Countering the ridiculousness of it all with some sense (Hour 2)

Broadcasting across the state of Wisconsin on the Civic Media Radio Network, and around the world on the Civic Media app, this is the Dom Salvia Show.

And now, here's your host, Dom Salvia.

This is the Dom Salvia show, but this is not Dom Salvia.

Dom's on vacation here for a little bit, so I will be with you.

I'm Matt Rothschild, formerly at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign, the Progressive Magazine, and I will be your host for the two-hour show today and tomorrow.

We're really looking forward to these next couple days.

Looking forward also to working with the great Jess P.S.

in the booth, who's just a wonderful producer of the Dom Salvia show and a few partners.

Aw, thanks, Matt.

So it's great to be with you.

Jess.

Well, we're gonna have some fun and I see that let me just give a rundown on the show today We've got Heather Dubois-Bernain the executive director and founder of Wisconsin Public Education Network and We're gonna have Lisa Lucas the deputy director of all in Wisconsin at 430 and then Angela Lang who's my usual guest co-host joining me at five and

We'll be talking about a whole range of things.

Always willing and happy to take your call at 855-752-4842.

That's 855-75 Civic Calls and Texts at that line.

And I see that Heather has joined us.

Heather, how are you?

Good.

How are you, Matt?

Nice to see you.

Yeah, it's great to see you.

I'm doing fine.

There's always a lot going on, isn't there?

Oh, so much right now.

Yeah, it's just kind of crazy.

How do you handle the craziness?

Just by pouring myself into whatever productive work I can find.

There are so many battles to pick right now, so you could make a full time.

job out of just deciding which ones to pick.

So keeping our heads down and trying to help other people focus on what Wisconsin kids really need is a good distraction, believe it or not, from all of the chaos around us.

And fortunately, we saw a lot of this coming and have been prepared for a while to just, you know, refuse to take the bait and do what we got to do to make sure that we get through this with

as little damage as possible to our students in their public schools.

And I think you're right to say you know pick one issue or two.

Join one organization or two, do it with a friend or two friends.

It's easier that way.

But get involved because there's nothing more disillusioning and disempowering than just sitting down for the cable news networks or skimming the news on your computer and just feeling just depressed and wiped out.

That's not going to get it done.

So that's why your network is so important.

way important even before Trump came along but it's even more important right now the Wisconsin Public Education Network and I see right now

this week, you're in the midst of public schools week.

So I didn't even know that was a thing.

Tell me about

that.

Yeah, it's a thing, Matt.

Come celebrate with us.

No, at Wisconsin Public Education Network, we've actually been celebrating a version of this for the whole 10 years that I've been at the organization.

And by the way, I'm not the founder.

I'm a total found link.

I mean, I found my people through this network.

And I invite anyone who's listening and who's captured by any of the things that we're mad about over here to

Come find your people in us too, that we've got folks all over the state who are just frustrated with a status quo that's letting kids down in one way or another and state leaders who refuse to do their job and all the things.

And one of the things that we were frustrated about was how it always feels like we're playing defense.

There's always some.

attacks, some threats, some, you know, kind of behind the scenes, wheeling and dealing, that's like pitting us against each other.

And we thought we don't even have time to prove all the ways our schools are actually not failing our kids, but thriving in spite of all of this.

And

Taking time to celebrate that is something that we often skip and so we started doing something that we called I love art my public schools week You know over 10 years ago, and we always did it during Valentine's Day week and then Meanwhile kind of simultaneously a national movement started up and and they put their own public schools week at the end of February and so we just tagged into that and started borrowing their toolkits and templates to and now there's nationwide celebration

of all of the ways that our public schools are meeting the needs of our communities and just a chance to kind of reflect on why it is we do the work we do and all of the cool things that are going on every day in every single public school in this state.

And what are you urging people to do during this week as part of the celebration?

Well, just naming that, just taking some time to think about that and re-center yourself in your own.

Why?

Why do you care about this so much?

What is at stake here for you?

Why'd you get involved in this work?

Who motivated you to do that?

And then tell that story.

You know, almost everybody who thinks about that remembers a moment or a teacher or a day or another student or somebody who touched you through your school experience and something that kind of centers or grounds you in the reasons that you think our public schools are so important to individuals, to relationships, and to how it is that we build community, how we build democracy with each other.

So we celebrate that, we tell our stories, and then the other thing we like

to do is put our appreciation into action.

What are you going to do about it?

If public schools are worth fighting for, how are we going to fight for them?

How can we stand up together?

And I spent much of today finalizing a toolkit that gives people some pretty easy ways to do that.

I've got five ways that you can stand up for public schools up on our blog right now.

And I'm going to drop that link into our chat too so you can share it out with folks.

And you also have a cool little video, five minute video of a grown up student who and his teacher.

And I think it was from Lafarge, Wisconsin.

This guy became a chef and he has his teacher who saw something in him when he was

just

in seventh or eighth grade.

And now he's like 40 years old or something, but it's a terrific little video.

Yes, some people might remember Luke Zahn.

He's the host of Wisconsin Foodie on PBS and he was on, what's that?

So, when Top Chef was in Wisconsin, he was on there, so you might recognize his face.

We actually...

met Luke when he testified last time around at a state budget hearing and I was out in the hall at the time because we had a table there we were greeting people and kind of you know checking in with other public school champions at the event and my phone started blowing up this guy's testifying you're gonna believe his testimony so good he's like he owns a restaurant or something and so I chased him down afterwards and asked him if he chairs public school story with us and and that's that's what he did he was reunited with a teacher he hadn't seen in 30 years and he

We remember details like what songs she played in class.

That's how deeply she touched him.

And those are the kind of stories that we want to tell during public schools week because those are the moments that remind us why this fight is worth fighting and why as hard as it is and as necessary as it might be to have to micro dose on all the chaos right now and take breaks from it.

Our kids are really counting on us to be there so that they can celebrate those good stories one day too.

I think the song was Simon and Garfunkel, Parsley, Sage, Rose, Mary, and Time.

So for us...

I know, now he's a chef.

Later he becomes a chef.

It was kind

of a

coincidence.

Yeah, it was a really

good story.

And hats off, by the way, to Micah Davis and Steve Bettscull, who did that video series for us.

We have five videos in that series.

We call it Public Schools Unite Us, where we matched up educators with their former students to share their stories.

And they're all just as touching as that one.

And I think anyone listening has a teacher or an advisor who had a great impact on their lives.

So this is a good week to salute those folks on social media.

You also have a day of action scheduled for Friday.

Tell me about that, Heather.

Yeah, we're closing out public schools week with a day of action.

And on our day of action, we're going to take this this fight a little bit harder to the Capitol.

And what we want to do is remind folks that

There's a reason that 178 school districts had to go to referenda last year.

And there's a reason that 86 more are going in April and five went this year because the state is not meeting its obligation to its children.

We're entering our 16th year this year of state budgets that failed even to keep pace with inflation from the prior year.

So we're just...

woefully underfunded to the tune of about $3,380 per kid, you know, when you adjust for inflation during that time.

And folks are...

taken it to the ballot box.

So we've invited people from these referenda teams from all over the state to come share their stories.

We've got other people too who are going to share their stories about the needs of kids with disabilities, how we can help protect immigrant students and their families, and what we can do together to really make sure that we are standing up for the schools our kids deserve.

So join us.

It's from noon to one at the in the noon to one and in the capital rotunda Everyone is welcome and if you can't be there follow along you can find us on social media on Facebook Wisconsin network org or you can follow along on Wisconsin I because I think they'll be there to cover the event as well

Good luck with that event.

I'll try to

get

myself You know you mentioned the referendums like three quarters of those referendums past even though it's

uh, you know, a tax increase, property tax increase for, for people, people understand overwhelmingly that we need to fund our public schools.

And yet, uh, in the capital here in Madison, that message, uh, hasn't gotten through sufficiently.

Why is that?

Because there is no political will to do the right thing in the state house right now.

And we have seen this budget after budget after budget after budget.

and it's time to break the toxic cycle.

There is absolutely no excuse for not listening to voters, for not listening to the hundreds of people who come speak out at the budget hearings year after year, and for not listening to the communities, blue and red and purple and everything in between, who have been telling the state, enough is enough, we can't afford to do this.

And it's very disequalizing.

Every time we have to fund our schools this way, when one referendum passes and another referendum fails, our gaps just get wider.

that has already was already unfair to begin with becomes even increasingly so when we fund in this really unethical way.

And so people are just saying enough is enough.

And we need to call on every single state leader to do better and to vote for a budget that will really meet the needs of our kids.

And one way that we want them to do that is by increasing the special education

reimbursement rate, get us out from, you know, under the stranglehold of being worse in the nation in that category and give public schools the same 90% reimbursement rate that they currently give to kids who go to a private school on a voucher.

Let's close that funding gap and see what happens.

It would be transformational for every kid in the state.

Heather, can you hang on and do one more short segment for the end of the half hour?

Yeah, sure.

I'd like to talk a little bit more about the Evers budget and then maybe

stuff in Washington if we got time.

You're listening to the Dom Selfie Show.

I'm Matt Rothschild.

My guest for this half hour is Heather Dubupper, Nain, who is the executive director, not the founder, but the executive director of the Wisconsin Public Education Network, and we'll be right

back.

Hey, welcome back to the Dom Salvia Show.

I'm Matt Rothschild.

It's up and in here for Dom, who's on vacation.

And I'm delighted to have with me to the end of this half hour, Heather Dubois-Bernain.

She's the executive director of the Wisconsin Public Education Network and one of the best activists in the state of Wisconsin.

Thanks for hanging on with me to Heather here.

Thanks.

My key to success is that I've been mad.

for as long as I can remember and I'm not going to stop doing what we need

to do until I'm not mad anymore.

You know, it's a it's a good impulse to seize on that anger and funnel it into political activism.

And when I used to, you know, write op eds, my first and give clinics on how to write op eds, my first piece of advice was

Seize the anger you have and write about what you're angry about.

I think

I went to that workshop, Matt.

I actually think I did.

I've got that note somewhere.

It was very validating for me.

I think I give that to about two generations of activists in Wisconsin.

But it's a good idea to funnel that anger in a positive way.

And for a hotbed ride, you can take the anger out when you're done a little bit.

You can tone it down so you're not screeching and screaming at people.

I wanted to, as I mentioned before the break, just mention Evers' budget, what you make of this current budget.

I know you were highly critical of the one that he signed last time around.

Well, the one that he signed last time around for zero resemblance to the one he presented last time.

So let's hope we don't find ourselves in that situation again.

The budget that's on the table right now is pretty strong.

I mean, I don't think it gets us to...

funding adequacy for public schools, but it certainly is a heck of a lot better than what we've got right now.

It does some things the last budgets certainly didn't do, such as restore the state's commitment to special education by lifting the reimbursement rate to 60%.

Yes, that's lower than the minimum of 90% we were asking for, but it's double what we have now with the worst in the nation reimbursement rate of 29%, which is just shameful.

Billions of dollars every year are transferred from general funds to cover those unreimbursed costs.

It's just unconscionable.

It gives districts new spending power by

restoring what we often call the Tommy Thompson standard, where, you know, every year you get at least an inflationary increase to how much you were allowed to spend.

But the state still paralyzes districts with what they call revenue caps, which are really spending caps, which are unfair and don't have anything to do with how much students need and given districts.

So there's some really good things in that budget that respond directly to what we know kids need, mental health support, support for educators,

and for rural districts, lifting the low revenue limit ceiling which is desperately needed too.

So a lot of good things in there and let's hope that we can have some honest conversations about why we need all those things in the budget hearings and in our communities as we move forward.

Folks can follow along at wisconsinnetwork.org slash budget for our budget headquarters where we're gonna provide information on every single

opportunity, democracy affords you to raise your own voice in this process, to tell your story, to amplify it where you live, and to really connect with people, including decision makers, about what local kids need and why you think they should do better in the next budget cycle.

So there'll be these hearings around the state on the budget and your organization, Wisconsin network, a public education network, Wisconsin network.org does a great job of turning people out to those hearings.

That's an opportunity for you, the listener to get your voice heard right in front of the elected officials.

You

know, they

can't hide from you at these budget hearings.

Tell

them how

you feel, you know, be polite, but be strong.

Tell them exactly how you feel and what you need, what you think the public schools need.

free meals was in, you know, the governor's budget.

We need that.

I mean, there was no expansion of the voucher program.

If I read it right, I know Republicans are going to want to get that.

And he gave way too much of that last time around, but try to hold his feet to the fire too.

The governor's feet to the fire so he doesn't compromise too much.

Yeah, we need to be a critical friend to everybody in the law in the legislature on this That's super important and then after you do that that's step one and then step two is amplify it do your testimony

and then share it out, put it on your socials, send it out as an email, send it to all the lawmakers, not just the ones who are on that powerful joint finance committee, and make sure that other people know that you spoke up and are standing up and the more we can kind of make a snowball out of all of these concerns, the more likely we are to be heard and the more likely we are to see some real change because it's been a long time coming and we're sick and tired of asking for the same thing and getting nothing.

Well, I bet you are.

One last topic is the school superintendent race.

Do you want to talk about that and what's at stake there?

Well, everything's at stake with all the things on our spring ballots, but that is certainly a top consideration for people who care about strong public schools.

We need to elect somebody who is going to center student needs and think about how we can hold the line on privatization and hold all of our schools accountable to meeting the actual needs of kids and not the political whims of partisans at the state house.

And so people have a lot of work to do in making sure that they do their homework and identifying those two

candidates and seeing where they stand on the issues that matter to them.

We're hoping to do a candidate forum very soon.

The League of Women Voters and the NAACP of Wisconsin are co-hosting that with us.

So stay tuned for details on that as soon as we can get a date confirmed with the candidates.

Do you want to just talk about who the two candidates are briefly?

Yeah, well, the state superintendent, Dr. Jill Underly was successful in getting on the ballot again.

So she will be seeking another term.

And she's being opposed by Brittany Kinzer, who is a former employee of Citri Forward Collective, which is a pro charter lobbying organization in Milwaukee.

And she she was a privatization lobbyist for them.

As far as I know, that was her most recent occupation before she decided to seek this office.

So you cannot have a bigger contrast, or it's a huge contrast in any event, between someone who advocates for public schools and someone who advocates for privatization and voucher schools.

So that's a really important item that's gonna be on the April 1st ballot along with the state Supreme Court race.

So it's really crucial for people to turn out in vote.

April 1st, you can vote the two weeks prior, you can vote by absentee as I do.

Make sure you turn out and vote on those two big races, Wisconsin Supreme Court.

and also schools who are superintendent and on any of the referendums that are there.

Right.

86 of

them.

Yeah, she's the executive director of the Wisconsin Public Education Network, WisconsinNetwork.org.

Thanks for being my guest.

Heather, it's great to see you and talk with

you.

Thanks so much for having me.

It was great to see you too, Matt.

Have a great day.

You too, and we'll be right back with the Dom Salvia Show.

Welcome back to the Dom Selvia Show.

I'm Matt Rothschild here, sub and in for Dom who's on vacation.

I'll be with you for the rest of the day up to six o'clock today and I'll be with you from four to six tomorrow.

So thanks for listening.

Happy to be joined right now by Lisa Lucas, an old friend of mine who's the deputy director of a tremendous group called All In Wisconsin.

Lisa Lucas, welcome to Dom Selvia Show.

Thanks for having me, Matt.

It's nice to be chatting with you.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to it.

And you, the listener, can call in our text at 855-752-4842.

That's 855-75CIVIC all across the Civic Media Radio Network.

So tell our listeners what All In Wisconsin is all about.

Yeah.

All in Wisconsin is a communications organization.

We work with grassroots organizations all over the state to help them build communication strategies and narratives that center their communities, disrupt dog whistles, and provide a narrative foundation to help them win on their issues and so that we can all have freedom, safety, justice, and joy.

And

who could object to all that?

It's so important this work because, to my mind, liberals, progressives, Democrats, people who want more justice and equality in America have been losing the messaging game for just for so long.

It's been a frustration of my entire life since I was in progressive media and in progressive activism at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign after that.

How first of all underfunded we are by the big foundations and the big liberal Hollywood folks I mean those folks have been asleep at the wheel forever and then just the kind of tactical or strategic messaging mistakes that We have some of us have fallen prey to too many times.

So why do you think?

There's been this messaging failure

Well, I think a couple of reasons one is that

Some folks are very comfortable in the status quo, or what was the status quo for a while, and messaging the way they did kept them there.

The other, I think, is just that it gets, I think messaging gets used as a way to provide PR instead of shift policy change, which is what the intention of good messaging really is.

And so you can't really have good messaging until you have really good policy.

And it starts there, I think.

So part of the problem is policy.

Part of the problem is how to articulate that policy.

And you guys are great at the articulation part too, and I'm sure you're great on the policy angle as well, if push came to shove.

But I want to talk about the articulation, the messaging part, because one of the things you're famous for, at least in my book, is this adage, don't bring a fact to a values fight.

Do you want to explain that one?

Sure.

I think it's a tendency that we have as progressives to believe the best in people and to think if only they had the right information, they would be on our side.

If we could only educate, if we could only get people to understand this fact, they would be on our side.

But the truth is, if facts won people over, we would all be out of work.

we would have won all of these things a very, very long time ago.

And so the unfortunate reality that's backed up by cognitive research is that people are not moved by facts.

They're swayed by values and the way things are framed.

I mean, communication is just, it's every single way that humans exchange information with each other, right?

And facts are certainly a very important part of that.

And we don't want to get away from

knowing what the facts are, especially in this age of disinformation and misinformation, but you don't win people over by digging into the weeds of a policy.

You win people over by telling them what the final result of that policy is going to do for them and their families.

So how do you connect with those values that are resonating with people and their families?

Well,

We have so much in common with each other that I think you just have to start there, right?

It starts with what do we all love about the community that we live in?

What do we want to share together?

How do we want to connect together?

And the wonderful thing about...

the way that our society is shaped is that we all do have these pillars of society that we can use whether it's a consumer or a member of a faith institution or a parent of a school or a sports fan or anything like that where we all have some sort of social or political or economic power that we can use to kind of shift power dynamics through

talking to each other and aligning with each other on what we ultimately want, which really is the same thing, right?

We all want the freedom to be ourselves.

We all want our families to feel joy.

We all want to feel economically secure and not be worried that one trip to the doctor is going to bankrupt us.

And we all want to be able to envision a future where our kids and our grandkids are happy and healthy and whole.

So part of it is painting that positive vision, right?

Yeah, absolutely.

And then not getting in the weeds, as you say, on the fact side.

That's why sometimes, you know, I used to go around the state giving talks to a lot of progressive

groups and there'd be bumper stickers like fax matter and I see it sometimes on people's car fax matter and and after listening to you over the years I just kind of look at that bumper sticker and kind of scratch my head because maybe that's not not the winning way to go.

I mean facts are important but you know in this age of alternative facts we're not connecting with people as much as we can and that's why the work that you do

And Dr. Cass Bowers does over there.

She's the director, executive director at all in Wisconsin.

So

important.

You know, I heard a corollary to your don't bring a fact to a values fight the other day, which was don't bring a lectern to a social media fight.

I don't know if you've heard that one before or seen it, but I think it was aimed at like.

Minority Leader Schumer or someone who just gets up at a lectern and gives a boring speech with a microphone in front of them and has no social media presence.

So I kind of like that little twist as well.

Who do you think is doing good communication work among our elected officials, either here in Wisconsin or nationally, on the progressive side?

You know, I think in Wisconsin right now, there's a lot of reps that are doing a really good job of not taking rage bait that Republicans are giving them.

I think Francesca Hong is doing really well.

I think Christian Phelps is killing it up there.

And so there's definitely a seed.

of how to talk about these things and how to give people hope.

And I think that's the other really important part of it is like, you cannot lead any of these conversations with just what we hate and what's wrong and what we're afraid of because people right now already want to crawl under the table and ignore it all.

And so if we start there, we kind of end up having to coax them out from under the table instead of starting with...

What we want to achieve and the values that we have if and how we can do it together and that kind of gets them away from the table in the first place and then federally I mean

I haven't been super impressed with anything that I've seen.

I think AOC is doing a solid of a job as she can do.

I forget the name of the rep in Colorado who brought her newborn to be able to vote on the cuts.

I thought that was a really powerful visual, but ultimately it feels like

The most power that is happening right now is not happening from any legislators or any elected officials, but is really happening with people who are moving in solidarity with each other to take action in ways that we haven't seen in a really long time.

Yeah, I'm sensing the rise of activism locally too, and it's really kind of exhilarating.

Yeah.

You mentioned rage bait.

Let's talk a little bit more about that.

That's part of

something that you wrote on your group's website, all in wi.org, about how to fight back against the authoritarians that have taken over our country right now.

You say don't fall for rage bait, outrage driven posts, even if accurate often serve to exhaust and distract.

And you also say, whatever you do, don't repeat the propaganda you're trying to debunk.

Do you

want

to talk about that?

Right.

Well, the rage bait, I think we've all fallen victim to it, unfortunately.

I think we've all had moments where we just get caught up in winning an argument with some stranger on Facebook.

And, you know, their entire purpose is to waste our time.

That's it.

If we are fighting with somebody on Facebook who is not arguing in good faith with us, we're not taking that time to call our own legislators or to have conversations with our family and friends, right?

So it's just a waste of time.

And then the other part is not repeating the things that the opposition is saying because we know that they're lying and they also know that they're lying.

The reason that they lie

is to outrage us because if we are outraged we want to correct them because we're so good at correcting people with the facts so we end up trying to correct people with facts what we're really doing is just giving their falsehoods

free publicity, free airtime, we're sharing their quotes.

And so what happens on a cognitive level is people do not remember if the thing that we shared was true or false.

They just remember that it exists and it existing in your brain is enough for them to consider it true.

So

perversely, we're reinforcing the right-wing message.

Yeah, we reinforce it.

And when we do things like share it on social media, if we share it directly from a rage post page, then we're also giving them engagement clicks, which gives them a stronger algorithm that reaches more people.

So if I say, if you have to share something, if you want to talk about how absurd it is or how silly it is, screenshot it.

put a picture of the screenshot on your post and then say the thing that you want to say, but don't share and give them free clicks.

I'm speaking with Lisa Lucas, who's the Deputy Director of All In Wisconsin, who's a real expert on communication and has studied what works and what doesn't work.

And you have do's and don'ts on your website too, which are really helpful for people.

So I would recommend that folks go to allinwi.org and look at what Lisa and Dr. Cass Bowers have to offer there.

Just as a way to figure out how do we communicate best with people.

And also, Lisa, you mentioned, you know, know your audience.

Don't waste your time on people you're not going to be able to convince.

I fall for that sometimes because I have crazy ideas that I'm going to even convince CJ here who calls in on the Civic Media Radio Network and is a right-winger.

Not a horrible human being.

I've had lunch with him, but pretty much just repeats the party line on Fox.

And I don't think even in my most deluded.

I'm going to be able to convince him to change his mind.

But look, there were one third of the voting public didn't turn out at this last election.

So we not only need to try to convince some of those Trump voters, we've got to really convince the folks who didn't come out and vote at all.

And that's what we, I think we probably hit more mileage there, especially people we know.

I mean, that's the important thing, talking to people you know, your friends, family members.

you know people are getting information all over the place and if we can counter that information in a smart way which is what you do every day Lisa at all in Wisconsin then we might have a chance here of rescuing our democracy from the fires that are burning all over it right now and just you also have things on your website just from a human level how to keep going I think those are important to share as well and not to get too discouraged so what's your advice there Lisa?

Yeah, I think the most important thing to remember when we are living through an authoritarian regime is that we know what we can leverage with them because the one thing that is always true is that they're weaker than they appear and they are relying on ordinary people to be passive.

And what that ends up looking like is that

we become isolated, right?

So connecting with each other, as simple as it seems, really is so very important for people right now.

So getting into community with folks.

If you have somebody that you've been meaning to reach out for coffee or lunch, go do that.

If you have a book club that you've been meaning to start, go start it.

What do you need to be to be with your people is a really, really important part of this.

And we'll pick up on that if you can just hang on for the next

10 minutes, we'll follow up on that conversation and maybe talk about the Brewers, because you have a funny podcast, fun podcast with the Brewers.

And I'm talking with Lisa Lucas of All in Wisconsin on the Dom Selvia Show on the Civic Media Radio Network.

We'll be right back.

We're back on the Dom Salvia show.

I'm Matt Rothschild.

Subbing in for Dom was on vacation.

I'll be with you tomorrow afternoon as well.

And I'm joined by Lisa Lucas, who is the deputy director of the great group Allie in Wisconsin.

Really, they have the best advice on messaging and communications in the state.

You're listening, of course, to the Civic Media Radio Network.

The number to call is 855-752-4842.

That's 855-75 Civic.

You get the 8-5-5.

It's 8-5-5.

Just remember the other 7-5-2, 48-42.

And on the line, we have Joe from Madison.

Joe, what's on your mind?

This is a fascinating discussion.

I'll definitely check out your website.

It sounds really valuable.

I just wanted to add a few more points in and just get your reaction to it.

One of the things you said that struck me was you said, don't repeat their lines.

basically give them another platform.

Republicans who are saying something that you know to be wrong, why repeat it?

But it strikes me that we also sort of need to think about how we craft our messages in terms of being the most punchy that we can have.

And it strikes me that brevity is really important.

humor is really important and that almost the kind of give people a catchphrase.

Mark Polkan was on Stephanie Miller in the last week or so, and he was talking about the bill he set forward that looks at a lawn musk in his nefarious deeds.

And the bill, as he specified it, he could have gone into long legalese, but instead it was, he said, look, if you're a federal employee, you can't get federal contracts.

If you're getting federal contracts,

You can't be a federal employee.

Now I think that Elon Musk has tried to amend that situation, but at the time there was a very clear way to me of stating what the problem is.

And in terms of humor, I was really impressed with, I'm sorry, I should have looked it up before I called, but there was a town called Lancaster, it may be out in PA, I'm not sure, but at any rate, one of their representatives refused to come to a town hall, just bagged on the town hall.

So the people basically created their own.

outside in a public area where they had about 200 people and they had somebody dress up in an inflatable chicken outfit.

And that was supposed to represent the representative.

And then there were 10 questions that they asked the chicken.

And every time the chicken was the chicken's turn to talk, they just did the little chicken broth, you know, because I thought it was, you know, the optics of that and the fact that it does state, you are so weenie that you can't even take questions from your.

Understandably, I raise audience.

It's part of your job, you know, to do that.

So I thought the optics of that were good.

I thought the humor was good.

And I'd be curious to hear what you think about those ideas of just being as brief, if you will, about a statement.

So people don't remember that much.

Their lives are really filled with a lot of stuff.

And it's unreasonable to expect that they're going to remember every detail, every fact.

So I'll hang up and listen to what you have to say, Lisa.

Thanks a lot.

I'll definitely look up your group.

Thanks a lot.

Thanks, Joe, for the call.

Go ahead, Lisa.

Thanks, Joe.

I think that that point about humor is so right.

One of the things that we know that authoritarians hate is being mocked and being made fun of.

And so the more we can use humor to deflect from their harm, the better.

I'm thinking particularly of, I don't know what it was.

it was a while ago there was a neo-nazi rally that was being organized and they were yelling white power and a bunch of people got dressed up as clowns and joined them and shouted white flower and just threw flower in the air all over them and

The group was humiliated and ended up calling off their rally before it was supposed to finish.

And that was, it was really funny.

And so I think that humor is absolutely a part to play.

And then the brevity part, absolutely true to, I don't, I don't think we need long-winded speeches every time we're trying to counter something.

I do think it's important to not ignore what the opposition is saying, though.

What I recommend doing is to not repeat what they are saying, but to just point out why they are saying it and what their intention is behind it.

So instead of saying, um, this person said this and it's not true because of this instead say this person tells lies to try to

make our communities distrust each other because he doesn't want us to notice that he's sneaking into our back pockets and giving tax cuts to his friends.

So pointing out the motivation behind why people are putting all of this bait out there instead of repeating the bait is really important.

And it's important also to have hobbies that are healthy.

And one thing that Lisa Lucas does on the side is she is what she, she's one of two brewer babes.

They have a podcast about the Milwaukee Brewers.

Do you want to just mention what you're doing there, Lisa?

Yeah, it's just a fun little podcast that me and a friend have been doing for a couple of years now.

We were called the Brewer's Babes.

We talk, yeah, thanks for talking about, you know, what's going on with the team.

We try to give updates to folks.

We try to bring a different fan perspective because there's a lot of Brewer's podcasts out there that are very, very good and are also, you know, focused on stats and focused on metrics.

And we can talk about those things, but we really like to highlight the humanity of the players and talk about their lives.

and what they're bringing to the team and how they interact as a group and the fun that they have that we see them have.

And then we also throw in a couple of conspiracy theories every once in a while about OMPs and front offices and the MLB networks.

And how can people find out more about Brewer Babes?

BrewerBabes.com is our website and you can also find us anywhere you get podcasts.

So we're on Spotify.

We're on Apple.

Just search Brewer's Babes.

It'll come up.

We're also on Blue Sky at Brewer's Babes.

There you go.

No, link that into the show notes.

Of Brewery Babes and All In Wisconsin.

Here, I have the hat.

The hat here for people who are watching.

I want one of those.

Thanks so

much for being a guest on The Dom Salvia Show, and we'll be right back.

Thanks,

Matt.

Broadcasting across the state of Wisconsin on the Civic Media Radio Network and around the world on the Civic Media app.

This is the Dom Salvia Show.

And now, here's your host, Dom Salvia.

Actually, not Dom Selvia.

It's Matt Rothschild.

I'm the former executive director at the Wisconsin Democracy Campaign and used to be the editor and publisher of the Progressive Magazine for about three decades.

And now I'm just happy to be on civic media whenever Dom's away and also to be able to be here on usually Wednesday afternoons with Dom and Jess because it's such a fun team to be a part of.

And I want you to be a part of two of this program too by calling 855-752-4842.

That's 855-75 Civic because we're on the Civic Media Radio Network all across the state of Wisconsin.

You can call or text at that line 855-752-4842.

We have a couple of texts I wanted to get to.

Andrew from Maine.

says a big question for him is how to believe the candidates, whether they're for Department of Public Instruction or Wisconsin Supreme Court or any other election for that matter.

That is a real question.

How are the Democratic candidates, Andrew says, going to be any different?

Well, you know, I do resist the temptation.

To say all politicians are bad or all politicians are the same or all politicians are corrupt because I know here in Wisconsin I'm very proud to be represented by Mark Pokan here in the second congressional district I think Tammy Baldwin has done a really good job as one of our senators And I don't believe either of them is corrupt or somehow

Lying in their ads and all the stuff that people mention about candidates and politicians So I think it's important to try to figure out who the politicians are who the candidates are and whether you trust what they say You know check for yourself the comments that they're making or the ads that they're running or the ads that the other groups on their behalf are running I get the cynicism and the disgust with the negative ads that

We all see, I mean, this big money in our politics is ruining our democracy.

And they're just splattering mud on all our screens all the time here whenever there's an election.

So I totally get that and I understand that, Andrew.

We also got a texture from the 608 who liked what Lisa Lucas of all in Wisconsin was talking about and wanted to know more about how important the messenger is versus the message.

You know, I think...

The messenger is important too and the tired old messengers need to step aside You know, I think Chuck Schumer is doing nobody any good over there in the Senate and we need new messengers but and you the listener can be a good messenger with your neighbor with your family members with people you know Who didn't vote last time around when one third of the voting population in this country didn't vote?

and look what we got are people who have voters remorse right now because they didn't know that, you know, Trump was going to make it harder for farmers because of the tariffs and because of the war on immigrants that he's waging right now.

And so, you know, there's an opening there.

There's an opening on the assault on Medicaid that appears to be coming because so many people know.

a close family member who is getting Medicaid, whether it's a grandmother or mother in a nursing home, or whether it's someone in your family who's disabled and needs the Medicaid, or whether it's someone who's just hard on their luck who needs the Medicaid to make it through rent the next month.

or someone who wants to go to Yellowstone, and now the National Park Service is being decimated, and just imagine what it's going to be like at our national parks, or at our wildlife refuge.

There's no one in the headquarters anymore to tell you where to go, or if you want to go...

skiing or snowmobiling the Chiquamagon, NikolayNationalForest.North.

And there's been no one there to make the trails for you.

I mean, this is going to affect people in so many ways.

And so I think that's how we need to start communicating.

But yeah, Lisa Lucas, Dr. Cass Bowers over at All in Wisconsin, tremendous advocates, go to their website, allnwi.org and figure out the best way to talk to your neighbor, the best way to talk to your

family member who now is wondering what the hell Donald Trump is bringing down on all our heads.

So I'm delighted now to have as my co-host, Angela Lange.

She's often my co-host here when Dom's away and it's terrific to have Angela.

Angela is the executive director at Block Black Leaders Organizing for Communities.

How you doing, Angela?

I'm good.

Thanks for having me.

I'm excited.

And it sounds like you had a good hour.

I had a board meeting, so I wasn't able to listen, but

Just want to underscore, all in Wisconsin, Dr. Kaz Bowers and Lisa Lucas, they are the ones to really try to bridge this gap, I think, in Wisconsin.

And we, as Block, work with them very closely as well, too.

And I just can't say enough about their work, especially in a state like Wisconsin, where we have a lot of geographical divides and this urban and rural type of conversation.

constantly always bubbling up in this tension and they're able to kind of bridge that gap in answering the question about messengers.

Yes, messengers are incredibly important.

It's a lot easier for you to have conversations with your neighbors, you know, where they feel a little bit safer or maybe they, you know, maybe don't have the right language.

So, you know, they feel safe and comfortable talking to you because, you know, you're not going to judge them versus if I cold knock on their door.

So the messenger absolutely plays a part of it.

And I think what

Is a beautiful thing about democracy is that we all can be messengers in our own networks

Famous line from June Jordan or June Jordan poem.

We are the people we've been waiting for and It was a great pleasure of mine actually to work with June Jordan at the progressive back in the day So tremendous poet.

We ran one of her poems last week.

I think wasn't it just poem about my rights Yeah,

it

was just an incredible we only ran a minute of it.

We couldn't run some of it

because of the language, but it is a very strong poem that I recommend everybody take a listen to if you can.

But yeah, it's been a fun show so far, at least Lucas at all in Wisconsin, and then in the first half hour at Heather Dubois-Bernand from Wisconsin Public Education Network.

Also a good partner that I work closely with.

So it's just been fun.

I just love the opportunity that Dom gives me when he's away to get on here and get some of the activists and leaders in the tremendous nonprofit sector that we have here in Wisconsin, who I don't think get enough platforms and enough microphones.

So whenever I have an opportunity, I try to pass the mic around and also having you on is just one way to do it too, because you're doing such great work.

It blocked.

Why don't you tell the listeners just a bit about block?

Yeah, so we're just a little over a month from our next election.

So Black is a year-round civic engagement organization that started in 2017 in some ways in response to the 2016 election and Trump being elected.

But also in a lot of ways, I saw some really harmful narratives about who was to blame and blaming Black voters when, in my opinion,

Black voters are some of the most least engaged and most disenfranchised.

And so instead of having an honest conversation of how do we reach voters, we were to blame.

And that didn't set well with me.

And so being able to leverage some networks and some folks that I knew, being able to kind of try and fill that gap of how do we have year round civic engagement, not just in a time of an election.

So yes, right now the team was out knocking doors.

We have a community meeting on Saturday.

We have our community meetings once a month.

getting off the vote for the April election.

And we'll be having an interview with Susan Crawford and Dr. Jill Underly later this week as well, too, to make potential endorsements.

We'll see how they go.

Fingers crossed, I am encouraged.

But ultimately, it's up to our team of ambassadors who do this work.

So we're excited and we're excited for after April when we'll have a solid 10 months with no elections and we can organize.

And one of the neat things you do at Block is, yeah, doing this organizing when it's not.

election time, unlike, you know, the traditional way where, you know, from Washington, you know, organizers are parachuted in and telling people what the most important issue is in their community and they don't even know their community.

That

always rub me the wrong way.

And I admire greatly the work that you're doing there.

Why do you think this April 1st election is so important, Angela?

Lots of reasons.

One, I think it's important because people are kind of tapped out.

I think there's a lot of voter fatigue and we got to make sure that we're showing up for every election.

We had a couple of text messages recently when we were telling folks about the primary.

They were like, yeah, whatever, shut up.

The election's over.

And we're like, actually, no, there's the primary and then there's the April election.

So it's important to make sure that we're still focused.

We do have the state Supreme Court, which will yet again determine the ideological makeup of the Supreme Court.

And we know what that means, our rights, redistricting, all sorts of things like that.

And we also have our state superintendent that is up for a reelection against someone who has been.

closely aligned with the Trump administration.

So interesting to have a state superintendent candidates who was also aligned with the same party that wants to get rid of the Department of Education.

So that is interesting.

And the last thing that I'll mention is that there is a constitutional amendment on the ballot, which would basically codify our already existing voter ID law.

And we all know that it's just a Republican ploy to boost turnout for the Supreme Court race.

It is already existing law and codified.

in the Constitution will make it harder to get off the books and hopefully at one point try to overturn that.

So we are encouraging people to vote no and we want to do a lot of education around that as well.

You know, even Brad Schimel admitted that.

Schimel, who's running as the conservative of the Wisconsin Supreme Court, admitted that voter ID, which he was involved with there when he was

in the

Walker administration as attorney general, he was bragging about Trump winning in 2016, in part because of voter ID.

And this is what Todd Albaugh, the Todd Albaugh show has been talking about forever because to his everlasting credit, he resigned after being chief of staff for a Republican Senate Majority Leader, Dale Schultz, when he

other Republican state senators in the cloakroom after the vote on voter ID being giddy.

Giddy was the word that Todd used.

Giddy, that they were disenfranchising who they were disenfranchising, people of color and young people.

one Republican after another in private or in public bragging about how this was working out for them so well, including Brad Schimmel.

So it's just crucially important for people to get out and vote.

And, you know, this Wisconsin Supreme Court race will determine reproductive rights in Wisconsin, labor rights in Wisconsin, Act 10 is coming up again.

Jerry Mandarin, you mentioned Angela, that's going to be big and a whole slew of environmental issues.

You

know,

this is a really important race and we need to turn out the vote.

I know people are

feeling beleaguered by Trump in the onslaught, but hey.

We can do something about that.

In fact, this is the first opportunity to do something about that in an election.

And that's why I think everyone who is disgusted by what Trump is doing, by this authoritarianism, fascism, if you will, that's coming down from on high, who don't like Elon Musk and what Elon Musk is doing to the federal government and federal government employees and programs.

This is an opportunity, April 1st, to get out and show your disgust and vote for Susan Crawford.

I want to come back and talk about the Trump Cabinet meeting

that happened.

We'll be right back here on the Dom Salvia show with Angela Lang and me, Matt Rothschild.

So stay tuned and prepare to text and call us about your view about that cabinet

meeting.

Matt

Rothschild here, seven in for Dom on the Dom Salvia show.

Always nice to hear Jimi Hendrix improving on Bob Dylan.

My co-host today for the rest of the show, Angela Lang of Block, and I want to invite you, the caller, to weigh in here on Trump.

In his cabinet meeting with Elon Musk today, the number to call 855-752-4842, or text, same number, 855-75 Civic.

That's 855.

You know the 855.

Focus on the 752-4842.

You'll get through in a hurry and happy to hear what you think.

But I want to know right off the bat what Angela Lang thought about this cabinet

meeting.

I shouldn't be surprised by anything anymore these days.

I also don't understand how we have an unelected person like in these cabinet meetings calling the shot.

Like I've just seen clips and I fear that we've strayed so far that we're starting to normalize the smaller things.

Um, you know, because there's so many big fires to be thinking about and to be putting out.

But, you know, if you take a giant step backwards, like why is someone like Elon Musk, who is a billionaire, who has like bought his way into helping co-govern this country?

Why, why is that?

That is a big, that we, yeah, that it was stunning.

I had to kind of double check and was like, this is, this is real.

This is happening.

Okay.

I don't

know about this.

You know.

$240 million or something he spent to get Donald Trump elected.

And now he's essentially co-president or deputy president, depending on how you want to look at it, but extraordinarily powerful.

You know, he gets up in the cabinet meeting today and I guess we have some audio on it, don't we?

Let's play a little

bit.

Unfortunately, let's sure.

Where do you want to start?

Why

don't you start with.

Elon Musk saying he was just a techie.

Sure, sure.

I'd like to have Elon Musk please say a few words.

Thank you, Elon.

Thank you, Mr. President.

Well, I should just put myself a couple tech support here because this is actually, as crazy as it sounds, that that is almost a literal description of the work that those team is doing.

I mean, that's not a literal description of what he's doing there.

It's not even close.

It's not even in the ballpark.

He's dismantling our government and firing federal employees by the thousands.

That's not what tech support does.

They're not fixing the internet connection that these agencies, they're getting rid of people.

Tech support also doesn't try to steal like the American people's like data and information and whatnot.

I'm pretty sure even, I don't even know, I'm sure different tech companies have some different agreements about like you can't do other people's data that you are seeing and privy to.

I haven't seen some organizations when you're using our voter database, there's like a thing signed that you're not going to use this data for the various things.

And these are just smaller organizations and tech companies, but yet a man running our government is allowed to just.

do whatever he wants from the inside and dismantle it from the inside and Trump is just letting him.

It's so disgraceful.

And there was Trump.

Let's hear the audio about Trump kind of laughing about any of the cabinet members.

Have any problem with Elon Musk?

Let the cabinet speak just

for a second.

If you are, we'll throw him out of here.

So if you couldn't hear that because of the giggling and the sycophantic clapping, he was saying, is there anyone unhappy with Elon?

If you are, we'll throw them out of here, which means if you're a cabinet member and you didn't like Elon Musk telling all of the employees in your agency that you were just confirmed to run, that they have, you know, 24 hours or 48 hours to list the five things they did last week, then you're going to be kicked out of the cabinet meeting and probably lose your job.

I mean,

as

an executive director of an organization, I seek to build consensus.

I very rarely make a sole decision by myself, right?

But that doesn't sound like a supportive work environment of saying, hey, if you disagree, we're going to throw you out, right?

It literally just feels like a one man show, or maybe two, depending.

But this whole kind of king dynamic is what's happening.

And it's just interesting that at some point people will start to maybe lash out given how they're treated, whether it's also internally or the American people.

Well, and also I think, you know, Elon Musk is a lot less popular than Donald Trump is.

And to the extent that Elon Musk is the face of the administration, it's going to hurt Trump himself.

I don't think he's realized that yet.

He just loves, you know, sitting next to, you know, the richest man in the world.

I think he gets his jollies that way, which is kind of sick too.

And then, you know, they're in this mutual admiration society.

Why don't we play Musk complimenting Trump on the cabinet that he's built, Jess, if you've got that one.

And President Trump has put together, I think, the best candidate ever.

And I do not give false praise.

This is an incredible group of people.

I don't think that such a talented team has actually ever been assembled.

The group full

of racist predators, sexual abusers, all the things homophobic, transphobic, yeah, real great group of people, real great.

And so well qualified to Pete Exeth, really.

RFK Jr., Tulsi Gabbard, Linda McMahon, and Education.

I mean, to have- The

look of on and

on.

And it was just, I mean, it is out of a kind of a thorough dictatorship or out of a Woody Allen bananas movie where you're just, you know, you've got to bow down and kiss the guy's ring.

And so, yeah, there's Elon Musk.

in this mutual admiration society with Donald Trump.

And it was just disgusting to behold.

And all the other cabinet members were just there yucking it up.

And that's where we are right now.

We have an authoritarian in power.

We have a kind of mad billionaire as his deputy or co-president.

And also, the thing that Elon Musk kept saying was, we're gonna go bankrupt.

We're gonna go bankrupt

basically

any day now if we don't cut a trillion dollars.

Well, they wanna cut the trillion dollars so they can give

You know, huge tax cuts to Elon Musk and Donald Trump and people like them.

And also the

idea that the United States is going to go bust because we're running a deficit is just false and has been proven false for the last, you know, 30 decades, three decades.

We can always

just tax the rich, you know, just saying.

Well, yeah, you can have an inheritance tax, tax the top.

income like they did during Eisenhower's day where it was taxed at 92%.

But that's not what Elon Musk wants or Donald Trump wants.

So

we'll talk more about Trump and Gaza video he put out when we come back, if you can believe that on the Dom Salvia show on the Civic Media Radio Network.

The Dom Salvis Show, Matt Rothschild here, guest hosting with Angela Lang of Block.

We're going to ask to listen to a couple of callers and answer your questions.

And you too can call at 855-752-4842.

That's 855-75 Civic all across the Civic Media Radio Network, which we're honored to be able to be on right now.

So we've got a call, a first time caller from Ruth.

Ruth from Eau Claire, you're on the line.

What's on your mind, Ruth?

Yeah, I know that for people that can seem like that the grassroots isn't doing that much.

And so there's some frustration about that.

But I want to point out, of course, there's a lot going on in communities.

One of the things that happened yesterday was a protest at Senator Johnson's office in Madison.

This is someone who doesn't answer his phone.

This is someone who, you know, doesn't listen to his constituents.

He sees himself as a soldier for Donald Trump, but not for the people he represents.

But there was a large protest yesterday, very short time frame to put it together, but there were like, people from all across the state, 250 to 350, depending upon, you know, there's somewhere in between there.

So maybe about 400 people showed up.

Medicaid was sort of the pinnacle of it, but there were other issues and concerns represented, you know, like schools and healthcare.

And just, you know, democracy.

So it was, it was very effective.

There was an appointment with one of Johnson staffers who just didn't show.

And of course, Johnson didn't show because he doesn't show up.

So there are things going on.

And so this was in Madison.

WPR covered it.

Local radio stations and TV stations in Madison covered it.

And just gave people a place to come and use their voice.

You know Ruth from

Eau Claire.

Thanks so much for that call.

I actually was at that protest myself

Look at

that.

Yeah, and it was it was really inspiring to see I've been doing headcounts at protest for 40 years.

I counted about 400 people

and

Mostly elderly mostly caring signs about Medicaid many

of them were

family members who were people who have family members who rely on

on Medicaid for someone who may be disabled in their family.

I took a picture of one woman who held up a picture of a loved one who needed Medicaid.

And this idea that they're going to slash $880 million out of Medicaid, and it's just going to be disastrous for people.

They're not going to get away with that.

And there were some great signs, too.

I love the homemade signs.

People were able to grab a sign and write whatever they want on it.

And the chants were great.

Stop the coup was won.

Elon has got to go with another.

Ron Johnson, do your job was another one.

Vote him out was another chant.

And it wasn't just in Madison.

I saw there was a protest in Milwaukee as well.

And they're going to be more and more of these.

And there have been protests, of course, at Glen Growthman's Town

Hall.

or it fits Gerald's town hall and I guess they're not going to be doing town halls after this because they want to face the music.

But

they're making.

they're making national news though, which is good.

You know, you turn on MSNBC or CNN or whoever and people are talking about how these are typically Republican districts, right?

Not even just like Madison and Milwaukee, but Republican districts and largely Republican voters are showing up upset.

And so what does that mean?

I also think, you know, keeping on the topic of Elon and coup and, you know, busting his way into our democracy, we're even seeing that here,

locally, right?

Like he's dumped in two million-ish dollars into, yeah, so far.

Thank you.

So far.

We assume there's more into Brad Schimel's campaign.

And so that is a direct through line through our state, through our state's highest court of the Trump administration.

And I think that is something that's really important about why the April election is so important, too.

Yeah, do you really want Elon Musk to decide who's going to be the Wisconsin Supreme Court Justice?

Do you want Elon Musk to decide if abortion, if you should have an abortion or not?

Because that's what it basically is.

Or whether we should have fair maps here, whether we should have labor rights here.

But yeah, I mean, he doesn't believe in any of that.

No,

he just wants his Tesla company to be able to have unregulated sales in Wisconsin.

Well, no, if you want to see a picture.

of Elon Musk eating hummus.

You can find that at a video that Trump put out on his

social

network.

It's called Trump in Gaza.

It's this fantasy that the Trump people came up with a video showing Elon Musk eating hummus and Donald Trump and Benjamin Netanyahu lying down half naked on a beach.

It is

disturbing.

As they're turning Gaza into what?

Cancun or something?

And the only Palestinians that are represented are first victims who are walking through rubble and then belly dancers.

It's one of the most disgusting things I've ever seen.

Do we have any audio on that, Jess?

Unfortunately.

Oh,

just briefly, because I can't handle much.

All right.

Well, if your ears start bleeding, I do apologize.

TROPGASA

I want all this timeline It's disturbing like if you actually watch the video which I think people should But caution because it is disturbing on multiple levels.

It's like this weird AI I did not just need to see an AI version of Donald Trump shirtless like I did not need to see that No, it's also disturbing because it's dehumanizing gross and sick and to see this put out as like a

thing from our president with

enormous golden statues of yeah multiple enormous golden statues

you

can find it at Mother

Jones yeah motherjones.com has it if you have the appetite for that which I really don't have

our commenter mark says it's a parody it's funny

whatever

Somebody in the comments said that we all died in the pandemic, and this is what our terrible afterlife looks like.

This

is the seventh circle of

hell we're in.

It makes more sense than what we're seeing.

So I guess I'll take that analysis interpretation.

Jess, do we still have a caller online?

We do.

We still have Cam from Appleton, one of Donald's stomping grounds.

All right, let's hear from Cam.

Cam, you're on.

Hey, I think John Stewart was the one that originally had said that we died during COVID and we're in hell now.

I wanted to encourage those that are voting now and in the future until we get these voting stuff fixed.

If you are anything but white, please try to vote in person.

Greg Palace is a very reliable source for election data.

Civic media has had him on before, and I believe he cited around a 400% increase of a chance for your ballot to not get counted, period, if you are African American or Latina, Latinx.

I'm very bad at remembering the terminology there, so excuse me for that, but it's frustrating that I even feel like I need to bring it up, but I don't want people feeling like their voices weren't counted and then just not voting altogether going forward.

Cam, thanks for the call.

Angela, what do you make of that?

How important is it to vote in person versus just voting absentee or voting early voting?

Yeah, you know, I'll say one, you know, I think especially now in this landscape.

there's a lot of nefarious things happening first and foremost.

So I'm not gonna like deny that.

I think there's some healthy skepticism right now.

I also, multiple things can be true.

I wanna give a shout out to all the election workers.

We particularly as a staff always early vote at the Capitol Drive location and they always get excited to see us.

They are very efficient and we always make a point to thank them for the work that they do because we're attacking election workers.

Now, all of that said, I do know that we've talked to a lot of our elders in the community.

A lot of folks were like, I'm voting on election day.

They have their routine.

It's like they get up, sometimes they dress in their Sunday best.

They're one of the first ones in line at 7 AM, and that is their routine.

And even in the pandemic, when there was an increase and kind of an explosion of vote by mail, people were a little skeptical of it because people wanted to see their ballot go in the machine.

They want to see that.

And we also know that there has been some challenges, especially in 2020, about people not even receiving the ballots by mail.

I know people never even got their ballot to this day for what I call the pandemic election.

And so I think a lot of times people, especially elder Black

folks and I say elder because there's that historical context there of like understanding the importance and it's not a responsibility our community takes lightly especially knowing the civil rights movement and what it took to get here and so that's why people are like yeah voting early or voting absentee may be a little bit more convenient.

But people just in their mind feel so strongly about that responsibility that they were like, I want to see it go in the machine.

I want to get my sticker instead of just voting by mail.

But I think all of that is to say that there's multiple options and there's multiple ways.

And our job is to make sure that people have multiple avenues.

If you requested your ballot too late, there's still an option.

This is what you can do.

So whatever people prefer, but I understand the healthy skepticism.

And at the same time, the poll workers

for the most part, at least the ones that I talked to, are not up to anything nefarious.

And they have to do their best to keep up with the ever-changing rules and policy changes and rule changes from the Wisconsin Election Commission.

So I think that there's a fine line to walk.

I think there's healthy skepticism understanding the world that we're living in and also acknowledging the hard work that our election workers do too.

Yeah.

And I'm of the view that, you know, vote any way

you feel most comfortable.

It's just really important that you vote in this April 1st election.

You know, I'm going to vote early absentee.

And, you know, I'm kind of goofy about the post office.

So I actually, my wife and I fill out our absentee belts and go drive it over to the clerk's office and physically hand it to the clerk just so we

know it's gotten

there.

But whatever you're comfortable with, whether it's in person on April 1st, in person, two weeks early, absentee.

whatever.

It's just really important to vote and encourage your friends and family members to vote.

Spring elections, usually the voter turnout isn't super high.

It's

really

important to vote because of the Wisconsin Supreme Court race and the superintendent's race.

You know, what kind of state are we going to have?

Do we

want to go back to

where there's a conservative majority on the Wisconsin Supreme Court?

Three of the four were perfectly willing to throw out hundreds of thousands of legally cast votes and

hand our

state over to Donald Trump, even though we didn't win the popular vote in 2020.

And that's why it matters so much, that in abortion and labor rights and environmental protections and all sorts of safeguards that we've

grown accustomed to, you

know,

everything, everything's on the line.

And if we haven't learned anything in the last, you know, 12 years, you know, after the Scott Walker counter revolution, it's, you know, statewide race is really important, not

just

for president.

And what I'll say too is, you know, if people choose to early vote, I personally am a fan of early voting.

We all early vote as a team, as a kind of our tradition.

But what you can do if you're on social media or not is I always like, usually in like an early vote center, there's some sort of like, I voted backdrop or some sort of, you know, vote here thing, some sort of signage.

I like to take a quick selfie by the signage.

And then you can post that on your social media.

And then people see that in the last couple of days of early voting and they start to make a plan and they're reminded you're not on social media.

media isn't your thing.

You can text that picture to 10 of your friends that said, Hey, guess what?

I voted today.

It was super easy.

I was in and out.

Here's the my vote website where you can find your polling place.

There's ways that we can again be trusted messengers by just showing example of how easy it was for us to vote.

Yeah, there you go.

We'll be right back for the closing segment here.

Tell us something good in a poem by Clint Smith.

You don't want to miss that.

I'm going to Chicago.

That's the last place my baby stayed.

It's high.

Yeah.

It's

high,

baby.

I'm packing up my bags.

Gonna leave this old town right away.

It's high.

It's high.

It's high, baby.

I've got to find that girl.

Dom always does, and Jess too, tell us something good, which is a great idea.

So if you want to tell us something good, something hopeful, something that gives you inspiration, call us or text us.

855-752-4842.

I'm Matt Rothschild.

I've been subbing in here for Dom this afternoon.

I'll be with you tomorrow.

I want to thank Heather Dubois-Bernon of the Wisconsin Public Education Network, Lisa Lucas of All In Wisconsin, and my co-host oftentimes, Angela Lange here of Block.

And Jess P.S., who does a tremendous job on the Dom Salvia Show.

It should be the Dom and Jess Show, I think.

Change the name.

And I want to thank the callers too and textures.

You know, every time I'm on, I try to bring a poem.

And for Black History Month, I had a sampling of Langston Hughes, June Jordan.

I got read a dove tomorrow.

But right now, I want Clint Smith.

Clint Smith is a contemporary poet with a very powerful voice.

Let's hear what he has to say, and then we'll get to some quick good news.

One night when I was 12 years old, on an overnight field trip to another city, my friends and I bought super soakers.

turned the hotel parking lot into our own water-filled battle zone.

We hid behind cars, running through the darkness that lay between the streetlights.

Boundless laughter ubiquitous across the pavement.

But within 10 minutes, my father came outside, grabbed me by my forearm, and led me into our room with an unfamiliar grip.

Before I could say anything, tell him I foolishly made me look in front of my friends.

He derided me for being so naive.

looked me in the eye, fear consuming his face, and said, son, I'm sorry, but you can't act the same as your white friends.

You can't pretend to shoot guns.

You can't run around in the dark.

You can't hide behind anything other than your own teeth.

I know now how scared he must have been, how easily I could have fallen into the empty of the night that some man would mistake this water.

for a good reason to wash all of this away.

These are the sorts of messages I was inundated with my entire life.

Always keep your hands where they can see them.

Don't move too quickly.

Take off your hood when the sun goes down.

My parents raised me and my siblings in an armor of advice, an ocean of alarm bells, so someone wouldn't steal the breath from our lungs, so that they wouldn't make a memory of this skin, so that we could be kids, not casket or concrete.

And it's not because they thought it would make us better than anyone else.

It's simply because they wanted to keep us alive.

All of my black friends were raised with the same message.

The talk, given to us when we became old enough to be mistaken for a nail, ready to be hammered to the ground when people made our melanin synonymous with something to be feared.

But what does it do to a child?

To grow up knowing that you cannot simply be a child, that the whims of adolescence are too dangerous for your breath, that you cannot simply be curious, that you are not afforded the luxury of making a mistake, that someone's implicit bias might be the reason you don't wake up in the morning.

But this cannot be what defines us.

It's way of parents who raised us to understand that our bodies weren't meant for the backside of a bullet, but for flying kites and jumping rope and laughing until our stomachs burst.

We had teachers who taught us how to raise our hands in class and not just to signal surrender.

That the only thing we should give up is the idea that we aren't worthy of this world.

So when we say that black lives matter, it's not because others don't.

It's simply because we must affirm that we are worthy of existing without fear.

When there are so many things that tell us we are not, I want to live in a world where my son will not be

He presumed guilty the moment he is born.

Where a toy in his hand isn't mistaken for anything other than a toy.

And I refuse to accept that we can't build this world to something new.

Some place where a child's name does not be written on a t-shirt or a tombstone where the value of someone's life isn't determined by anything other than the fact that they had lungs.

A place where every single one of us can breathe.

That's Clint Smith with a power.

I wanna help build that world with an amazing poem.

Tell us something good.

Well, I have something good to report.

I heard and then saw the first sand hill crane of spring and right over my house in southern Dane County.

And I think we have just 20 seconds of that call.

Do we have it, Jess?

Can we play it?

Here it is.

That's awesome.

Yeah, that got me out of my chair and opened the door and looked where and there was in the blue sky.

Angela, do you have something good to share?

I would say, yeah, about a week ago, oddly enough, the Wisconsin State Assembly formally recognized February as Black History Month.

It's something that had been going back and forth, and it had been controversy, and people would bring it up, and it hadn't been voted on, because we

know the legislature.

About time.

So finally, and in these dark times, especially seeing that now as DEI and all these things are happening racially to know that Wisconsin finally did it right.

It took longer than expected, but here we are.

We can hopefully take baby steps.

Well, that's that's a long time coming.

We got it done.

Congratulations on your work and trying to get it done.

Jess, what do you got?

Well, I went for a little walk and I noticed that on every tree that I passed, there were tiny little buds coming out.

So

just

like you heard and saw some

early sand hill cranes.