is busted pencils fully let it education talk here are your hosts doctor Tim
Slecker and Dr. Johnny Lupinacci educated educators talking education
there it is busted pencils fully let it education talk educated educators talking education
Wednesday night yes we are still live from the state street studio in Madison
no not Johnny tonight yes we told you we gave Johnny three days off so we're letting him
have three days off but it's me and Jess again yes Jess how are you Jess I'm a little tired
we have been working haven't we yeah yeah yes we have yeah what's the you know the WPEN
Wisconsin public education network their 10-year summit here in Madison last night all day
today got there early in the morning I actually yeah I had to have a cup of coffee in here you
heard like six cups of coffee to know this I'm a little concerned this could be a problem later
tonight when I'm like why can't I sleep well I tell you what though just it was great though last
night getting to take you and Aaron to the Monoc we're brewery tap room in Madison yes you know
because the best thing busted pencils is sponsored by the Monoc we're brewing company tap room
with Monoc we're brewing company they are awesome public school supporters they sued the state
of Wisconsin to try to end the voucher program they are making Wisconsin great again one beer at a
time check out Monoc we're brewing company dot com you can get their beer their swag everything
there and Kirk thank you for hosting Jess Aaron and me last night and Jess you got to see me have
you know partake in a rare thing which was I had a half a I had a half a beer you you had a full
beer yeah yeah I don't know if you noticed I left about a quarter yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
sure yeah yeah but it's busted pencils it's fully let's go beer though it is good beer it's a great
place and we love that they are our sponsor for the show eight five five seven five two four eight
four two is the number if you would like to give us a call jump in on the show so Johnny's not here
we're at the Wisconsin public education network we're at the summit we're talking to all kind of
people and we run into an old friend he's been on the show probably about five or six years ago
but welcome back to busted pencils bird zipper bird what's happening my friend it's good to see
you it's good to be here we appreciate you man that's a verse that event is awesome it was great
it was fabulous it was hopeful it was informative it was dynamic yeah the whole idea you know
10 years though too I didn't realize that the Wisconsin public education network had been in operation
all that time great sessions lots of great speakers your thought though you know just
right away you know any quick standout you know just their focus their focus is if you support
public education then you got to fund it yeah and you got to fund it fully and no kid who's ever
educated without enough money to be invested in that good education good public education so I'm
going to put you on the spot yeah so one of the things we've been doing you know lately since the
Harris change of which we've all acknowledged is so exciting and makes us feel empowered you know
we're talking from public education voters though this decision to go for a vice presidential pick
and the question of if you're a public education voter is there a vice presidential potential
nominee that makes more sense or are there ones that don't and you yeah your thoughts you know I
don't have the names okay but I think that's a critical question you know governors for example
that have supported voters and has supported some diverting public education dollars to the
private schools I would have I would okay feel bad about that so yeah so what we've been saying
on busted pencils so you know the short list we keep hearing is Bashir waltz and Shapiro is
Bashir still on that list I thought he was still on the list I know it's getting pretty narrow now
down to kind of like Shapiro waltz it seems like that they're the top two I don't know just maybe
here we'll do the the first thing look that up for me just and see if you okay no no no but
Shapiro the governor from Pennsylvania my original home state he is a voucher supporter and we've
been saying I think that should take him out of the consideration why would you want to alienate
public education voters exactly okay when especially when you've got other choices that are
yeah because and we keep hearing this though too that the but but Shapiro brings you know
Pennsylvania massive electoral votes and can you public education people maybe look the other way
we they always say that don't they I know right you know it's and and I think there's some good
research that says vice presidential candidates do not necessarily bring their home states
right but a good vice president candidate can win over various people and I think this is important
yeah because we we've been saying it's just like well especially when you think now too if it's
really coming down to waltz what a great vice presidential pick because here you get fourth grade
teacher rural Minnesota union leader you know sharp not weird not weird and then let's let's go
back to another historical period Obama's education secretary disaster yeah right and people are
like does it Matt well so now that's the other twist though because we had a caller call in and say
Tim Jess Johnny maybe you guys shouldn't worry so much about the vice president and who is the
Harris campaign looking at for secretary of education and if we knew that would that change our
mind and saying okay the vice president pick doesn't matter because we know this is the secretary
of education your thoughts on that calculus and I think who you pick for your first pick
sends a message about who your next picks will be hmm so I think um what's okay to buy you
what what what what is possible for you to support and and I think you want your first pick to be
good I do too and and to keep the excitement going oh yeah you know and I said so we're we're at
the 10 year summit of of all of the you know the entire state of Wisconsin every public education
supporter there and I got to see say that you know if that group found out or heard during today
that Shapiro was going to be the vice presidential nominee I got to think that that group will be
very disappointed today well you know and I think the excitement and and the dynamism the 10,000
people at yesterday's rally for example for vice president Harris you know you don't want to take
air out of that movement you've got 98 more days to go and you'd take the air out of the movement
with a pro voucher supporter 855 7524842 is the number if you want to jump in give us a call
the guest Madison teachers incorporated retired retired retired teacher school counselor school
counselor but were a classroom teacher too um worked in the classrooms with teachers like okay
you know how many years 30 years 30 years yeah although we sat around the other night asking who
had the most seniority well last night at the event and I was clearly out of the running because
there was like 43 years and 37 years and 38 years that made you feel good I feel like I should go
back and do the book 12 more years well you're like okay I'm not as old as I feel there are people
older than me that might be true it is it's frightening that you just said that though too with
the 30 years because I I don't feel like I've been in this business for 33 years but I have my
first teaching job was in 1990 and you keep running the students who were like yes in the 40s
wait a minute you know because I'm like I that was yesterday truly that was last month
yeah I think I think time is a percentage of our life yeah so in the first five years of
our life a year is 20% of your life we're today it's like one so yeah we we are there oh check
this out though two got a new number 608 610 1126 608 610 1126 if you're out there trying to call
try that number you will definitely get in on that number sorry for giving out you know we're moving
studios we said this is civic media one of the ways you can avoid the part of this so to download
the civic media app bird I don't know if you did it although I gotta say I'm not sure your phone
does apps the flip phone doesn't do apps as well you you are correct but everybody else can do it okay
but yeah check it download the civic media app that way you can always have busted pencils we
always point this out to our listeners in Finland if they didn't have the busted pencils app they
couldn't or the civic media app they couldn't listen yes but we have two listeners in Finland I
love that and and I've always admired your education approach because I think we have to be
relentless and dedicated and courageous in defending public education it's the basis of democracy it's
our democracy and you say you know I've been thinking about this right the all these talks about
indoctrination you know and and it's just like okay indoctrinated you into the bill of rights
and yeah it's like wait so if we're going to indoctrinate you in democracy you got a problem with
that exactly exactly like like really you got a problem with democracy indoctrination
yeah that's what we try to do here though it is you know busted pencils fully let it education
talk educated educators talking education and mostly you know bird we're trying to get the message
out to my neighbor my neighbor who actually does like public schools but here's the misinformation
here's the disinformation gets confused votes for policies that they didn't know was going to
actually undermine their public schools because so much of the rhetoric comes across as it starts
to sound like common sense you know failing schools well they must not be talking about my failing
school so they're talking about the school down there so we've said we always are trying to bring
this to you know yes we know teachers we know public school supporters love busted pencils
what I want to do though too is get that person out there right now who's driving home and going
like wait a minute I think with Bert and Tim we're talking about that makes sense to me I love
democracy exactly and the idea that every single person in this country has the right to enter a
public school to be a student in a full full complete education think you know it's just like damn
why is this radical to say that every child deserves and in fact should be entitled to
not just an adequate education in fact that was one of the words that was used today we're going
to talk about that you know again the Wisconsin Public Education Network 10-year summit
bird zipper or Jess was there Tim was there hanging out talking all kinds of great people
lots of great sessions we're going to talk about some of those sessions 608 610 1126 is the number
if you want to call in them get on the show hey also if you're following us on Facebook right now
you can see you can see probably two of the most incredibly awesome looking guys that you've
probably ever seen on you're following on X you can see us on the the civic media X account
and YouTube yes right there you don't have to call you could text in your question if you're one
of those people this is I don't like to hear my voice on the radio it is kind of weird I took
me a while to get used to hearing what the heck is happening our guests are right now bird zipper
Madison teachers incorporated retired talking about what happened today at the Wisconsin Public
Education Network conference public education supporters all over busted pencils fully
let it education talk when we get back bird got a question for you okay I'll try to have an answer
yeah I'm gonna I'm gonna try to stump you so stay tuned for more bird zipper
I you guys love busted pencils music how about that bird you know if you can say you know
we're trying to bring it man you know you got it hey I like mpr but you know what that's not
what we are we are busted pencils fully let it education talk we are educated educators talking
education and we are absolutely you know indoctrinators of democracy that's right here and civic rights
and bill of rights and other things I just think about that it's like you know yeah we talked about
that it's like if you're against democracy okay then maybe you do have a beef with us I you
know I'll give you that but do you really want me to stop advocating democracy like that fair
discussion of ideas and voting and things like that it's crazy there's an insanity there that I
think just kind of takes us away from what we're supposed to be doing it is busted pencils and we are
here with our guest bird zipper our Jess and Tim all three of us we have been at the Wisconsin
public education network 10 years summit attending sessions Jess yes you were at a session right
away this morning what do you think what was it about give us your take okay so the first session
that I went to today was on equity and excellence and this is something that we got into yesterday
when we had dr. Joe gothard on we posed this question to him like is there potentially sort of
this conflict between equity and excellence because it doesn't seem like there should be
and a lot of people um certain ends of a spectrum leaning maybe towards the right sometimes
we'll be like oh yeah equity that's that's great no but what about test scores what about what
kids learning their their common core curriculum and it's like well you can do all of that you can
do all of that and this presentation was so much about how you can find the gifts that each child
has it's not that some students are gifted and talented and other students have no gifts and no
talents every child has gifts and talents and finding that gift finding that talent fostering it
nurturing it and helping it bloom and what I really loved one of the presenters is an astronaut
no like an astronaut I mean she hasn't been to the international space station but she did fly
in zero G nice with a science experiment that was designed with her class we actually got an
interview with her that will be airing either on Friday or on Monday nice super super exciting and
just it was really good energy just to to sit and talk about every child's excellence and on the
other end of the spectrum Tim I hear that your first session that you went to was not about excellence
it was not about excellence bird was your Wisconsin state reading association was talking about
science of reading science of reading and I got to say I'm going to hold this because we got some
great guests are going to come on and do a whole show but yeah and we you know we've busted pencils
we have taken this on multiple times you know this quote science of reading first of all it's not
science the science of reading is a marketing scheme right and it truly is a push to buy materials
that are quote aligned with the science of reading and there's been a lot of kind of this going
it's like well what can you teach what can't you teach when it comes to the teaching of reading
I've always been in the camp that I do whatever it takes to help that kid learn to read yes
if that's letter recognition then we're going to do letter recognition if that's jumping into a book
already because they're coming in reading already they're getting a book I as the teacher make that
determination with the professional knowledge that I have so that that's kind of that's science
so you know here in Wisconsin though act 20 is what it's called which is this mandate which we see
going across all of the states in the country in my home state now where I'm at in Ohio truly a
draconian effort on the science of reading I got to say the one bright spot here in Wisconsin that
I found out was that there is a little bit of leeway in act 20 to not use every prescribed
curriculum only did they give you a warning before they send you straight to jail yeah you get a
little bit of a warning based and I was I stood up in in my session and said I'm like you guys
got to understand I mean this is horrendous but let me tell you how horrendous it is in was in
in Ohio if you are not using state approved curriculum you can lose your teaching license
no kidding seriously wow I mean and and that is is like the you know that's the insanity
LA Thompson on the phone he sure is all right LA Tom what's happening my friend
say to him hey Tom are you are you on the air I'm sorry yeah yeah and what's happening you're
on the air too okay I apologize um first off we the people ultimately I would government
and we must never forget that just like there's just like that you know a union is democracy
in the workplace and we need to remember that absolutely again I just want to caution everybody
about whether it is Josh Shapiro or whoever um let's not demonize let's push because I was a
different and the thing is whether it is a Kamala Harris administration that vice president is
going to have to go along with what the president is saying it's her agenda it's not here
now I'm I'm the person that said Tim Walls would be very very good at the Department of
Education yes but again I think very very simply that we need it to be educating people each
and every day about the fact of how dangerous it is to vote for a third party in this country at the
time with project 2025 and we really need that discussion about this no LA Tom I mean when you're
you're talking about that it said the stakes so Burton this is the thing you're so high right it's
absolutely like would you know so does the vice presidential pick of Kamala Harris send you
to not vote and then potentially go well you know it's like then the other choices Donald Trump
exactly exactly you know so not voting is a vote for Donald Trump absolutely yeah and so I know
so LA Tom we love this so LA Tom is saying we want to push and so we've been saying well we're
trying to do here at the hair for the Harris campaign because we know they listen to busted pencils
all the time because if they want public education you know talk they're going to come to this show
because where else would you go we're saying okay we want to push the Harris campaign to consider
the possibility that maybe Josh Shapiro isn't the best choice given that you have a Tim Waltz exactly
and and I think anyway you go no it's you know or or an Andy Bashir right they're there a Mark Kelly
right I think too often we are we elect people and then we don't push them and then we look back
it's like well that didn't didn't go well so I think pushing from the beginning and of course
supporting you because fascism or or Harris right I mean that's the other part you're gonna say
okay wait the choice is oh my goodness that's a choice you know the choice is democracy
or not or not you know see it is busted pencils fully led at education talk the number 608
6101126 or special guests tonight bird zipper Madison teachers incorporated retired school
counselor talking Wisconsin public education network 10 year summit got a lot more to talk about
yeah can't wait in fact we're gonna come back and say Bert what was your favorite session
more when we get back
oh yeah you know it busted pencils Bart's got that look I love this right yeah busted pencils
fully let it education talk educated educators talking education sharing a lot of reflection
on the Wisconsin public education network 10 year summit you know the sessions we were at
jazz grade session so I talked about my favorite session and we say we got to come back
burp you know you you let a session but was that your favorite session or was there a session that
was that stood out I liked all three sessions including my own okay so we did a voucher one yeah
school finance one not the reality of school finance in Wisconsin and then we did our act 10
and the effects of act 10 in the current court case yeah and come on gotta have a favorite
you know I like them all okay I hate to say that I hate to say that yeah sorry you're not
weaseling out you're not gonna get weird on us tonight right now but there's one of those great
conferences where you know you didn't go to two count three workshops and two were good and one
was like disappointing none of them were disappointing no and I think when you you see something
like this like just when I were looking out you know getting ready for the conference planning
our our mode of attack and you're looking out there's this session there's this I want to go to
that one I want to go to that one I want to go to that I can't go to all of them right you know
because you like you said and and that again to the testament to the leadership of the Wisconsin
public education that worked to put together such an just exciting group of people to hear
that you truly had to go like okay if I go to this one I'm not going to hear this one great
and you got to make a decision but that's what it's like when you have a packed house of rock stars
well and the workshops were packed with people who were really thoughtful and we're asking great
questions yeah so it was good all the way around and the two plenary sessions were really special
um yeah what do you think of Jennifer Berkshire she's the the the education wars she was good yeah
she was good she was on that panel yeah with the two other people yeah and all three of them are
great they're awesome and have you had her on the radio Jess Jess got a spot interview with her right
chest and yep and I actually know Jennifer Berkshire for you know she actually has a really cool
podcast called um have you heard yes and you know not the the same as best the pencils we do a
little bit different but I mean she's a gifted writer um we got a spot interview but we did
also get a commitment from her that we're gonna have a full episode with her on the show especially
we talk about I mean the book the education where she really lays out what's at stake and people
you know I get this all the time he's going like is aren't you being over dramatic
destroying public education do you really think that that's what they're going to do and I'm like
yes yes yes no there's no over dramatizing you don't take out all the resources and just leave
this shelf a thing behind that's putters along and somehow provides minimal resources to people
yeah it's and it's foundation to society it's a sacred institution that is a foundation for a
democracy where everyone gets full access to a full education and we have a commitment to fund it
not just fund it but invest in it one the thing too is it's like so and we fully realize that it
hasn't been perfect right oh yeah oh yeah it has it has failed students and we hear from that
in in families and communities and but it still is the only one committed to right all children
everybody all children and you talk about that by constitutional fear yes and that truly is you
say yes academic achievement is the goal you know learning to read and write learning to do math
that is the goal of public education but more importantly at try to point out the people it's
that inclusive range where diverse peoples come together to learn to be in community with each
other in other words democracy and where else does that happen in our lives there is no other
institution that I can think of right except maybe the highway and then we're all in our separate
cars but where else is everybody together literally everybody right in fact it's the law it's the
law and and I think we have to reclaim the word right we have the right to a full complete public
education each and every one of us and and that's actually one of the ones so so I I went to a
session and you know and talk about that is is that this word adequate came up because constitutionally
and a lot of state constitutions Wisconsin is one of them that actually says that you know all
children are required entitled to an adequately funded education 1848 right you know and the
the kind of trick with adequate is is that if you ever ask the parent is your goal to get your
child an adequate education they're like no no it's a great education but when we take adequate
though and then you point out to people going we haven't even funded adequate yet
and so thinking about that and going so what is this constitutional guarantee towards an adequate
education we haven't met that yet and also something is not inadequate but sorry about that
you didn't you weren't ready for the bell bird no this is our democracy in
all right time this is where I warned them but I didn't tell them exactly one didn't don't
when it was coming just is democracy in action what do you got for us today's democracy in action
is unsurprisingly about the Wisconsin public education networks annual summit
today we have heard so much about diversity and we have heard so much about common good
I went around with a recorder and I kept asking people what's the purpose of public education
what's the purpose of public education and almost every single person said it's about the common
good it is about the right of every American whether they are a citizen or not to have a high
quality education and that public education is where we come together exactly what you
were just saying that this is a place where everyone with everything that they bring with them
every part of their identity every part of who they are comes together with a whole bunch of
other people as they are so the good that's right the core democratic values that we are highlighting
today are diversity and common good thank you democracy in action yeah every day but when you
hear that bell go off we do a democracy and that was a beautiful one Jess thank you thanks I thought
the blolo was especially good well you know I thought you did that better than most yeah the last
time I tried to do blolo it didn't actually that one sounded pretty good though I kind of think
how about that for some reason I say it's must the pencils fully lead in education talk it is not
blah blah blah it is educated educators talking education our guest bird zipperer Madison teachers
incorporated retired school counselor the number 608 610 1126 608 610 1126 you can call in if you're
watching us on facebook if you're watching us on x or truly come on let's call it twitter the way
it's supposed to be you can send us a text to text in your question text in your comment we want to
know public education one of the other sessions birth that I went to you know this is the other one
statistics damned lies statistics I can't well I can't remember the exact thing but you know
lies damned lies and school of school and yeah and you're sitting there going it's just like
whenever you hear or hear somebody saying but school choice works they typically bring with
them some kind of a bar graph that shows how awesome school valve my bar graph's bigger than your
bar you know and the session I was at to Chris sildanya he's been on the show multiple times he's
awesome you know great you know university Wisconsin Madison professor just kind of laid out and
said sorry when they bring out the bar graph it might be a statistic but it's a damned lie bingo
and so how you bring those together it's like wait they've got a bar graph it must be true no
statistics are statistics but they're not necessarily true and like you said I can kind of create
all kinds of statistics that look like they're trying to say something yeah but yeah when it comes
to you know does do vouchers improve academic achievement by the students that take them the
answers now after 35 plus years no they don't they don't right which is why though you hear
vouchers now too in their latest rendition the voucher supporters they don't even make the case
anymore that it's about a better education it's a parents right now they've changed it yep yeah
it's parents right because they don't have the statistics the damn lies to go anymore because
they're their lies it doesn't stop them from still trying to throw out there the lies that
school choice leads to a better education it doesn't but now though truly this whole idea going
it's a parents right and it's like well partially it is a parents right to insist that the
state live up to the constitutional amendment that says as we pointed out in Wisconsin and fully
funded adequate education that's your right that's a parents right you don't have the right to ask
me the taxpayer to give you tax money to send your child to a private school exactly you have the
right to send your child to a private school on your dime bingo why is that so hard for people to get
good question it's a really good I think you make people afraid fear and hate are kind of the
the two main ingredients here those are powerful factors they are I mean you're afraid for your
children in the school that you're hearing all these terrible things about and then we've
up some hate of those people that are those people absolutely you know and you say the fear
and truly you know the segregation but the session two points that out multiple times guess
what vouchers comes out of the brown versus board of education from people who said I'm not
sending my kids to school with those kids you know at that time those are African-American kids
absolutely you know the state's going to give me money to send my kids to a private school
suddenly the private academies yeah yeah and so people are going like no vouchers does not do not have
their history and roots in failed public schools they have their history and roots in segregation
and racism exactly sorry let's get that right 608 610 1126 is the number you want to challenge me
on that too you're always welcome to call in I know there's a couple of people out there gone
but kids in failing schools shouldn't have to stay in failing schools and I would say on that one
you're right so then let's fund their school fully fully so that we can at least fund them to the
adequacy levels that the state constitution guarantees in that right to a public education
bird exactly and and I think the adequate word is that it's not inadequate no no so was it inadequate
no okay no no and no and and and even that you know you really point this out as it crystal
down you love the way he kind of lays this out and going it's like guess what you know the state
legislature in Wisconsin has not lived up to the constitutional requirement it just haven't
and so when somebody says this theft failing public school is just to go okay it's a defunded
bingo public school that was put on the chopping block intentionally and in fact if we
quote had a failing public school why are we not directing resources at that school to quote pull
it out of failing I hate the whole word of failing but is it a challenge are do certain students
in certain populations in certain communities have challenges yes and guess what though no
one's ever going to address that issue because guess what the number one challenge is it's poverty
right and and when we have a failing highway we fix the highway yeah yeah but you know a bit poverty
you know well we don't want to fix poverty because if those kids learn to read and do math and
pull themselves up by the bootstraps they'll get out of poverty it's like you know what that's a nice
saying but it just doesn't work because anybody says you know when you say well what's happening
guess what sorry but when you give a kid food when you give them health care and you give them shelter
their academic achievement scores go up bingo holy crap who would have thought there's not an
achievement camp there's an opportunity it's an opportunity gap and you say yeah dr. Joe gothard
who's going to be the new superintendent here in Madison school district he just started he
and he reminded us that last night did again to hold true to realizing that look equity isn't just
some type of wishy washy thing but if we're really going to go after equity we're going to start to
address those opportunity gaps and I'm sorry you know so the state legislature isn't even funding
the academics the way it should be adequately but come on man it's busted pencils it's fully
letted education talk I cannot believe we're almost oh jeez whoa one more coming back 608 610
1126 hey you got one more chance be great to hear from you give us a call
we're doing it but the face inside is right but I need my skin
yeah there it is those seven dust schools out for summer a bird I don't know if you recognize that
song but that's a remake of Alice Cooper no way schools out for summer oh man this is how we
end every show those schools out for summer we come into this band called seven dust okay did this
obviously a metal version right can hear that you know but that's what we did that's the other part
of it when you're listening to busted pencils you get great education public education democracy
talk from educated education talk education but you get the best music around the best bumper
music just thank you so much for doing that all the time my joy and pleasure you're a genius you
are bringing that in my tanks educated educators talking education busted pencils fully letted
education talk the numbers 608 610 1126 our guest bird zipper Madison teachers incorporated
retired school counselor Jess Tim Bert all just spent the day at the Wisconsin public education
network 10 years summit all the educated educated educators there's a lot of education talking
going on there's a lot of people there there were yeah you know and you say it's like because
this was the entire state of Wisconsin you know and so I talked to a person you know maybe this
is what you take you know favorite person I talked to I talked to a person who first of all did
the well I'm just to stay at home mom and it's like stop it right there because what a ridiculous
thing my wife did no such thing as Josh no such thing but she's out in southwestern Wisconsin rural
kick a poo right and guess what she's doing she's rallying her neighbors to support the local public
schools and she made the trip to Madison to show that she's a public school supporter we're actually
just got her name got a number we're gonna have her on the show to come in and talk about saying
and we're first thing is is no you're not just the just no just nothing you are a public education
advocate and supporter which makes you a democracy warrior makes you a democracy warrior an
indoctrinated of democracy we were claiming that word I was thinking about it just before the show
I'm like okay is that pushing the boundaries to say that we are the indoctrinated of democracy
yeah sure about that you know why not you know one of the other things when Johnny my coast is on
broke we said that you know blue collar scholars yep we try to come at this and go like sorry
you know that's just who we are Johnny grew up in Detroit I grew up in Pittsburgh you know sorry
we're just blue collar scholars you know kind of just chopping it up saying what's going on
and we're public education foundation of democracy supporters and yeah if you if you're
quote against the indoctrination of democracy you might not like our show right but I'm not gonna
apologize for having a pro public education show because it's a pro democracy show sorry that's
what it is people are like you do a show like on like bulletin boards and stuff like that or
something the number of people today who are like oh you've got a you've got a radio show about
it like NPR and just like NPR and NPR and NPR listeners no disrespect no respect or just not them now
we're just not them and NPR you do great work the way you do we didn't need another NPR right we
needed busted pencils and Tim and Jess and bird and Johnny and the guest we've had Johnny be
back soon I mean we have had you know Matt Damon's mom regular appearance on the show did you know that
it wow and you know who she lived next door to Howard Zen I love that we've actually interviewed her
where she's really talked about that growing up and in fact how Matt Damon maybe you know through
something in the yard one time and got yelled at by Howard Zen I haven't heard that sorry I have
to tell you that one but but actually though she really talks very powerfully about you know growing
up you know with with Howard Zen being their next door neighbor and in fact you know just she
really loved that but back to the science of reading one of the reasons though we also you know
we have my segment every month with Matt Damon's mom what Matt Damon's mom say she came on last
month to talk about science of reading because this three queuing method which has been this is
and this is outlawed in Wisconsin so it's outlawed everywhere the idea that you might
Bert when I'm looking at a book in your reading words and you might not get that word I say
Bert look at the picture all right that's a cue that's right that's illegal now no pictures no
pit no no clues no no context no context allowed and no meaning no and and Dr. Nancy Carlson
Paige Matt Damon's mom was like like I was part of the original research that helped create
the three queuing method because guess what we give people multiple tools to learn to read and it
helps learn to read so this is the craziness where it's like like we've outlawed
we've outlawed a teacher's ability to say Bert look at the picture the science of making money
from reading it's like yes completely now who's gonna police that though too my teacher told me
to look at the picture today bomb oh let's get them written up we gotta get them on the science of
reading police this is ridiculous oh man 608 610 1126 is the number to call if you want to
join us they said our guest great guest to come in birds they were of Madison teachers incorporated
school counselor retired right now but Bert you know again really appreciate you coming into talk
it's really it's a delight to be with you today it was so good to see you too because I haven't
I hadn't seen you it's been a few years yeah you know and I said because yeah I you know for
listening going like yeah I used to live in Wisconsin you did some great work at a local
university here I was I was the dean of school of education at Edgewood College in Madison you know
and um not there now but um you did great work thank you really appreciate it and I got to meet
great people like you when I was here so when I ran into you at the conference I was like
yes oh my god it's Tim and then I'm like I read that first person the Tim pointed out to me by the way
we got there and I was like it was like and and and Jess I got to show because Bert I'm like I
got a producer yeah Tim kept showing me off I'm on real radio I'm like holy crap I got a real
producer I'm like remember how you used to call you and bug you to be on the show and then you know
like that I've got someone my job now and she's good and she's much better than me who used to
just call them bug people but I mean even that though too just pointing out civic media which is
now where busted pencils is you know and again for anybody listening out there yeah it is across
the entire state of Wisconsin wherever you can get a radio signal you can get it speaking of
that man Bert here it is check it out Bert I would tell you right now you want something to do
go to an aqua brewing company they are a huge sponsor of busted pencils love them I appreciate them
several of their beers in my refrigerator Bert Zipra Tim thank you so much thank you so much for
the joy of the pencils join us tomorrow we're on this together
you