This is Busted Pencils, fully-ledded education talk.
Here are your hosts, Dr. Tim Slecker and Dr. Johnny Lupinacci,
educated educators talking education.
Yes, Busted Pencils fully-ledded education talk,
educated educators talking education,
home room, 2025, welcome to the new world,
welcome to the jungle as Axel Rose said back in the 80s.
I don't know, it's gonna be a fun year though.
It's gonna be a lot of pencil busting,
but man, I am so glad to see both of you guys back in home room
after such a wonderful holiday break.
Well, not necessarily for all of us,
but you know, people out there, listeners too,
if you have been, you know, doing your things
over the holidays, glad you had a great time.
Don't forget, 608-557-8577,
that's still the Busted Pencils mailbag line in 2025.
Let us know, man, hey, go back, listen to our predictions show.
Check it out, let us know what you think.
If you think we're off base, tell us what you think
your predictions are for 2025.
But anyway, Jess, Johnny, so glad to see you guys.
Jess, how are you?
I'm doing really well, Tim.
You know, I am just so happy to be here
to start the year, start the week
with you two educated educators in home room.
This is the best way to get our bearings for the week.
Get a bit of a flavor of what this week is going to bring.
And I have to tell you, I know you said,
you know, we had a great break.
I hope people had a great break.
Looking forward to maybe taking a little bit of time off
within this month.
But it's finally acting like winter in Wisconsin.
The sweaters are out.
It is cozy season.
Things are good.
So glad to be here with you
and get started for a great year of Busting Pencils.
Nice.
Dr. Johnny, how are you, my friend?
Hey, man, I'm doing good.
It's 2025.
Got a lot of snow.
I've been out snowboard and get ready for my classes
to start up next week, Tim.
So jumping back in and excited to have classroom all back
rolling, being on that routine.
I know so many of our teachers out there squeezing out
these last days of break, probably back to school
for them as this drops, you know, this is a home room
first kickoff, first week back in class.
So it's good, you know, it's going well, Tim.
It's a good break for me, Jess.
I know over at said media, you producers, you know,
and folks operating the boards,
there's no break for the chairwoman of the board.
No, we are essential keeps the heart beating for sure.
Well, you know, home room here, lots of things going on
as we come into this, but, you know, I'm
to talk a little bit about the fact that, you know,
the Department of Education, we're hearing a lot
about the Department of Education coming into 2025
because president elect Trump, you know, a few days away,
well, a couple of weeks away before that becomes official.
But ran on the idea or the promise
to close the Department of Education.
And thinking about that going, I don't think
there's ever been such a serious threat as there is now.
But thinking of the Department of Education,
we have to say and give thanks and remember, though,
where the Department of Education came from,
whose responsibility it was.
And there he was.
President Jimmy Carter elected in 1976, 1979,
the approval and the put forth of the Department of Education.
And over this holiday break, Jimmy Carter,
at 100 years old, passed away.
So I thought Johnny Jess, you know, do a little remembering,
but compliments in saying, you know,
the Department of Education, Jimmy Carter, 100 years old,
as people say, probably one, if not the best past president,
occupying all those years from 1988 to 2025,
out there doing all of those things, you know,
still, as they said, some of the stories, you know,
living in, again, his home, never really wanting to upgrade.
And in fact, largely when it came to appliances in his house,
this was one of the little stories I was reading
about some of the reflection on Jimmy Carter,
never wanted to buy new appliances,
always had to get them repaired,
because he just didn't want to indulge
and spend the money.
I tell you what, though, when my garbage disposal goes,
no, no, no, no, no, I want a new one,
because I am fixing it.
So unlike Jimmy Carter, but I will say all of the work
that he did with Habitat for Humanity too,
have to really give him lots of kudos for that.
And in fact, you know, gave me some inspiration,
and one summer I did some Habitat for Humanity work
and incredibly rewarding.
So Jimmy Carter, though, Department of Education,
Johnny, I was saying this, it was then very quickly
after the Department of Education.
I mean, Ronald Reagan in 1980 also ran
on the platform plank of getting rid
of the Department of Education.
Here it is now, 2025.
It's lasted this long.
Jimmy Carter, tribute, is it going to continue
Johnny your thoughts?
Oh, that's a lot, Tim.
Jimmy Carter certainly lived a full life,
100-year-old, you know, I will say not only defender,
but embodiment of democracy worldwide,
especially here in the United States,
best representing us in so many ways.
And of course, he was president,
but I think probably for me, best known
for his efforts outside of his presidency,
nothing against his presidential run.
I mean, he was powerful on that role.
But wow, just we talk a lot in here
about rhetoric of violent political discourse,
like the level it's gotten to.
And when I say that, I mean, it's been lowered
so far to such a violent discourse.
Jimmy Carter was an embodiment of peaceful discourse
and peace not being passivity,
being a real defender of democracy,
being real empathetic, but firm.
And just what a command of language
in the realm of democracy and peacekeeping.
So I think the legacy lives on, right?
And I think there's so much for us to turn to
and learn from from his full life.
And we're thinking about a man who went to school
before schools were integrated, right?
In a segregated school system with a commitment
and vision to desegregation who lost elections
early in his career based on his political positions
to support integration and public education
being a great equalizer, right?
The best for everyone.
It's sort of a phrase that really came forward.
And I would say, you know, in some context
really pioneered by the political career of Jimmy Carter.
And so, you know, I think about it.
We, we talk about federal policy on busted pencils.
Which we do.
We go pretty hard on the department of education.
Certainly not an effort to see it closed,
but to just kind of highlight the ways
that federal policy impacts our local schools.
And, you know, Tim, what, I was two years old.
I won't say how old you were, but in 1980, you're right.
The U.S. Department of Education came into existence.
We're talking about though, under the leadership
of a man who went to school and very segregated schools
who believed in a vision that was different, right?
Who came into his presidency at a time
when, you know, the country really not only needed
to grow, but was growing, was making significant strides
in civil rights efforts.
So to see his stuff, man, you know, remembered.
I'm happy to be part of that, remembering him
and to continue to learn from and try and, you know, embody,
especially that discourse and peace effort.
I mean, other thing too, I'm not thinking
we're talking too much about, but, you know,
we are in the throes of a very complicated
and politically violent language around,
but also real violence on the ground in Israel and Palestine.
And there is some really amazing work
from Jimmy Carter's legacy to talk about peace, not apartheid
to really talk about what we can do as a world
to be better democratically together.
So obviously, you can tell him big fan.
Educationally, you know, we don't always think
about Jimmy Carter as education president, but...
Well, he sure did a lot.
He did a lot.
I mean, think about too, the Department of Education.
Why such a strong, federal presence?
And Johnny, you pointed out, you know,
what he grew up in the segregated South
and the desegregation that was, you know,
coming out of the civil rights movement.
And, you know, very much the whole idea of states rights
in some states saying, you know, we're not going to comply.
And so the idea that here, you know, saying,
do you need a strong federal hand
when it comes to public education?
Well, when it comes to enforcing civil rights, yes, we do.
And so even just that, the legacy of the fact
that we have a strong federal connection
to making sure that civil rights are upheld
in our public schools.
Let's continue to do that.
And you know what?
It's going to be interesting.
I don't really see any success
in the Trump administration in doing this.
I think it was something they got elected on.
They're going to float the bill.
It's not going to happen.
Because guess what?
He actually still himself wants a strong federal presence
so that he can inflict as much pain and damage
on public schools as he can.
And if there's not a strong federal presence,
he can't do that.
So I don't believe that's going to happen.
Johnny, you're talking about violence, though.
And I'm thinking right now, you know what?
Our buddy, make a little transition here.
Our buddy from Oklahoma, Ryan Walters, a few days ago.
Of course, you know, he didn't sad, or he let me down.
Or I don't say he let me down, but President Elect Trump,
I put Ryan Walters out there as the top nominee
for Secretary of Education.
I even, you know, I was willing to bet a farm
that I didn't own, that he was going to get that nomination.
He didn't, you know, Linda McMahon did.
Ryan kind of disappeared.
I thought, man, he must be licking his wounds.
He's scared, he's upset.
You know what?
Though here he is, he's back.
He comes back, releases a video.
One of those fun videos that people like
to take of themselves when they're in their car.
He makes the point.
And boy, what a horrible, violent kind of again, positioning.
Our neighbors, our friends, teachers this time,
teachers unions as terrorists, terrorists.
Right after we have the attack in New Orleans
on Bourbon Street to kind of come back.
I'm sorry, he really did try to make the point
in making a linkage that terrorists are somehow
driving in America because of teachers in teachers unions
and that even potentially subtly suggesting
that the terrorist attack in New Orleans
could be blamed on teachers in teachers unions.
There you go.
There's that language, Johnny,
and the implications and the indications for people listening
that now teachers are the targets.
I'm, this dude is, I'm sorry, this is him again,
saying, hey, look, when Linda McMahon
doesn't get the nomination, I'm still here.
I want it.
This is brightening though, the idea that teachers
are creating terrorists.
Well, Tim, it's right in line with the strategy utilized
by fascists and I'm gonna call it
and I reserve that word really carefully
for people who are behaving in this way
who are saying these extreme things
and mapping dissent and thinking critically
and learning about our history
and understanding that a better world is possible,
obtainable and desirable are in some way violent to community.
That's just not the case, right?
And so to put that word of terrorism onto teachers
and onto essentially then young people,
it's sort of par for the course for the fascists
to say, hey, young folks see a very possible different future
and we want to squash that out
in the most extreme ways and violent ways possible.
So to label them as terrorists, it's not only says
their enemies, but says that they're violent enemies
and ought to be dealt with in such a way.
So it's aligned with that effort
and it's absolutely, it should be pointed out
absolutely the opposite of a discourse of Jimmy Carter's
a use of language and democracy
because it does not promote peace.
You, part of democracy and peace
isn't everybody agreeing, but it's working together
to find solutions and they're almost always temporary.
The best next thing, Jimmy Carter
was a strong proponent of go slow.
Figure this out together, listen,
figure out how we can improve whether it's our schools,
our communities, our healthcare systems
and remember early on, and this is the role of dialogue,
this is the role of teachers unions,
but we come back to the Department of Education,
the birth of the Department of Education,
formerly in 1980, but already in sort of discussions
previous to that, you know, teachers unions were against it.
They later came on board with it through discussion,
through dissent, through dialogue,
through thinking critically about what it could do
to move from, you know, essentially every state
on their own, anything goes education wise in this country
to a more, hey, how do we come together
to have some organization and influence
from federal government, but not power
in the same way that states will have.
So let's maintain state power,
but let's also have a real organizational office
where our fundings, for policies, for recommendations,
for research, for all of these things.
These are all things that help us make better informed decisions
when we don't all agree and we shouldn't all agree.
So, you know, the fast move by a fascist politician
is to quickly move things to violence and fear.
Not something that we should all see as a red flag
in any politician on any side of the political spectrum.
If the move linguistically,
if the language is very quickly escalated to,
words like these are terrorists or, you know,
these are threats to our country
when they are the exact opposite.
They will only make a stronger and better
to understand how to have peaceful dissent
and I don't mean passivity, right?
But I really mean like informed dissents say,
hey, I disagree with this.
It's not in the best interest of my community,
our community, our state or our nation.
But to be able to say that, to be able to be heard
and to be able to work with others
towards possible solutions.
I mean, if we're remembering Jimmy Carter,
this was his one of his many extremely successful skill sets.
Being able to say, hey, let's figure this out.
And to me, as a union guy, you know,
reminding our union friends who work creatively
all the time to influence schools, right?
That the formation of the Department of Education
was in conversations with our teachers unions
initially opposed to them, right?
But brought together to say, hey,
this would be a place where democratically as a nation,
we would help make decisions to inform
what schools can be like for everyone in this country.
And they were integral, as you said.
And I call them like civil rights initiatives, right?
But they were integral in so many ways
to strengthen our public schools.
They were also integral in some ways
of harming our public schools
because everything is not all good.
And that's the thing I want to remind our listeners.
And for us to kind of highlight
that I think Jimmy Carter would want us to remember is
nothing is all in all perfect.
That's the beauty of democracy.
We have to have everyone's voice valued
and part of the conversation towards the common good.
Because if decisions are to be made
by those directly impacted by the decisions,
then we have to have those conversations to get there.
If we don't have those conversations in a sense,
we don't learn to disagree with each other
and productive in generative ways,
then we've got big problems.
And that's where fascists capitalize.
They get in there and they say,
this is too violent, this is scary,
this is dangerous, just do it my way.
Do it my way.
Do it my way.
Let me be in charge, you know,
and it's a slippery slope to a kind of strange dictatorship
that I don't think anyone in any political party
really in the masses seeks to have.
So I'm remembering Jimmy Carter today
and this week as I'm teaching him
because it's a strong reminder, his legacy
being a strong reminder to find peaceful, not pacifist,
but peaceful dissent.
Those two words can go together, peaceful dissent, right?
To fascist language, fascist policy.
And just the sheer audacity that anyone has
to capitalize on a tragedy
like what happened in New Orleans politically
to blame teachers and essentially young people for this.
Oh, I'm just disgusted by it.
But remember, hey, take a deep breath
and work through democracy to listen
and say it's a sign that something's really broken.
And what do we have to do?
We have to put best information we have forward
to figure out how to be better and do better locally,
nationally and globally.
We can do it, man.
We can do it.
And now for your moment of zin.
I started studying history with one view in mind
to look for answers to the issues and problems
I saw in the world about me.
Hey, oh, listen, there's thanks for tuning in.
Class and session will be out this Wednesday.
Make sure you download it, make sure you listen
and make sure to hear about our latest
and free throws and face offs on Friday.
So tune in for a full hour of busted pencils
this Saturday at 3 p.m.
across all the civic media talk stations.
We got a full year ahead of us folks.
Let's keep busted pencils.
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