BUSPENCES
Yeah,
GRIFFTOSE PENCES AND BUST THEM
12 shows of Christmas
You don't wanna miss this
Johnny Luke Panex
I am man aggressive intro music
Oh, I love it man the anthem of the Christmas season busted pencils Jacob how many shows till Christmas?
This is our fifth show of Christmas out of 12 shows of Christmas. So we're really coming up close on it right now.
I'm pretty excited more. Yeah, I mean I did I got that whole group of musicians in the orchestra and everything and it's a lot of work.
Certainly did not just use AI to do it and Tim showed me how totally not anything like that but I'm glad you guys liked it.
I, man, I just just like, I love it. You know, it's like, yeah, but you know being the fifth.
This is that weird one in the song where five.
It's golden rings. It's golden rings. You bifte it immediately Tim.
Hey, look at my time right now, man, I've already done 10 hours plus of having my cognitive brain cells being drained.
So yeah, golden, but I'm just thinking, you know, what is the comparable? Is it, you know,
what is golden busted pencil shows? There how's that I agree?
Five, five golden pencils. I love it. Oh, yeah, golden pencils. All right, Jacob, it is your show though, man, it is producer's choice.
And I'm big dog on the boards. I'm so tired. I'm not nervous.
Tim, you got no reason to be nervous because it's the fifth show of Christmas.
We're all just here to get along in this wonderful holiday season.
And I'm not even going to give you a hard time. We're just going to go straight into the intro for two, two, producer.
A Jacob's choice, chairman of the board.
You and I will have two choices.
Chairman of the board, Jacob.
Oh, Jacob chairman of the board.
I bet the board is spelled B-O-R-E-D.
We choose to go to the moon.
Life's full of tough choices in here.
We chose one.
Folks, today is December 12, 2025, which means that we're just about towards the end of what we like to call
finals season here in the US.
Thank you for that, that of affirmation, Tim.
I feel I feel that my speech was good.
It's a time when students around America are buckling down, going over their flashcards,
and trying their best to make up for not having paid attention to class over the last few months.
All this talk about studying has got me thinking though, fellas, about my own experiences as a student trying to prepare for tests and
it's made me question whether or not I was studying the right way or just putting myself through a whole bunch of unnecessary rigour moral.
In order to set me straight, I've asked two experts in studying to join me on the show today.
Dr. Tim Slecker, Dr. Johnny Lupinacci, welcome back to the producer's choice show.
Hey, happy to be here. Let's go producer's choice.
Now, I know that you guys are not exactly the biggest fans of standardized testing.
So don't take this to mean that we're endorsing it.
I'm just saying that for a lot of people, students and teachers, they do have to deal with this stuff,
even though we're not fans of it.
So we're going to give some tips and tricks to our fellow students and educators out there about testing season.
I'm going to start out with a very simple question and I think I'll go to Dr. Tim Slecker first,
because he's my favorite guy, but maybe I'll go to Johnny instead.
Johnny, it's you get to go first because I saw a look of horror in Tim's eyes.
Johnny, my first question.
How did you study for big tests back when you were a student?
Oh, Jacob.
You know, everyone knows that knows me knows I was quite the avid studier.
No, man, it was a grind for me.
You know, I would say I was a big.
This isn't I put me on the spot.
I thought you were going to ask me what I would share as advice for studying.
I didn't do what I would advise.
Do as I say, not as I do.
But I was big on, I was big on crammy, especially, you know, for big tests and for, you know, final exams,
it is final exam season for so many of our of our listeners.
If you're in college, this is final exam week, most places.
If you're in high school, it's probably here or coming not to shortly after the new year break.
And I feel like if you're in any grades lower than eighth grade, you're taking standardized tests, big tests all the time.
So it's always study time for you, which is a bummer.
But, you know, I was a big crammer, Jacob, I want that means for folks listening if you have heard of cramming.
It's when instead of, you know, doing what I would preach you do is, you know, study things as you learn them, you know, commit it to long term memory.
Come up with examples, maybe even Tim might like this, you know, use AI to help you come up with the good study plan.
And, you know, maybe 20 minutes to a half hour, maybe even 40 minutes a night.
You kind of go over what you've been learning. And, and by the time you're taking those tests, it's all there.
I would advise that, but, but realistically, Jacob, I was, you know, I would do that maybe once a week, twice a week as a student.
And if there was an exam, I was a big cram guy three days before the exam, I'd start making study sheets.
I start going over things. I was a big flashcards guy. I love flashcards. I know I'm dating myself now.
But I always had, you know, boxes, shoe boxes full of three by five cards.
And I would write information on there, especially the memorizing stuff. Like if you have a lot of vocabulary in a bio or anatomy class, right?
I would do a lot of writing that the concept down, flip it over, write the definition and kind of, you know, just cram put a lot of information into short term memory.
Exactly what us educators preach isn't good learning. I would do and I had, you know, pretty, pretty high success at taking tests.
So I'm not the guy to ask about this. I didn't have test anxiety. I'm a big game time guy. You know, I'm always talking about my sports.
I love the adrenaline of a big game, like taking a test, sitting down and crushing a test.
So the other thing Jacob, I would do is I would psych myself up, just building confidence.
And what I do know as an educator is that if you have some confidence going into your test, right?
It's good for a few more points. It's not going to save you. It's not a, it's not like a life preserver to keep you afloat if you're really struggling.
But, you know, I'd cram short term memory, a lot of stuff, low hanging fruit questions on the exams.
And I'd psych myself up, kind of do a little rocky routine before I'd be all like getting pumped up, get the adrenaline go and get the blood flowing in the body.
Maybe do some push ups, right? Maybe do a little jogging in place, some shadow boxing.
And I'd sit down with my sharpened pencils and get ready to go.
That was another thing Jacob was big on his tools of the trade, both as a teacher and as a student.
I always like to have pencils and a little sharpener ready to go if it was one of those kinds of exams.
Again, I'm dating myself. I think kids these days take exams on computers.
So I don't know what I would do. Maybe like do some finger stretches for your keyboarding, right?
But I love to have, you know, nice good pens or sharp pencils and some backups and then a little pencil sharpener.
So I didn't have to get out of my seat. If I needed, I could just switch to a new pencil every couple of pages and the exam in Tim.
Do you remember blue books?
Man, I just had a flashback when Jacob asked about us taking tests.
I always, you know, would always make sure Jacob, this is going to date ourselves again.
But listeners out there, I bet you took exams like Tim and I did.
I always made sure I had a fresh stock of scan trunks and blue books for exam week.
So that I always had, you know, I knew I had the nightmare ahead of exams and I still have it where I go to the exam.
And I don't have a scan tron or a blue book to take the exam.
And I have to run to the college bookstore and get those and get back and rush through my exam and whatever remaining time is left.
That's one of my reoccurring nightmares that I have around testing.
But Jacob, that's my long-winded way of don't do as I say, don't do more as I say, don't do as I did.
And I was big on cramming.
I think it's only human to have nightmares like that.
But Johnny, I have a question for you.
And I think I'd be remiss if I didn't ask this question for, you know, as a representative of the young person in this world.
What in the Sam hell is a blue book?
Oh, good question.
Jacob, let me bring a good producer.
Yeah, Tim, you take it away.
And Dr. Stone cipher 1985 American history one little Tim Slecker sitting in his first college level history lecture.
Dr. Stone cipher three times throughout the 15 week semester.
We had a test where we had to remember just about, oh my God, everything he talked about for what four weeks in Jacob, the way we had to prove that we knew what Dr.
Stone cipher gave and presented to us was a little, what is called a blue book?
It is a very cheap, covered in blue, many note book essentially that you sign your name to the front of it.
You open it up and you just write the answers to the essay questions to whatever you want.
It's a, it's a blue book and it was specifically for that test and the blue book was only handed to you that day in class.
You only come with a writing instrument or two.
Don't be bringing a blue book already filled out on your own somewhere.
You had to sit there in that class and you had to remember that, you know, there were lots of important things that happened in that first phase of American history, particularly the essay questions.
Jacob, yeah, the blue book, I mean, you know, it's a very simple, very flimsy, cheap, kind of like a half size notebook where you got to show what you knew or, or you turned it in blank on oil.
Dr. Stone cipher ways to that blue book.
But, you know, and what's interesting, just a quick deviation with the advent or invent or the imposition or the influence of AI.
More faculty are returning to using the blue book as a method of assessment today for that idea of going, you're not going to come in and use AI on me, buddy.
I got you beat, I got a secret weapon from way back, the blue book, the blue book is anti AI, AI proof, blue book.
That's the blue book. So how did I though get ready for Dr. Stone cipher's test?
OMG, I'm not sure I was a grammar as much as I was a warrior.
I, I, the anxiety of getting ready for any exam for me was, was really painful.
You know, it was for me, thinking about that was just, I would get distressed and distraught.
And the only way I could bring myself down was is that I literally, this is funny if there was kind of blue book preparation, I would just sit down and write out everything I thought I knew as a way to prepare myself for the exam.
I mean, I just like, I had to, you know, sit there and write it out, write it out, write it out. And that was my biggest preparation.
Group preparation, sometimes was, was, was helpful, except for those times when the group knew what they were doing and I didn't.
And then I didn't want to feel like a dummy in the group. So, so I would just be like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I get it.
And then when I get my, you know, after a D back in class, I wouldn't show them a group there. But no, I mean, yeah, I, it was a dog, it kind of weird thing.
And I'm not sure that that's good or bad. I will say, though, it wasn't, quote, the same type of pain and torture that I think you Jacob, my son, my daughter went through in the continuous high stakes bombardment of the potential that this test may or may not be the end of your, you know, your academic career.
You may not graduate kindergarten, you may not graduate high school.
It was, you know, I guess in one way, I feel like there was a little bit more honesty in the assessments that I prepared for, because it was related directly to the content.
And it was mostly trying to measure my sense of whether I kind of got it, you know, I'm not going to say that that isn't fraught with all kinds of problems.
But there was an honesty to the fact that what I was preparing for was directly going to be connected to migrate.
And it wasn't this just bombardment of constantly trying to, you know, either evaluate, say where you're at and to the point where, you know, I say a lot of kids and develop a real fear of testing.
And, you know, and thank you, no child left behind for really ramping that up, but, you know, pre no child left behind, I don't know, maybe there was a little bit more purity.
I'm not going to say it was great assessment either, but the fact that it was, maybe I say there was a localness to it and that localness, I think, had more relevance as opposed to other things.
You know, Johnny just hitting the bass drum right there would.
So Jacob, that, that, that was mine. You know, a lot of test anxiety that I kind of got through by writing out everything I knew and then knowing that I didn't know something and then just trying to quiz myself and then write it out again.
There you go, man. And Jacob, now you know what a blue book is.
I've learned so much and I'm just wondering, you know, I've learned about the blue book. I've learned about your, your studying habits as students yourselves.
But how am I going to remember all this when you quiz me at the end of the show.
And that's something I think a lot of students out there are wondering who listen to busted pencils and then try to remember everything.
What, what do you guys recommend in terms of actually good ideas for how to study for our students out there.
Maybe we can start with you Tim. I know there's as many different, you know, alleged methods of, oh, this is actually the way to do it.
This is the way to do it. Everyone's got an idea as many ideas as there are students. But what do you think? I mean, what is a good idea for how a student out there should approach studying for their exams?
It's all right.
I don't believe in studying.
Oh, really?
I mean, I think a study in studying is again, I'm going to say, I didn't agree with what I had to do.
But, but I'm pretty positive that that type of anxiety and again, preparing the long term, you know, commitment to a memory to a change in behavior to, quote, being better.
I'm not sure that the exam, as we're talking about it, is actually a good way to have students demonstrate that they've learned something.
I think it's an efficient way. I think it's a cheap way.
I think that we take a lot for granted in that we believe that, therefore, the, the greatest student get is somehow the, the, the representation of learning.
I think that's the best that it's a proxy.
And I don't think that if you put that proxy under scrutiny, that it really holds up to being truly, what you would say, you know, a reliable way of actually saying that somebody is learned.
And I think a lot of that has to come back to the simplicity of believing that we can quantify the idea, the act of learning.
I'm more and more convinced is as I get older and older, I'm more radical on this and believing that any quantifying attempt at learning is, is really just somebody admitting they don't really know how to do.
I don't really know how to measure and talk about learning. So I, so good at now, no test, no test in terms class.
So now, listen out there's gone, all right, Dr. Schlecker.
I'm going to my final and saying I listen to the Busted pencils. And he said that your whole testing regime, Dr. X is nothing, but bull.
I would not recommend that you feel that as good preparation advice. If you're getting ready, you know what?
Write it all down and make sure you know it because you're going to have to until we actually really understand what it means to engage in measure and talk about learning for now, you're going to have to somehow quantitatively prove that you learned something.
So study, prepare, you know what I would do. Big thing. I would use AI. I would take every bit of notes and papers and things. I would pop it into AI.
If you're using one one of the one of them out there. There's a great one out there. No free advertising tonight.
You drop all that stuff into that and then ask it to make a podcast where for 20 minutes, it will talk to you about the content.
Put that in your headphones, drive to work, listen to it. From that standpoint, boy, AI has a lot of great tools to actually help you take that material and turn it into digestible nuggets that are going to be potentially much more powerful.
And helping you that day explain that you do know the nonsense boring crap that the professors talk to you about all semester.
There you go. Tim, I'm so glad that halfway through that, you changed course because I was afraid I was going to have to use.
I award you no points and they got mercy on your soul because I was so clear at the beginning, Tim, that it's we understand you don't like this.
But for the poor unfortunate soul who needs to do it, what are you going to give them in terms of advice, but you came around, you helped out Johnny now, Johnny knows how to use the AI to test.
And it's been helpful. So thank you, Tim. You you pulled through in the end. We can always rely on you. But Johnny, I know that you yourself were a crammer, not necessarily taking that to be the best advice.
What would you give in terms of advice to our students out there who need to study for one of these big tests?
Well, I will say this Jacob, I talked about, you know, building up your confidence ahead of taking an exam. And I, I, I go away from Tim's take, although I will say, you know, tests for the sake of having tests don't really measure our, you know, our application or our learning.
But good assessment, I feel is really important. And some information you just need to know at the end of the semester, the end of the term end of a class, you know, if I'm teaching an anatomy class, I got to know that you know the bones and the parts of the body and the systems and all the functions and, you know, if I'm your physics teacher, I need to know that like, you know how to, you know, you know, the formula is, you know, how to, you know, do, you know, potential energy, kinetic energy, all those kinds of fun things we do in physics class.
I might say, hey, you get to have a note card with formulas on it or you get to have some tools with you. And when I was an anatomy teacher, we'd have, you know, the written test and the oral exam, you could get to come up to the, to the skeleton and I could point to a bone and you could tell me what bone that was, you know, in different things we could do to make sure that the assessment was what in education we call authentic, give you an opportunity to really apply what you knew, right, or maybe if you're a history teacher and you have an essay.
You know, there's thoughts you have about, you know, the beginnings of World War II, which there's a couple of different perspectives on what started World War II or, you know, when did the United States enter the war? What was going, so you could write about different things and I could get as a, you know, an instructor into understanding what you know through what you're sharing with me, you know, so I like to believe that my colleagues give good tests and, you know, engage in good assessment.
But like Tim has highlighted too often, it's just a test for the sake of taking a test and I also kind of say, hey, man, that's on the teacher. That's really, that's really annoying. Have good, really meaningful final exams. Jacob, but I said preparation is everything, right? This is the coach in me coming out. Remember, we've talked before we've had a whole show on like the coach slash teacher.
You know, preparation is everything. So you scrimmage and practice so that you're ready for games. So when you're studying study ahead of time and practice taking some tests, maybe if you like, if you want to apply Tim strategy, maybe AI can help from your notes or study guys generate a sample exam.
If you have a really awesome professor, I know I did this, I give out, you know, practice exams, similar to what the exam exam will, you'll have two hours, there'll be, you know, 45 questions.
And this is some format of what it will look like. Here's a practice exam, you know, when I was a math teacher, we had a math study time and we'd have practice math finals, you know, available for students to practice testing.
So just like you scrimmage in a game or, you know, you have dress rehearsal and theater, you know, like you're ready for game time, you're ready for performance.
Same with test, give yourself a practice exam. It will help boost your confidence, especially if you do it maybe three, four, five days ahead of time.
So you can go over what you got wrong, you can sort of build good confidence in there.
The other thing I will say Jacob, even though I was, I practiced cramming and I also would stay up late and study for an exam, you know, the night before I give you the tip, don't do that.
You can sleep and be in well rested and being hydrated will carry you well into your exam. In fact, I told you like confidence and being well rested for your exam is going to boost you a couple points.
Those are easy points to get. So study ahead of time. And if you're, if you're a big crammer like me, you know, cram three days ahead.
So that the night before you can get a good night's sleep, right, make sure you're rested, make sure you get up, move around, maybe do a little exercising, get the blood flowing, right and make sure you drink water and you go into your exam ready and you've already practiced a few.
So practice test, shake up and being prepared and rested is going to boost you and it's going to improve your performance guaranteed that's guaranteed right here, my stamp of approval on that.
And I think Johnny, something that I got from what you were saying earlier in your first answer about having, you know, bringing in your pencils, having your pencil sharpener there.
It's not just about having a pencil or pencil sharpener. It's about taking care of those little things. So you're not stressed and you're not worried about these little things that could go wrong. Am I getting that right from what you're trying to say?
You're right, Jacob, it's called being dialed, right. So if you're going in to take your exam, you're going to cook, right, you're going to get things done, you got to take care of business, TCB, you got to be dialed, right. So having all of your equipment ready, having everything that you know is critical to you doing well.
And I would say do that also for your practice exam, just like we, you know, in a lot of sports, we'll do scrimmaging and a lot of dress rehearsals are like, you know, you know, if you're in a theater production, you do, you do a big walk through with everyone, you do like, hey, this is just the same as we would do opening night, right.
Right. That's the same thing. You do the same thing with your tests sharpen those pencils. If you use them or, you know, everything, you know, replicate as much of the test as you can, the test environment and boom, go, take the test rocket. It's just another one in the many you've taken in the last week or so.
Well, so far, I'm just going to say you guys have both past both past with flying colors, great performance from both of you. I can tell you crammed last night, which is the best way to study. We all agree on that much.
Very good. I just want to open up to both of you. In case you have any interesting stories of studying or finals or anything like that. I mean, I know you guys have been all over as students and teachers and stuff. What do you got for me?
Interesting stories. I, okay, I will. Small one.
The technique I learned in fourth grade from my absolute favorite teacher, Mr. Lawrence, it does not work.
What was that?
You know, again, this is what 1978, maybe he's like, well, you know, take everything that's going to be on the test and talk about it into your tape recorder.
And then at night rewind everything you talked into your tape recorder and lay down in bed and hit play.
And when you wake up in the morning, you'll know everything that was on that tape. It didn't work.
Through the process of photosynthesis, you will absorb.
I woke up the next morning and I did not know everything that was on that tape. So there. So don't do that if you're out there listening.
I see here Tim an evolution of that idea may have sparked your, your better idea of having AI make a podcast for you to listen to of all the stuff from your test. That'll work much better.
Just just don't do it.
Laying down, thinking it will absorb into your consciousness. Maybe that's the lesson there, Jacob.
Right.
Put all your notes and all your past successful tests under your pillow and learn biosmosis.
Just put it all under your pillow and go to sleep, learn biosmosis. That's the science teacher joking me.
You know, Jacob memorable moment stories.
I love some of these like untold stories of, you know, college years or of exam week.
I got, I got one of lore.
And I think the statue of limitations is like plenty far enough, you know, expired for nobody to get in trouble over this.
My first college final.
One of my first, I had a few that week, but my first semester of college, I won't give the date, but it was old and you'll know why and how old it was when I tell you there were ash trays in the classroom that semester.
Just a brilliant kelk class, man.
And I was a math geek.
So I loved my math, right?
And I had an awesome kelk teacher, really dynamic guy, man.
He was fun to teach limits, derivatives, double derivatives, all the fun stuff you do in kelk class.
And we had a pretty fun semester and we always joked, hey, there's ash trays in the classroom.
And he would say just because there's ash trays in the classroom doesn't mean you get to smoke and we'd be like, how come there's ash trays.
And I wasn't even a smoker, just a curious kid, right?
I would say, well, that's funny. There's ash trays in here.
And he said, I'll tell you what you guys, if you're going to smoke in class, and nobody had, but if you're going to smoke in class, you can smoke cigarettes in class on the last day in the final exam.
I mean, we thought this was the coolest thing ever.
Like this guy, again, teachers will sometimes dangle a carrot for their students about for exams.
So, you know, in preparation, the exam was well, I wasn't not a smoker.
So this was going to be, you know, like a new memorable experience for me.
I waited until, you know, the last page of the exam wrapping up the double derivatives.
And, and man, I have that one, that one single cigarette sitting on the desk in a pile of pencils ready to go.
And I got to that last page.
And I fired that boy up and smoked a cigarette while I finished off that double derivative on the kelp exam.
And, and man, I will tell you, it was, I felt pretty cool.
I thought for sure, this should be like, this should be a commercial.
Like, you know, I'd grown up with the marble ads free, free, free marketing, I guess.
You want to roll that pack up in your short sleeve shirt?
Oh, man, I showed up.
You know, I didn't even have a pack.
I was not a smoker, which is the, you know, the punchline of the story.
Before I had even finished that double derivative problem.
And like, I always put VVV at the end of all my tests, VVVVV, right?
Like, can I saw it conquered?
I did get 100% on that exam, by the way.
So, but VVVV before I could even sign my exam off on the final problem there.
Jacob, I was sick is good.
I was busy.
The room was spinning.
I was trying to play it all cool, because I was like, ah, just get to the bag.
Get to the end of this problem.
The, the, the, the barely could get out of my desk to walk the exam to the front of the room.
Definitely felt pretty sick.
Went to the bathroom after the exam and just sat in there, splashed cold water on my face.
And I said, this is, this is why we don't participate in these activities.
Rip and darts, not young Johnny Lupinacci's, you know, best moment.
But that's one that stays in my head when you asked about, do you have any stories about final exams?
Well, that one just blows floods to the front of my brain.
One of my first college experiences taken an exam.
It did go well.
Like I said, got 100% on the exam.
You know, it went well, but also kept me from being a smoker because I thought to myself, man, how do people do that function?
But that's just my own, you know, athletic kind of being.
I was, I was not a veteran when it came to handling the impacts of, of inhaling.
So you came, you saw in your hurl, I understand.
Yeah.
I didn't hurl.
I probably should have.
I meant, like, hold it together, pull it together.
I was like, people do this all the time.
Jacob, Jacob, Johnny stories, you know, making me remember back to our vaping show and thinking about the kids today going.
He spoke to cigarette.
I think, you know, I vape all through my finals.
You know, Rob.
I don't know.
Jacob, but you know, finals.
Hey, everybody, you know what?
As Johnny says, don't, don't, don't do or how that thinks.
Get out there and study and do your best, darn it.
You worked your butt off all semester.
Show them what you got, man.
Crush it.
I absolutely agree.
And you guys have crushed it in this episode of the producer's choice show.
But there's, there's time for one last important question.
Let's go.
And I will give you 60 seconds to answer.
We're going to stick with you, Johnny.
60 seconds.
Just give one piece of advice to your fellow educators and how they can make things a bit easier for those students this final season.
Structure the practice fellow educators.
You know, I plugged it earlier in the show.
A big firm believer in that your students know what they know.
And the more opportunity you give them to practice taking an exam to, you know, have review questions, review sessions.
And maybe even some practice exams.
I know it feels like more work, but it's, hey, it's part of the gig.
You want them to succeed and do well on those exams, you know, maybe a couple of weeks ahead of time or at least a week ahead of those exams.
Get them some practice ones.
Maybe even host the study session and say, hey, as part of the study session, we're all going to take a practice exam.
So that we're ready to go when it's game time.
Nice.
10 60 seconds on the clock.
Give a piece of advice for your fellow educators out there.
Well, look, if you're going to bring ass trays and cigarettes in for finals, then please bring in a pack of matches because some kids will not have fire with them.
Just, you know,
I couldn't resist.
I don't think you can do that.
No, no, in fact, faculty teachers out there don't do that.
You know what I, here's the thing before you even a song.
Come on.
Help them understand that this is just one thing.
Regulation, man.
Help them deal.
We do not need more anxious kids out there.
Understand that this is part of, you know, one little moment in their lives.
Please.
Help them understand that all will be well.
Even if they potentially don't do so well on this test.
Okay.
High stakes, man.
Not good for the mental health and busted pencils.
We want to make sure during this final season.
Students are regulated and teachers.
You know how that helping happens.
Make sure you're regulated going into finals week.
Dr. Tim Slecker.
Dr. Johnny Lupinachi.
The best thing you can do to keep me regulated as perform as well as you did on this show.
Thank you so much for coming.
Always a pleasure to have you on your own show.
Nice.
Thank you, Jacob.
And now it's time for your moment of Zen.
Whenever I become discouraged, which is on alternate Tuesdays between three and four.
I lift my spirits by remembering the artists are on our side.
Thank you.
Well, thanks for listening to this episode of producer's choice.
And remember, you can grab great podcasts packed full with more busted pencils content.
An Apple podcast spotify.
And of course, on the civic media website.
Hey, don't you dare be late for home.
Mom Monday.
And be sure to grab next week's class and session on Wednesday.
And if you don't already know, well, you're going to love this.
You can always catch busted pencils broadcast at 3 p.m. Central time.
Every Saturday across all the civic media network stations for one hour of your favorite.
Blue collar scholars.
Tim and Johnny and Kate.
Busted pencils.