This is Busted Pencils, fully-ledded education talk.
Here are your hosts, Dr. Tim Slecker, and Dr. Johnny Lupinacci,
educated educators talking education.
Yeah, that's what we do every Saturday across the civic media stations.
It's Busted Pencils fully-ledded education talk,
educated educators talking education.
Yes, that was a little hand clap if anybody heard that right now.
That's how excited I am on this Saturday getting to hang out.
Johnny and Jess, my two favorite friends, buddy people,
you know, just people I love spending all my waking moments with.
Jess, how are you doing today?
I'm doing great up for that, Tim.
I love how you know with you two, man.
You're my favorite educated educator,
aside from Johnny, who is also my favorite educated educator.
Nice. Johnny, how you doing, man?
Tim, I'm doing great.
It's another great week.
You know, we're ending the month, first month of the new year.
And, you know, I got to spend a lot of it with future teachers.
So I've spoiled all week long because, you know,
they have such great questions and so many exciting things
that they're, they're gearing up to do in classrooms around this country.
So I'm inspired, man.
And this week we talked a ton about, you know,
some really interesting stuff, kind of a kin to your favorite topic right now.
We were talking about AI in class and how it's changing our classrooms are teaching,
you know, some of its limitations, some of the things that's really helping us be better teachers,
utilizing it and better learners.
So today's conversation, man.
I am so giddy about it.
I'm stoked.
Uh-huh.
So let's not waste any time.
Let's jump right into our guest today.
That's not right.
And we've talked about it.
I'm so glad you had kind of brought that up because thinking right here on Boston pencils,
though, you know what?
We might be educated educators who talk education.
And we like to kind of dig into AI.
We like to tease each other about who's pro.
But you know, I tell you what,
being an educated educator talking education.
I know when I need more education.
And I tell you, these are the guests.
They are disruptors, innovators,
and AI educators without ever setting foot in a traditional classroom.
Myro Rollin, Liam and Oni are the powerhouse sisters behind Wundesto AI,
a company dedicated to helping businesses navigate the fast evolving AI landscape with ethical human centered strategies.
Myro.
She's a leading AI integration expert and has worked on everything from shaping AI policies at the White House
to building tech competency frameworks recognized by the world economic forum.
Leah, a digital strategist and tech ethicist explores the dark corners of AI deep fakes bias and the unseen risk of automation.
Together, they're educating industries and on the responsible use of AI,
proving that learning doesn't just happen in schools.
Welcome to busted pencils, Myro Rollin, Liam and Oni, Wundesto.
Welcome you too.
Thank you, Tim.
That was a great intro.
I know.
That was fantastic.
Hey, you know, well, I might have had a little help writing that.
You know, I mean, yeah, I just, you know, chat, chat has been actually thinking about this and so glad you guys are here.
We're going to talk a lot about your company and things like that.
But I mean, for me, you know, doing this show now, it's been over 10 years and writing up an intro like that took me, you know, a long time in the past.
And today now using AI, you know, I write a quick draft.
I then grab some information about you guys, you know, I took some stuff off of LinkedIn, I took some stuff on.
And I'm like, you know, help me then rewrite this intro.
And I think it does a pretty darn good job to the point that I feel like I'm, I don't know, I feel like I'm ethically using AI.
You want to, you want to dissect whether I'm using it.
Yeah.
I think ethically is a great line there, right?
Okay.
Are you down?
Am I being unethical?
No, you're not being unethical.
You used it for the power of good, right?
To get some descriptions about us.
I think that a lot of the challenges when you think about ethics, like we can just dive into it.
I have some very interesting conversations around AI.
So as you mentioned, Leah and I are sisters.
There's actually an interesting fact about us is that we are 20 years apart.
I am 20 years Leah senior.
So the gray hair gets it away.
Leah is my little nipple child.
We work together at, you know, and that's the way I am the CEO and founder and she's my head of operations.
But we're cut from the same cloth and we have kind of the same thinking.
So we go into like these real deep conversations around like ethics and like what's going on with AI in the future.
And so I would say Tim, that your use of AI was neither ethical or an ethical right it was just.
What everyone else is doing, right?
I used it to help me out there, you know, in producing because now I can do even more time reading and thinking more about the show.
Instead of all of that time that would have gone into writing an introduction, I can now lean into the kind of more creative parts of putting together, you know, a live show like that.
And I think that's the way that Johnny and I have talked about it with students.
Before we get there, though, too, let's, let's start though right away with, um,
um, Odesto AI and, you know, let you to kind of give us a little background on.
You know, so what's going on with Odesto, where did it come from?
I mean, you know, White House Myra.
The white, like not the White House, not the White House across from me, not my neighbor.
And the United Nations can't forget that.
Yeah, I mean, so, so give us some background.
So, um, let me see. So I'm going to keep my, my short. So, um, I've been an engineer for, I will always say 20 plus years because I don't want to age myself.
And, um, yeah, I've had the opportunity of working on some really interesting projects. I worked at Amazon for seven years, where I led some really interesting projects.
One of them was my last project was an AI project, where I, um, let a program where we saw need to provide upskilling to faculty at community colleges and universities on AI.
A lot of times, um, and you both know this that once you're in and higher education as an educator, there aren't many opportunities for you to continue to build your, your background and your knowledge, especially with technology changing so quickly.
Um, this is something like, you know, the iPhone, where you pick it up and you like, you know, you can learn how to like do a few things. So, yeah.
Um, but yeah. So, you know, we worked on educating educators and making sure that they were equipped to teach.
And, and that is in great, you know, you're actually talking, we have some listeners. In fact, one of our sponsor partners, AQ, the association for college and university educators, Jonathan Gurko, the founder there really came at it from the standpoint of going,
um, but higher education faculty need to have a place where they can get better. Um, and so I'm sure Jonathan right now listening to the show is like, that's what I was talking about him.
We were just talking about this to do for yesterday, right? Yeah. Yeah.
Well, well, it continued then.
We were just basically talking about, um, that educators need the ability, pretty much just continued education needs to be mandatory for educators.
Oh, I know.
Especially with technology advancing the way that it has been.
Johnny.
Well, absolutely. And you know, we've kind of had conversations on here back and forth over the past year or so, you know, discuss an AI and, you know, landed on some common ground that it's.
You know, it's here. It's part of almost every day life in most careers.
Um, if not all not to sound so hyperbolic about it, it's really, you know, being integrated into changing the labor of all the professions that, you know, we are all in or close to our neighbors are.
But for all of our students and I teach teachers.
Um, it's been just what Leo was just saying it's been part of our learning together.
How is AI part of our classrooms? How is it helping us teach? How is it helping our students learn?
And, you know, what's that like because there's the initial scare where everyone's saying, AI is coming and there won't be any teachers in the future.
And we're like, no, no, no, we're still going to have teachers and classrooms, but I'll tell you what, they're already looking much different than they've ever looked in the past.
And that's kind of an exciting thing, but it can also be a scary thing.
I mean, guys, I'm excited about it, but some of my students are like, oh, no, what's it going to be like?
I'm just interested in picking both your brains a bit about, you know, the way it's changing labor, especially for teachers.
And my students who are like, oh, no, are they really replacing us with computers?
Yeah, I think that, you know, we take it from the standpoint that educators need to understand AI before they can even, you know, talk about it or teach it and educate students on like the impact it's going to have.
Yeah, yeah, go for it, Leah.
I was going to say that, you know, most of most of the kids today are utilizing AI constantly.
And if teachers don't understand it, best of luck.
Well, best of luck. And I think it's one of these things I have been really, you know, seeing this is like, and some kids and some teachers and a lot of us.
They aren't using it wisely. And in fact, not using it going back to ethically.
Because they haven't had the opportunity to think about this, to talk about this, to really have experts like the two of you kind of come in and have discussions with us to let us know like what is it that we're wrestling with here, you know,
a legitimate fear of some form of, you know, quote, maybe it's not replacement, but is a teacher's job going to change is that the, and I think that reality is to say, these are those conversations that we should be having intentionally very much on purpose so that we can be educated as this comes forward because kids are going to use it regardless.
And we as educators, let's help them understand how to use it, when not to use it, and when it could be potentially even dangerous.
It's busted pencils fully let it education talk our guest tonight.
My role, not tonight, midday, leave an only one best way I, when we get back though, a little bit more educating the educators.
Yes, it's busted pencils fully let it education talk educated educators talking education and the educated educators are getting an education today.
I guess my role and Liam and only the company, undesto AI, a little bit of beginning there talking about education, but wanted to give you to the opportunity, undesto AI, let our listeners know I mean what's going on AI how are you what's what is this company, the startup company, you had spent all this time with Amazon.
We're at the White House, but you know, Myra and Lee, if you want to jump in and tell us about, you know, undesto and what undesto does.
Yeah, definitely so we are boutique AI agency and we help companies figure out their AI readiness and implement AI responsibly and ethically ensuring that they're doing it also frugally.
Just some quick facts so 72% of CEOs admit that they don't have an AI strategy or policy in place for their organizations and a lot of these companies that are implementing AI are taking their prioritizing AI projects over AI governance.
And so they end up having to backtrack because they don't have the guardrails in place and their infrastructure may not be ready, their data may not be ready.
And so that's where we can help both, you know, if they're taking the right approach, we can help them there or if they're backtracking and having to do, you know, some some rework, we can help there also.
But the interesting thing about us and one of the things that where we stand out is that I don't know if you know this, but did you know that lefty now women only make up 1% of AI professionals.
I am the 1% right.
Why do you get to be the 1% finally.
Yeah, but you know what?
Yeah, I always say like you know, this is a time when being the 1% is a problem and not a privilege.
And a black women make up less than 1% and so being an AI company led by a Latina female and, you know, Latina female sisters.
We're kind of a unique Nishi market here because not only do we differentiate and that factor, I've also been in the AI space for 12 years.
But not chat GPT came out and I did not become an instant expert and started selling myself as like, let me help you build the latest prompt, right.
And so Leah is very process oriented and Leah, do you want to talk a little bit about like what we've been doing with our newest AI app release.
Yeah, well, I know what Miro was saying is that everyone's trying to jump on the bandwagon of AI, but they're doing it very rapidly without taking into consideration the risks, their data, the safety of their data and things of that nature.
So I developed an app for the company that just it.
It helps to test AI readiness for a business, so ask them a series of questions and provides an assessment as to whether or not they're truly ready to integrate AI into their workforce.
And if they already have it, you know, it gives them an idea as to.
Where they might have setbacks and it's very important.
Companies don't realize what how much risk they're, they have when they're integrating AI without a plan and without understanding it and making sure that their employees are actually upskilled enough to use it ethically and responsibly.
That's where we come in and we help to mitigate that.
So with that, then, so, and I know it's just a startup, but, you know, has there been a place or when I'm just thinking about somebody who went too far and are they willing to admit that like, oh, my God, my, Leah, we are in over our heads, help us or, or is that your job to say you guys are in over your heads.
That's interesting. I would say I've had, I've had so many conversations with CEOs, I think some of my favorite and this is like.
This isn't just one, this is kind of a template of what I get is, you know, I'll have a conversation with CEO with a CEO and they'll be like very proud to share like I've been using chat GPT to do some forecasting and to write some documents and to like do all this stuff.
You know, like around our business to like figure out how we can integrate it into our business.
And so I'll pause and I'm like, oh, that's great. I'm excited that you've used at GP chat GPT are using a personal version of chat GPT on the web. Are you paying, you know, for the $20 or do you have an enterprise version and a lot of them will tell me, well, I'm just using the, you know, the free version.
And I have to tell them, please stop.
Stop what you're doing.
Because you, what you're doing is you're putting your cost your business data out into the ether with no control. There is no delete button once you upload those documents.
And the, the GPT can go in and can it's already learned your information and it can just, you don't know where that outputs going to go somewhere else.
So I just wrote a book and published it basically on this premise. So that book just published yesterday and it's called the curious case of chat about GPT.
I saw that on, on, on LinkedIn that you just released that. In fact, we'll, we'll make sure that we also put a link to that in the show notes so that people can have that. Yeah, because it's, it's so exciting.
Okay, so yeah, and you know what, what you just said, I didn't know that until even me, I took, I took a course.
And you know, it was a LinkedIn course and learning course, but it was very simple. He's like, hey, if you're using the free version, you're sharing it with the world.
And, but you know what, though, if, if you step up, then you are, you know, more protected by even just the $20 version.
I said more, not fully, right, because my right. So anybody watching this on the YouTube said, my, my religious told Tim, Tim, you're not that smart, dude.
Did my eyes. Now, actually, you know, it's just that if you read the fine print and says that they won't use your, your data to train the GPT.
They don't have to because you're doing it.
Right. Yeah.
Oh, man, Johnny, I know coming up already on this one, but I got to let you jump in here.
Well, I'm just taking this in because I love this conversation.
You know, I, I'm a big fan of like learners leading learners.
And when thinking about being a teacher and how fast and how much we're learning about AI to be the best learners leading learners, we can.
So I absolutely love this conversation. More questions to come. I mean, I'm excited about, you know, Myra's book.
I already started typing it in to get my copy of it.
But yeah, Myra and Leah here. And this is a really, this is a big gift.
So listeners, we appreciate you listening. But I mean, I'm just giddy with this opportunity to be a learner here and to learn.
And there it is. And before we go, those 608557 8577, that's the mailbag in the text line 857524842.
And man, more with Myra and Leah, when we get back.
And I'm just going to get this.
And what to make the whole world go in this.
Of course, I don't know if Johnny and I will, but Myra and Leah will definitely rock you. It's busted pencils.
It's only let it education, educated educators, talking education, actually getting an education today.
Myra, Rodin, Liam, and only the company and desktop AI.
Hey, if you're a business out there and you're listening to busted pencils and you're a little too much in over your heads on the AI stuff.
Check it out though. You want to call my run Leah because they can help you out there.
You know, Johnny, what, what this maybe think back to last Saturday's show with Jason Buchary, you know, up there north in Canada, where, you know, he kind of jumped on the, you know, got on the fence between our argument of, you know, Tim's a big worship at the, the cult of AI and Johnny's the anti AI.
And Jason's like, you know what, I'm going to sit in the middle here and say, the biggest thing we need to do with AI is study it, study it.
I was wondering putting that to, to Myra and Leah, is there wisdom in the study it approach. Myro, what do you think?
I would say that I just struggle with the philosophical like approach to learning because philosophically, we philosophically, we can all discuss a bunch of topics.
There's not having a philosophical standpoint does not mean that you understand the technology. I think that what we need to do is understand the use cases, the applications and how it's going to impact society.
Right. So if you look at it from that standpoint, how is it going to impact jobs. What are the skills that people need to start developing.
How is it going to change education. How is it going to change business. How is it going to change government. How is it going to change society in general. I think that if you're talking about studying that.
Yes, but also beyond studying it. Right. It's like, what do we do. Yeah, like what do we do. Right. What do you do with it.
Leah.
You saw it. I know.
He snuck that in. Yeah, she's like trying to be sneaky over this. She's snuck it in and then trying to play koi.
Yeah. Well, it was just interesting because I was reading, you know, I've read plenty about schools banning AI from the classroom altogether because teachers are very concerned about students using its itchy and things of that nature.
But in reality, I feel that.
AI needs to be implemented in the classroom as much as possible because as we were kind of saying before students are using it anyway, you're not going to stop them.
So might as well use it as a tool in in the classroom.
You can use it to have kids debate against the AI.
Have the kids do fact checking on the AI.
You can't. There's plenty of ways you can implement it in the classroom, especially.
Johnny, I said, Johnny's not in the way, man. You got the big smile on.
Yeah, I love this. I mean, that is, I echo that. I love hearing it. And Tim, you touched on this earlier in the show. And for our listeners, I think this is the important thing is.
We want to learn about something, especially like AI, neither Tim or I quite experts, although Tim's been studying it. So he's on the pathway to some mastery of of where intertwines with the craft of teaching.
And I'm, and I'm getting there last semester really started working with my students on, you know, how would we use it in our classrooms as elementary teachers, how do we utilize it as high school teachers.
How does it help us, you know, be better teachers. And that meant learning about AI with which both Myra and Leah have recommended here.
And so, and I'm so, I keep saying it, but I'm excited because here we have experts. Here we have some folks who have dedicated.
They are craft to understanding, you know, how to implement AI have, have studied kind of its limitations and its possibilities and potentials and can make recommendations for all of our learning.
So we're lucky. I mean, we're honored to have both Myra and Leah here, you know, and the work that they do with Indesto, because we want to learn, like you're saying, it is part of our students every day lives now as students.
I have no doubt that it will be part of their work as they go into the community, you know, and follow their passions and their careers.
And it's like, so here we are learning about it. And just a, just a little plug. If you haven't listened to to the show with Jason Bukkari, we had, you know, our Canadian buddy up there talking with us about AI.
And we tried to get him to decide whether he was pro Johnny, who, you know, I've been against AI and Tim's been pro AI. And, you know, Jason reminded us, hey, let's pause for a minute and let's say AI is neither good nor bad.
But let's take time to really think about like where it fits into the very best we can offer all of our students in our classroom and how it adds to that.
And so here we are doing that with Leah and Myra, who do that in all kinds of ways with all different industries, you know, one of those industries being education.
So we're hearing it learn about AI. It's part of our students lives. It's part of our careers. And Myra, you're nodding. So I'm going to kick it to you, you know, our listeners, a lot of educators out there and people leading teachers or parents who have kids in schools, you know, so we shouldn't be afraid of AI.
Yeah, I think that one of the interesting things is that I like that comment about AI is neither good nor bad. Right. I AI has no feeling it has no emotion. It is, it's, it's a computer right where it's good or bad is how people use it.
And the intention that you have behind that use, there will always be malicious actors, right. So there's always people that ride that gray line. There's, you know, the people who are on the pure white side were like, it's all good. And they have people who are on the dark side that are like, you know dark web kind of deal.
And so I think that for educators, my biggest point is that you need to become a lot smarter than your students are as far as the AI come goes because especially as early as elementary school.
Right, because kids nowadays have tablet in hand at all times or a phone, they have access to a super computer right in their pocket.
And think about how long it took us to adapt to to a smartphone, not long, right. How long how quickly did our addiction grow to a smartphone and our dependency on it and kids now have chat to BT on a device.
Right. And so as educators, saying, putting a policy out saying like, we're not allowing it. You're just encouraging.
It's like, right, kid, not to like, you know, it's like, don't eat the candy, don't eat the candy. And they slowly take the wrapper off from front of you as they stick the candy in their mouth.
But it's also doing a disservice to them, right, because they are like you were saying before Johnny is that they are going to have AI in the future that their jobs are going to involve AI in the future.
They need to learn about it. They need to understand it. They need to understand the risks and how to use it responsibly, ethically, they need to learn these things. It's not going away. So we need to just adapt.
And I think for educators is a matter of finding there are programs that are starting to pop up when I was at Amazon, I started a program. I now belong to the applied AI national applied AI consortia for community colleges.
It's a new organization that popped up. It's funded by the National Science Foundation. And part of the remit is education for educators, educating educators on AI.
And so I think that there needs to be funding applied towards allowing educators to upskill.
So they can then integrate these AI lessons into the course, not just integrating the tools saying we're using it, but integrating like being able to teach students about the ethics and the responsibility and how to use it and what are the pitfalls and kind of like all that other stuff.
And a lot of it could be bringing like industry experts in like if you don't have brand industry expert in, you know, I always, a lot of educators that I've met, a lot of them, some of them believe in being the sage on the stage.
And, you know, that doesn't fly any longer.
Okay, so
That was, that was unison.
Yeah.
Well, I think no one on the stage, no more sage in the stage.
Hey, I love my rather that you brought up sort of the ethical component to it.
And I know the as an ethicist of technology and especially of AI.
I'm just now, now my curiosity is peeked bit and I was wondering, could you talk about some of the ethical dimensions or tensions, just a few like the big ones with AI.
And maybe education or even industry because everybody learning is going to industry.
Right.
So the big ones that stand out to you about it, maybe just name them a few of them for us.
Yeah, so we have like, okay, so humans are bias.
AI is treated on human data are historical data is bias.
So therefore, the outputs that you're going to get are bias unless the algorithms are, you know, kind of set up no way where they can kind of, they're not going to eliminate bias, but they're going to reduce bias.
That's the biggest one. The second one is around hallucination.
So AI still hallucinates and what that means is it may a generative AI is a is a text predictor.
That's exactly what it is.
So it's predicting the next word in a sequence and it does it based on numeric numerical weights.
And so it's not that it's wrong.
It's just that it's, that's what it thinks, you know, historically, that's usually, you know, when you're not giving it enough context and data, it's going to make stuff based on
to make a complete statement.
So it's a text predictor and we have a huge dependency on an AI right now.
People became very dependent very quickly.
You asked someone to write something on their own.
They, a lot of people aren't able to do it nowadays.
And that's not even getting into the really nefarious.
Yeah.
I was going to say,
give us a deep, give us a nefarious one here.
Oh, well, like I just said, it's deep, deep fakes, voice cloning.
I mean, the scams that are going around now where people are actually cloning voices of people's loved ones and having them call and having it call them to try to solicit
money.
It's, it's crazy with things that are starting to happen.
And this is only the beginning.
It's only the beginning.
It's only going to get better with as technology improves and, and by better, I mean worse, obviously.
Yeah.
What, what an invitation to the importance of being familiar with it, understanding its possibilities and potentials and involving ethics in that.
Right.
So as we are learning about it and we're teaching our students to make sure that they feel confident and they can understand.
Those uses so that they can navigate it both as people engaging with the tool, but also maybe not even knowing that it's being engaged with them.
So I love that.
I love that there's that both of you emphasize the importance of those ethical dimensions to our learning about AI is like, hey, don't just implement the tool, learn about it in all the ways.
Yeah.
And also like engage students in critical thinking because with deep fakes and all of these nefarious uses, they need to be able to think critically and analyze what they're looking at to be able to decipher like.
What's real.
Yeah, what's really.
If you go on social media today, you'll see dozens and dozens and dozens of photos that people are trying to pass off as true.
So crazy to me reading some of the comments and people have absolutely no idea that they're generating that they're generated images and like I said, it's only going to get more.
I don't I don't want to say better.
It's going to get better again.
It's going to get worse.
If you're out there listening, if you're really good at this, I'm looking for somebody to give the deep fake of the thin and in shape younger Tim.
Oh, our guests.
I have a role in Leah Manoni.
UNDESTO every link to Myra's book.
Leah, we're going to put some links to to her blogs that she's been putting out.
UNDESTO, the company, make sure that you find this, check it out.
Myra, Leah, thanks for busting pencils.
Thank you.
Thank you.
It was a lot of fun.
And Tim and Johnny, we're not going to do it out, but when we get back though, watch out.
We're back.
It's plastic pencils.
And it's fully-led education talk, educated educators talking education.
I think the educated educators just got themselves an education.
Myra, rolled in Leah Manoni, the company's UNDESTO AI man, Johnny, just kind of laying it out there for us in a way that I feel like our little argument or, you know, Tim, all AI, Johnny, I feel like now we have.
I think we're going to need to progress out of that simple, yes, no conversation.
Well, I love it, Tim.
I think so.
I think we're at a full ceasefire here.
I call it more convergence by recommendation of our Canadian mediator.
Jason Bukeri.
And we called in the big guns tonight.
Leah and Myra.
And that's right up my alley, Tim.
I love where we're converging on that reminder of Jason, Jason gave us.
Let's not make it good or bad.
Let's not say, hey, I'm against it or for it.
Let's pause and put our professional identities aside.
And, you know, and what I mean by that is come at it with humility.
And not maybe the hubris that Johnny was bringing saying, well, I can type just as fat.
I can write an article faster than AI can get one published.
I mean, I'm already realizing I probably would lose that battle.
But my humility is in order.
But, Tim, I love where we're converging.
And I absolutely love where Myra is coming at this with her experience.
You know, in software design and all the expertise she brings.
See what technology offers, not only industry, but, you know, education.
And then Leah has an ethicist and so much more.
But the lens they're bringing as we are pausing to say, let's learn about AI.
The conversations we're having because, you know, we talk all the time here on bus
depenses about talking to our neighbor.
Also, sometimes it's super important to ask the people we know are experts in something about what their expertise is.
When I want to learn more about the repairs happening on my car, I talk to my mechanic friends.
And they tell me, yep, that's actually a transmission problem, glad you're getting it fit.
And that's important.
So here I am a skeptic of the impacts of AI on culture and society.
But having two people who are also bringing that skepticism to the topic and saying, hey, this is what we focus on.
The ethical dimensions, the ways we can implement this, how it's changing our labor, how it's changing for us educators, our classrooms.
And I would learn and from and with, you know, Leah and Myrad and I, and I love that we're converging on something here.
Here we are, model and democracy.
And we're talking about education here on bus depensals.
Well, you know, and it was a great, great discussion.
And in fact, you know, one have them back on because they've got so much to offer, you know, about this.
You said, you know, whether it's the ethicist from the least standpoint, the long time, you know, the, the, as my, Myra said, the 20 plus years, working in the industry.
And also too, you know, has worked in academia herself being a socio professor.
And then Johnny also pointing out that the work that they are doing with community college faculty, pointing that out and thinking about that.
Because, yeah, if, if we're not going to as educators, dig deep into learning these things, I mean, then we're really not doing our jobs.
And so, you know, thinking about this, yeah, when, when, you know, our guests from a few weeks back, Brian Gonzalez from Intel, he was the one who was like, he sent me a note going, hey, Tim, you've got to meet these sisters.
You got to have them on busted pencils.
I was like, okay, you know, and I had this, and I did a screening with, with Leah and, and Myra.
And it just came across as going like, okay, it's neither about Tim and Johnny being wrong or right.
It's Tim and Johnny got a lot more to learn.
And let's bring Leah and Myra here to actually help me in you.
And maybe possibly Johnny modeling for other educators out there that, you know what, you know, our little one year kind of feud really actually kind of limited the realities of how much more there is there.
Having them like that, John, I see you want to jump in.
Well, yeah, Tim, you know what I love about this is, you know, that it's okay to disagree.
And it's really most important to be open to information.
And there is a vast sea of information out there that includes misinformation.
And so here we are, Tim, you know, both of us say, hey, we disagree, but let's figure out more about this because there's something important about this AI stuff.
A real generative dialogue that I would say is moving us towards the common good for public education.
Hey, AI is here. It's part of our lives. It's part of our students lives. Right. And now Tim.
Hey, well, you know what though? And as they said, it ain't gonna uninvent itself. Just pointing that out there.
And now for your moment of sin.
I have no right to despair. I insist on hope.
Hey, check us out. Come back home room on Monday.
Class will be in session Wednesday with the map anxiety diffuser.
And we'll wrap up with free throws and face offs. Hey, make sure you subscribe to the Busted Pencils podcast on Spotify or Apple Podcasts.
Also, if you're doing that, drop us a review there. We'd want to hear about it.
Yeah, even if you got a little bit more to say, you know, there's so much going on out there and just thinking about this.
Do you like us bringing people on like Leah and Myra to help create more of an education?
You know, we want to know about that because we've got guests out there and we just want to expand this.
Of course, it's a teaching and learning show. And so whenever we can bring guests on for our listeners that can add something to us.
Money can give everybody a little bit of homework though. Hey, if you're really into AI, what is the difference between narrow general and super intelligence?
It's Busted Pencils, everybody. Thanks for busting pencils.