This is Busted Pencils, fully-ledded education talk.
Here are your hosts, Dr. Tim Slecker and Dr. Johnny Lupinacci,
Educated Educators Talking Education.
Oh, yes, there it is.
Busted Pencils fully-ledded education talk.
Educated Educators Talking Education.
First Downs Friday nights, yeah, Johnny Lupinacci.
You know, he's got things to do.
He's a coach. He's a dad.
When I got my friends here, Jess and Jimmy,
what's happening, Jess, you first?
Well, we're just taking it one day at a time.
You might hear my voice that, you know,
it's cold season, but that's fine.
We got coach K with us.
Coach K, how you doing?
Cold season revenue.
There we go. There we go.
I'm right there with you.
Okay, well, then I thank goodness, then we're in screens
because I do not need the two of you infecting me.
So, you know, yeah, it's first down you all the way out.
No, please, please, please.
It's first downs in Friday night lights.
Yeah, it's our special episode.
And we are so happy to have Jimmy,
so we're going to be in the coach,
Cowska here, Coach K,
joining us again to talk, you know,
a little bit about, of course,
we're going to talk about fall sports going into winter.
But then the other though,
start away, though, Jimmy coming out of the election
and no, we're not going to be moaned Trump
because there's enough of that out there
and not to say that we don't want to be moaned him
because we do,
but we're not going to do it today.
But success in Wisconsin,
Jimmy around school referendums.
And now, what was the breakdown?
What can you report from Wisconsin
on the success of school referendums?
Well, I think the first thing you have to do
is in the context of,
you know, the last few elections that we've had,
where we've had more than one referendum,
you have to understand that,
yeah, it was great to see 92 of 120 districts get
at least one question passed.
3.4 billion dollars worth of referendums
did go through.
That's, that's how much
we've been doing.
We've had a lot of different tax payers
in these districts have allowed their local property taxes,
their district to collect beyond the tax levy,
the limit set forth by the legislature.
So I think right there,
just the districts that did get this passed.
Obviously, this is huge
because this is facilities,
this is keeping the lights on,
this is staff salaries,
this is keeping your programming going.
So for those districts you pass the,
obviously you feel great.
A lot of them passed pretty overwhelmingly.
If you look at Madison, for example,
they passed a $507 million facilities referendum
and a $100 million operational referendum
with over 70% of the vote.
I mean, just overwhelming numbers to get the vote passed.
So I think for those districts obviously,
this is what you have been working towards.
And the reason why so many schools
waited until the presidential election
asked is that the data that goes back
since referendums became a thing in Wisconsin,
going back to the 90s,
is that the presidential election itself
has a much higher rate of passage
than any of the other elections or primaries on the calendar.
This year we have seen,
and last year too,
we have seen referendum passage rates.
Overall, you know, north of 50%.
But, you know,
whereas in the past,
they might be 80 or 90%.
We're seeing things closer to like 60%.
So when we see, you know, 70% of referendum's pass
in a presidential election,
you're feeling,
okay, well, 70% is great.
But in context to pass presidential elections,
where they passed 80, 85,
even 90% sometimes,
it's a little bit down.
And I think expected given that there's been so many,
and I think there's some voter fatigue on voting
whether they're going to raise their local property taxes
to help pay for education.
Yeah.
I mean, let's, you know,
again, just a quick reminder refresher,
the referendum process.
This is public school taxpayers voting in favor
to pay more taxes to support their local public schools.
Why does that happen?
Well, in Wisconsin in particular,
they are underfunded.
You've got a state legislature
that has been defunding public schools.
And so to make up that gap,
the taxpayers go to the ballots,
asking themselves essentially to say,
are we willing to pay more for our kids to have
the public schools that they need,
the essentials?
And yeah, guess what,
Friday night football,
the band,
all those things like that,
keeping the lights on.
But this is the taxpayers saying,
well, the legislators aren't doing
their constitutional duty of fully funding
local public schools.
I guess it's on us.
That's a whole other issue that I know people are saying.
It's like, well, it shouldn't be that way.
You're right.
It shouldn't be that way.
But here's the one thing I pointed this,
those you need to look at.
You know, it might be down a little bit,
as you said,
compared to 77%.
But the reality here is,
is that this tells a story.
What this story is that's being told,
is is the incredible support for public education
that is out there.
So when you hear people talking about,
oh, public schools,
no, nonsense.
Don't fall for that crap.
When you have 75 upwards,
80% of the taxpayers voting to tax themselves,
more, this is their support for public schools.
So trying to vote against public schools,
and people are like,
how do you house?
Can you triangulate that, Tim?
Yes, I can triangulate that.
Because in Kentucky,
where they put vouchers to a ballot,
guess what?
In Kentucky, almost every vote in this election
went red, Republican.
But when it came to vouchers in Kentucky,
it was defeated in a red state.
Why?
That's because local people, taxpayers,
support their public schools.
And this is kind of that, you know,
this is a statement.
So Jimmy,
you may point out that it's a little bit lower
than it's been in the past for presidential elections.
I point this out as a huge win for public education
because it demonstrates without a doubt the commitment
and the love of everybody's local public schools.
If you have that love,
608-557-857-7,
608-557-857-7,
that's the busted pencils mail bag.
Let us know, you know,
if you voted for in favor of the referendum,
why did you do it?
Let us know.
If you voted against it,
we want to hear from you too.
Make sure you give us a call.
That number 608-557-857-7,
it's busted pencils,
fully let it education talk.
It's first downs in Friday night lights.
We've got our special guest, Coach Kay.
All right, Coach,
what about though all this other stuff going on here?
Football seasons,
kind of winding down, play officer here,
moving into.
So update from the grid iron.
What's happening in high school football?
High school football is on to the state semi-finals
and 11 player in the state championship and eight player.
So we are down to the final 30 teams playing
in the state championship of November 15th,
Friday, November 15th.
And then the state championships are being held in
Camp Randall Stadium the week before Thanksgiving,
which will eliminate the final seven teams to crown seven
state champions and 11 player.
Part of all of this this year,
for the first time in football is the performance factor.
So you're seeing some teams that have had recent success play
up divisions.
And there's been a mixed bag of success within that,
some of those schools,
even upper division are still going.
And a few have also fallen off.
So this has been kind of the first year of that.
And I think one of the big arguments against
the tournament performance factor.
And then you see them more in other sports than football.
Because football has seven divisions.
So moving up a division isn't quite as drastic as a sport like
cross country where there's only three divisions.
And there you're seeing schools that have had success in division three,
the smaller schools,
all of a sudden you're asking a school with an enrollment of,
you know, 190,
they run in division two,
well, another facing schools that are, you know,
close to a thousand enrollment.
And it's those sports where there's been a lot of resistance
to this performance factor model.
It didn't stop obviously individuals in those sports
from still competing and still doing well.
But, you know, for team sports when you're,
when you're moving teams up and down,
where there are fewer divisions,
they're seeing a little bit more impact there.
I mean, let me take a bite at this though, Jim.
Just in case before we get a little bit further,
this performance factor, what I think I hear you saying
is is that if I'm a, you know,
smaller school,
and my team is really, really good,
then I can get bumped up to a division above me
because I'm too good to be playing in the division of my,
so from division three to division two,
and they're saying because we're that much better,
we should be competing with bigger schools.
Is that the concept?
Yeah, the concept is over the course of three years,
if you make it to sectionals or state enough times,
you accumulate enough points to move up a division.
And this was, I don't want to call it a compromise,
but this is where membership in the WIA arrived
and trying to figure out a way to balance the field.
And I think a lot of this was driven by the fact
that private schools have been dominating small school championships,
you know, in recent years.
We saw it in volleyball this year.
We're seven to the 10,
I think, in the state finals, we're private schools.
So, you know, that's been really the driver of it,
but where it's really affected has been the small,
rural schools that you might get that wave of student athletes
that are really good,
and you get them for a couple of years while they bump you up,
and then when they leave,
it's those students now that got a deal with it
and playing those larger divisions.
And then obviously it's more challenging.
But that's been really the big debate in the playoffs this year.
I hasn't been so much other things that,
and obviously computer seating have been the two biggest things
talked about this year.
But since we're down to just football,
the computer seating was kind of the big talk there.
And I'd like to think that teams have figured that out,
but you see some teams that are still playing
that were vastly underseeded by the computers.
You have an eight seed playing in a state semifinal division six,
which is pretty crazy.
So there's, you know,
there's a big debate on the computer seating too,
and not just in football.
Okay, so computer seating, that is not seating.
I was like, wait a minute.
Computers are telling you where you have to sit at the Friday night football game.
Not yet.
Not yet.
Computer seating.
In some other words,
throwing in all of the participants in the playoffs
into some form of a computer algorithmic calculation
that then supposedly spits out the brackets
in the most, you know, unbiased objective computerized way.
And guess what?
You know what?
It's not perfect.
And it's not clear.
And anybody who knows that too,
who's been on part of the Twitter X as we call it here,
which is Twitter X algorithms.
Yeah, guess what?
You can manipulate him.
So I think in these times,
a little aside right there, Jimmy.
Okay, but so you're talking about football.
You made a comment though to regular roster 11.
Is there, are there playoffs for 18 football?
And how does that work or not?
Or is that a different,
different beast all all together?
Sure.
So 11 player football and eight player football are treated as separate sports.
And Wisconsin,
as they are in many schools that offer reduced player football.
A player football was first offered here about 10 years ago.
It wasn't sanctioned as a championship for sport until a few years ago.
But it has become very,
very popular,
and especially in the last few years where it's exploded in growth.
What's limiting it right now is that there are two things
that kind of cap participation in the playoffs.
One is that you have to have a three year enrollment average of 200
or under in your high school to be eligible for the playoffs.
So for schools that are little over 200,
but have, you know,
that are kind of toying with this idea.
If you dropped eight,
you're no longer eligible for the playoffs.
And the other fact of the limits this is that even with this many teams in it,
I think we're pushing 70 now.
There's still only 16 teams that get the playoff.
So it's a much more exclusive field.
There was a team with two losses this year that didn't make the playoffs.
Because again, only 16 teams get in to the postseason in eight player.
So there's push to expand the playoffs there.
Whereas you look at 11 player football,
you have 224 playoff teams.
And there's, I think we're down to about 358-ish teams
that are still competing in 11.
So the playoff field is much more easier to access,
where you could have go three and six and be in the playoffs.
But if you go six and two in a player,
you're left out.
So there's a couple of things kind of limiting that growth.
But the reality is a team is that with declining enrollment in small schools,
I mean, eight players going to be the way.
Because there's just not enough participants.
Yeah.
Participation to support 11 and a lot of these schools anymore.
I think the general rule thumb is if you can't have a JV team in 11,
you should be playing eight.
Absolutely.
We agreed to that too.
And I said, thank you so much for sharing with me to the eight player football
because I hadn't hadn't even heard of it.
And it makes perfect sense that you're talking about smaller schools.
But now coming into the playoffs.
So before we'll, we know who's the champions before Thanksgiving,
after Thanksgiving, how long does it take now to get us to the crowning games?
So the Thursday before Thanksgiving is divisions seven through four.
And then the Friday before Thanksgiving is divisions three through one.
So we will know from from on November 22nd,
all seven 11 player state champions.
The eight player state champions are crowned on November 16th.
They play that in Wisconsin Rapids.
There's two teams playing in that.
And then these 11 player finals are held the following Thursday and Friday.
Okay.
So there you go.
Friday night football people,
you got the breakdown.
If you're in the playoffs, congratulations.
You know, if you're not,
there's always next year looking forward to it.
But you know, this is also the transition time because I remember, you know,
I played football and I was a a wrestler.
And at this time too,
actually by the time I was a junior,
I hadn't gotten much taller.
I had decided football was out.
Little did I know that meant that I could start wrestling practice earlier, though,
because wrestling is a winter sport still still the deal today.
Yep.
So in Wisconsin this week was the start of girls basketball practices.
And on Monday, boys basketball and wrestling get underway.
Wrestling is also a boys and girls sport now in Wisconsin.
As girls wrestling has really taken off.
It's tripled.
It's participation in just a few years.
And it'll be, it'll have a team wrestling state championship here in 2027.
Right now they have individual.
So you've got a lot of winter offerings that have either gotten underway this week
or will good underway next week.
Hockey also begins here in short order.
So you've got winter sports coming up.
And what's funny is you mentioned that fall to winter transition.
Some of these schools that go deep in the fall and football, for example,
well, those wrestling and basketball practices,
which goes back a couple of weeks.
So that's a that's always a fun challenge.
We had that in my high school.
Our football team would always be playing deep in November.
So we tell our basketball coach, okay, we love you.
We'd love to start practice.
But we really hope we don't have to practice until later November,
because we want to learn something good football.
Yeah.
And that's always been that.
And so, you know, if you're a multiple team player,
you recognize this, especially if you're cutting across seasons like that and how that works.
But lots going on, again, a, you know, teams out there enjoying this,
you know, coming out of the fall, getting ready for Thanksgiving,
celebrating that, making that transition also to winter sports,
wrestling.
And just think about this too.
If you're out there, I want to do more conversations with the explosion of the girls' female wrestling.
In fact, we'll put it out there now.
If you're listening to 608-557-8577,
give Coach K. Me or Jess a call.
Let us know if you'd like to come on,
and I want to ask the principals to talk about wrestling.
Jimmy, jump in there.
So I want to say the, the growth is so big in girls' wrestling that in my district,
locally in my district, we have this year,
and this is, we have a wrestling program that last year, boys and girls,
combined had 11 wrestlers, right?
We have 12 girls, just girls coming out for wrestling for the first time this year for high school wrestling,
to the point that the district had to hire another coach,
just to handle this influx of girls.
And we're not the only ones.
The sport has, you know, as an alternative to basketball and a lot of small districts,
because a lot of districts offer typically for girls in the winter.
You have basketball, and that's pretty much it.
At some schools, if you're close enough to a bigger city, you might get a hockey co-op, right?
And that's an expensive sport.
Yeah.
So wrestling is now kind of taking, feeling kind of a void, if you will, of an alternate girl's sport.
And we're seeing it in smaller schools where that is exploded in growth,
because you have a team component to it,
but there's also that individual part of it.
And having a standalone championship for girls,
where, you know, for the first couple of years of individual,
sometimes you could enter your weight bracket,
and you'd be in sectionals by virtue of not being enough competitors.
Well, that ain't the case anymore, because there are a lot of girls wrestling.
And I'm just saying anecdotally, just speaking from where I'm at,
having our district at 12 first-time wrestlers is pretty crazy,
but it's also not unheard of now, as we're hearing other schools are now
fielding their own girls, only teams, girls, only events in wrestling around the state.
It is amazing.
Oh, man.
It's first downs Friday night lights, special guests, Coach Cage,
Jimmy Cusca, and Jess, man, always loving this.
But, you know what?
Now, it's time for your moment of zin.
History can untie our minds, our bodies, our disposition to move,
to engage life rather than contemplating it as an outsider.
Thanks again for listening.
First downs Friday nights every Friday.
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Now, it's time for your moment of zin.
Now, it's time for your moment of zin.
Now, it's time for your moment of zin.
Still, so, contemplating.
You