'm Jess P.S., the producer of this program.
Dom will be back tomorrow, I promise.
Joining me today for the full show is Harvey K., Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
You too can be part of our fine production today by giving us a call, 855-752-4842.
Good, how are you, Joe?
Well, I know we're in a time of major lying and dishonesty, but you know, throughout our history, we have never been very honest about what we've done to the indigenous people, the Chinese people.
the African-American tech we were picking on the Irish and the Italians when they first came here.
We've been a country over the centuries who've never really been very honest.
That is true, but I want to add something which doesn't take anything away from what you just said, but it's the fact that if we're going to
teach history properly.
We've got to remind folks of just how much American history was marked by exploitation and oppression, by tragedy and irony.
But we must also teach at the very same time, otherwise we'll just merely cultivate cynicism.
We must also teach about the fact that Americans have a remarkable history of resistance, rebellion, and revolution from
that has meant that we have, over time, and for again, all of the tragic and ironic turns, we have brought an end to slavery.
We have empowered women.
We have enacted civil rights laws to create a greater sense of equality and empowerment of people.
We empowered working people back in the 1930s.
I mean, we have an amazing history.
And by the way,
The powers that be today, one of the reasons they go out of their way to suppress and lie about history is because they are afraid of Americans.
That it might well be the case that Americans are, as I've argued in actually in writing over and over again, are essentially radicals at heart.
The trick is that we have to stop being cynical about the American story and remind ourselves of who we are.
and how we got here for the better and what the hell we can do to make it even more progressive in the future.
especially at a time when the teaching of that history is actually coming under attack.
So as you all know, I do produce the Dom Salvia show.
I also produce several other programs here at Civic Media, including Busted Pencils, fully-ledded education talk.
Now, this is a show that is primarily on public education, led by two doctors of education, Dr. Tim Slacker and Dr. Johnny Lupinacci.
And just this past, oh goodness, yes, that was yesterday, time really is just sort of...
a matrix of Wibbly Wobblies.
Yesterday, we released a podcast on a dear colleague letter sent out by the Federal Department of Education instructing all public schools to cease all programs having anything to do with DEI, diversity, equity, and inclusion, as well as teaching, it appears, according to this letter, any history.
that may make someone feel a little uneasy about their American heritage, the parts of American history that are hard to reckon with, the parts of American history that are ugly, that are frankly evil, there are parts of American history that are evil, and there are parts of American history of which we should be very, very proud.
So Harvey K. Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies, two things.
that America should be very, very proud of.
I appreciate this nuance that you've brought to us, and thank you, Cindy, for your call.
Any final thoughts on this, Harvey Kay?
Hey, good afternoon.
Now you're doing a great job, Jess.
Thanks, Polly.
And Harvey K also.
Yeah, it's a little bit of topic here.
But I did want to make a point, something I think Trump has forgot about.
The farmers need potash.
And where does that come from?
Canada.
So if they put
which I think they're going to today, or maybe they already have.
You can imagine where food prices are going.
You could correct me if I'm wrong on any of that, RVK, but that's just my point for today.
Thanks.
in
When he unilaterally and probably illegally gutted USAID by firing staff members and canceling funding approved by Congress, President Trump assured that people will suffer and die.
many of them children.
And I do want to note, as I told Jess earlier off air, when I came out of graduate, my first graduate degree from the University of London, which was in Latin American studies with an emphasis in international relations, it was my ambition to go into the USAID.
I had a particular interest in land reform questions.
And I figured why not
Why not get my hands dirty on the question?
Why not go to Latin America as part of a US government effort to help them?
I will also add that I discovered in my further studies, there were times when the USAID was anything but helpful to local peasants, to local labor movements, at times cooperating with the CIA and corporate interests.
But it is the case that the USAID does provide essential resources
To combat polio tuberculosis Ebola and HIV and malaria around the world
not to mention famine and the absolute devastation That occurs surrounding that level of extreme poverty That with those levels of extreme poverty comes desperation and out of that desperation come movements that harm that kill and so having USAID having
an agency that is focused on combating the worst forms of desperation in this world, that strengthens America's standing worldwide.
It is a form of, as the discussion has revolved around, soft power.
That it's not that we are, you know, arming people, we are not providing weapons, but we are gaining soft power influence that does matter.
Another truth.
Vaccines save lives.
Now, some people may know I am working towards a career in medicine.
Radio was sort of a very interesting sidetrack that has taken me on some very interesting journeys here.
But I'm actually working towards medicine.
And vaccines are miraculous.
And they don't come out of nowhere.
They come from decades upon decades upon decades of rigorous study.
Incredible standards that work to make sure that they are safe and effective.
And yes, some people do have negative responses to them.
And the overwhelming majority of people benefit so far more.
Vaccines save lives.
Vaccines were able to eradicate polio in this country.
vaccines eradicated measles in this country until they formed a resurgence due to anti-vax movements.
And it's important that we remember that truth.
So consider this, even as bird flu spreads in mammal populations, even as the likelihood rises that it is evolving in a way that makes human to human transmission more possible,
Trump's team is evaluating whether the Yankback funding already approved for developing a vaccine that would protect us against it.
And this is one of those places where our president is working against the Constitution.
These are funds that have already been allocated and approved by Congress, which holds the power of the purse strings.
And saying, no, actually, we don't need to put money into this because I, in this moment,
Don't want it.
However, there was a playbook when Trump came into office the first time that was established by President Obama along with guidance from a very functional cabinet as well as other presidents of how to handle a global pandemic should one arise.
Trump dismantled it.
and then low and behold, a worldwide pandemic at our feet.
Now, we have a bit of warning on this one.
We know that the risk of human infection from avian influenza is rising.
We are seeing cases of it spreading now.
We are seeing cases of avian influenza, bird flu, as it is commonly called, spreading to other animals, aside from birds.
There's a chance here to stop it.
There's a chance here to put the science ahead of it.
And our president is choosing to yank funding.
That is a scary, scary thing.
And in a time of lies, it is absolutely vital that we remember our truths.
I'm Jess P.S., producer of this program, filling in for Dom for one more day as he enjoys his vacation here with Harvey K., Professor Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Green Bay.
When we come back, we're going to continue discussing truth in a time of lies, as well as taking your calls, 855-752-4842.
That's 855-75 Civic.
Here at the Civic Media Radio Network, we do value truth.
And in that vein, we will be bringing you coverage of President Trump's address to a joint session of Congress tonight, starting at 8 p.m.
coverage.
We'll start at 7.30 p.m.
And if that's not quite your liking, I will be linking in our show notes an address for We the People's State of the Union, broadcast by 5051, an organization of 50 states, 50 protests, one peaceful movement.
We'll be right back here on the Dom Selvia Show.
And welcome back to the Dom Salvia show.
No Dom for the day.
You're stuck with me as producer, Jess P.S.
as well as Harvey J. K. Professor of Emeritus of Democracy and Justice Studies at the University of Wisconsin Green Bay.
We are talking truth.
And truth that matters in a time of lies.
We are taking your calls and your texts at 855-752-4842.
Now, normally Dom's rule is, callers get precedents.
However, there was a text that I wanted to get to.
Len from Madison says, if there was an actual truth serum and it was given to Trump, it would probably cause fatal seizure.
I am inclined to believe that that might be the case, in fact, because this is a man who has shown that he is absolutely physiologically incompatible with the truth.
Now, in that fame, we want to get to collars, but there were two notes that we wanted to end with on this article from the New York Times.
that I will link to the show notes that I really do believe is worth a read.
It's a relatively short article, but it is jam-packed.
This is written by Margaret Renkel, posted yesterday.
And we picked up, we're gonna pick up right here with two final truths.
First one, Mr. Trump said Medicaid was safe from cuts.
It isn't.
Tens of millions of Americans rely on Medicaid for healthcare.
Its expansion as part of the Affordable Care Act has been life-saving for both low-income workers and rural hospitals in states that did not opt to expand Medicaid, of which Wisconsin is one of them.
Hundreds of hospitals have closed.
The same will happen everywhere else if Congress cuts funding and states cannot afford to make up the difference.
the
They do not want Medicare for some, Medicaid for others, private insurance.
They want to know everyone is covered.
And it is a tragic contradiction.
that we have yet to see even the Democrats have failed, even the Democrats have failed to come out for national healthcare of some type, which by the way, they did for decades following the 1940s, and they've abandoned a fundamental element of the Democratic Party story.
I want to get to this last truth before we go to the line.
So callers, please be patient.
I do see a...
Russia invaded Ukraine.
Now this was one of the most abhorrent lies of the past several weeks in which our president has come out and said that Ukraine should never have started the war in Russia, which of course is not only a lie, it is blasphemous.
It goes against everything that we have seen that we know to be true.
that Russia invaded Ukraine not once but twice and has held hostilities against the country for decades.
Number one, the show that Trump and Vance put on in the Oval Office was all pre-arranged and practically rehearsed.
So his outrage was just literally there, just literally spewed forth to impress everyone who wants to see the Trump.
is in charge.
Well, he was in charge for the wrong ends.
And I also have to say that, you know, domestic policy changes may well be tragic as they unfold.
But if we can win back Washington, if we can win back the federal government, we can address those.
We cannot so readily address the changes in the world that he is instigating.
and it scares me no end to consider what this shift in American policy towards authoritarian governments like Putin's, and I understand towards Iran as well is coming.
So anyhow, keep in mind that this is perhaps the most dangerous of lies, this Russia, you know.
Well, it's not just the
It is the alignment with Putin's Russia.
It is the alignment with the authoritarian government over the Democratic one.
It is the show of force of saying, no, we agree with the aggressors here.
It is not the democratically elected president who we are going to support here.
It is Putin and his oligarchs and his authoritarian regime.
And that is a scary thing indeed.
Chris from Rice Lake, I want to get your thoughts on this, give you the last thoughts of the hour.
What's on your mind, friend?
Yeah, I just, I wanted to tell you guys, you know, I appreciate that you guys are going through these truths and everything, but 77 million people in this country did not care.
They did not care.
They voted for these crazy people.
And if the Democrats don't get their heads out of their rear ends, we're going to have one of these crazy people on the Wisconsin State Supreme Court.
I really think that
We need to start pushing this issue that Schimel and Musk are hand in hand.
I mean, we've got to get these liars out of our politics.
Absolutely
you for that call.
Referring to the April 1st general election for Supreme Court of Wisconsin, as well as Superintendent of Public Instruction, make sure you get out there and vote.
Indeed, for Supreme Court, there are two candidates running Judge Brad Schimel against Judge Susan Crawford.
One of those judges is supported by Big Money coming from Elon Musk.
The other one, Judge Susan Crawford is supported by We The People.
Make your choice and make it count.
We'll be right back on the Dom Salvia Show.
